Please rank these players . . .

[trojanfan12]

No. I don't need stats to know Harden and IT are terrible defensively. It is really easy to see watching games.

You have made a mockery of yourself on this thread and you don't even know it. I am done with this conversation though. Good luck.

This is why some fantasy league guys are so annoying. They watch stats, not games and think they know basketball.

 

[Yo Tee]

This is why some fantasy league guys are so annoying. They watch stats, not games and think they know basketball.

Never said I know basketball, just sharing my opinions.

 

[tlance]

Never said I know basketball, just sharing my opinions.

Well, FYI, you are arguing with people that do.

 

[Shanemansj13]

PG
Butler
3a IT
3b Kyrie

 

[Yo Tee]

Well, FYI, you are arguing with people that do.

Just because you "know" basketball, doesn't make my opinions wrong. We disagree, how bout you get over it. Is this the first time someone has disagreed with you or something? I'm using stats to backup my opinions, you're using stats to backup yours. You disagree with me, I disagree with you, yet only one of us here is slinging insults around. Best to just leave it alone at this point.

 

[SoCalWizFan]

Well, FYI, you are arguing with people that do.

This guy appears to have these type of debates on numerous forums here. Note his rules in his signature. No doubt he almost expects to get grief from others & pretty much is someone you would term as an instigator. He also almost always uses stats as the basis for his argument which is a very flawed approach in many cases.

In terms of IT & defense - it is a given & you can't just cover this up by getting other top defenders unless there is no cap & you also sign the 1st team all NBA defensive team to play alongside him which is ridiculous. We saw evidence of this numerous times in last year's playoffs. No rim defender is going to help IT when the opponents guard is scoring nonstop from the outside. Even if they assist it would result in other players getting open & making uncontested shots. The entire premise is kind of a joke.

Thomas is an all-star & a very good player but deserves to be on the bottom of that list. It may be a moot pt now due to his injury issues.

 

[Yo Tee]

This guy appears to have these type of debates on numerous forums here. Note his rules in his signature. No doubt he almost expects to get grief from others & pretty much is someone you would term as an instigator. He also almost always uses stats as the basis for his argument which is a very flawed approach in many cases.

I have those rules in place because there are many people that can't have civil debates/conversations. I expect debates back and forth and showing the person I'm debating with both sides of the argument. What I don't expect is rudeness, name-calling and being told I'm wrong or "I don't understand" or "Don't get it" because I'm not agreeing with someone. I give respect and I expect to get it in return. That's a common rule of life. You treat people how you want to be treated. If you respect me, I'll respect you. You get what you give in return. End of story and it's pretty fucking simple to understand.

I use statistics in debates when it's relevant. In this case, it was relevant to say that, while Harden doesn't have the defensive fundamentals that Butler has, they put up the same numbers on defense statistically per game, so I feel like I can pass over Jimmy Butler to get someone LIKE Harden. I also love how people are cherry picking ONE out of FOUR or FIVE guys that I've mentioned. I've mentioned DeAndre Jordan, no comments on that. I mentioned Hassan Whiteside, no comments on that. Rudy Gobert? Nothing. But yeah, keep the argument going over James Harden even AFTER I've told you my reasons. If you disagree, that's 100% fine, but respectfully disagree. I'm not asking for special treatment, I'm asking for mutual respect and if you can't give that to me then please don't talk to me because I WILL NOT be giving that respect to you.

 

[SoCalWizFan]

I have those rules in place because there are many people that can't have civil debates/conversations. I expect debates back and forth and showing the person I'm debating with both sides of the argument. What I don't expect is rudeness, name-calling and being told I'm wrong or "I don't understand" or "Don't get it" because I'm not agreeing with someone. I give respect and I expect to get it in return. That's a common rule of life. You treat people how you want to be treated. If you respect me, I'll respect you. You get what you give in return. End of story and it's pretty fucking simple to understand.

I use statistics in debates when it's relevant. In this case, it was relevant to say that, while Harden doesn't have the defensive fundamentals that Butler has, they put up the same numbers on defense statistically per game, so I feel like I can pass over Jimmy Butler to get someone LIKE Harden. I also love how people are cherry picking ONE out of FOUR or FIVE guys that I've mentioned. I've mentioned DeAndre Jordan, no comments on that. I mentioned Hassan Whiteside, no comments on that. Rudy Gobert? Nothing. But yeah, keep the argument going over James Harden even AFTER I've told you my reasons. If you disagree, that's 100% fine, but respectfully disagree. I'm not asking for special treatment, I'm asking for mutual respect and if you can't give that to me then please don't talk to me because I WILL NOT be giving that respect to you.

LOL - chill out dude. Again - you appear to come to these forums almost looking for an argument. Whatever. I couldn't care less if you give me respect here. This is an anonymous message board. I don't come in here looking for respect nor do I come here looking for an argument (unlike you).

Again - stats are one way of telling one part of the story - they are not the end all / be all & need to always be accompanied by the eye test & actual knowledge of the game.

 

[Yo Tee]

LOL - chill out dude. Again - you appear to come to these forums almost looking for an argument. Whatever. I couldn't care less if you give me respect here. This is an anonymous message board. I don't come in here looking for respect nor do I come here looking for an argument (unlike you).

Again - stats are one way of telling one part of the story - they are not the end all / be all & need to always be accompanied by the eye test & actual knowledge of the game.

I come looking for an argument? How? By giving my opinions on things? Get outta here dude. I come here like everyone else does to shoot the shit with other sports fans and it's douchebag pieces of shit who think they are superior to everyone else who come on here and start shit and tell everyone how it is and how they are right and everyone is an idiot for not thinking like them. Fact is, give respect, get respect. You give me shit, I give you shit. I give respect, no reason why I shouldn't get it in return.

 

[SoCalWizFan]

I come looking for an argument? How? By giving my opinions on things? Get outta here dude. I come here like everyone else does to shoot the shit with other sports fans and it's douchebag pieces of shit who think they are superior to everyone else who come on here and start shit and tell everyone how it is and how they are right and everyone is an idiot for not thinking like them. Fact is, give respect, get respect. You give me shit, I give you shit. I give respect, no reason why I shouldn't get it in return.

Whatever - you sure get riled up pretty easily. I don't consider myself superior to anyone nor do I believe that anyone else here fits that bill, but you are entitled to your opinion. Enjoy.

 

[Yo Tee]

Whatever - you sure get riled up pretty easily. I don't consider myself superior to anyone nor do I believe that anyone else here fits that bill, but you are entitled to your opinion. Enjoy.

Never singled you out as one of those people. And you're damn right I get riled up. I get riled up when I get disrespected for a simple thing as disagreeing with someone. Should be able to come on here, talk sports and not have to worry about some entitled prick telling me I'm wrong because I disagree with him.

 

[tlance]

Never singled you out as one of those people. And you're damn right I get riled up. I get riled up when I get disrespected for a simple thing as disagreeing with someone. Should be able to come on here, talk sports and not have to worry about some entitled prick telling me I'm wrong because I disagree with him.

You are perfectly entitled to your opinion. That is fine.

But, when your opinion is utterly ridiculous, just be prepared that others in this forum are not going to take you seriously. That is fact.

I could say that in my opinion, John Wall is the greatest basketball player who ever lived. However, if I did, the consequence would be that nobody would regard my opinion very highly.

So, you can choose to believe whatever you want. But, for me personally, when I am engaged in a conversation with somebody who knows more than I do about a given subject, I tend to do more listening than talking. I might actually learn something that way.

 

[tlance]

Great moments in James Harden defensive history - ESPN Video

I tried to embed this, but got a message that I could not embed this specific link.

What the link will show, is the very first thing that pops up when you google "James Harden defense". It is quite hilarious if you watch it. The other top items listed are either varying forms of these, or articles explaining why he might not be as completely terrible as his reputation dictates.

Still, @Terry Rode, you said on multiple occasions that Harden would be a player to target for his defense to pair him up with a guy like IT. You lumped him in with Gobert and D. Jordan and tried to defend it. At very best, Harden is a below average defensive player.

If you care so much about people respecting you, then my advice is to show some humility and admit you might be wrong. There are some opinions that are indefensible. Harden as a good defensive player is one of them.

 

[Vyle203]

Well, I see I've missed some fun...

Butler
George
Kyrie
Isaiah

 

[Yo Tee]

You are perfectly entitled to your opinion. That is fine.

But, when your opinion is utterly ridiculous, just be prepared that others in this forum are not going to take you seriously. That is fact.

I could say that in my opinion, John Wall is the greatest basketball player who ever lived. However, if I did, the consequence would be that nobody would regard my opinion very highly.

So, you can choose to believe whatever you want. But, for me personally, when I am engaged in a conversation with somebody who knows more than I do about a given subject, I tend to do more listening than talking. I might actually learn something that way.

There are respectable ways to disagree, maybe you should try that approach. And the bolded part is exactly what I'm talking about. Who declared you more knowledgeable about basketball than me? You don't know me and I don't know you, so to say that you know more about a subject than I do is ignorant. Just be respectful is all I'm asking. Don't assume you know more than me, don't think you are superior than me, don't talk down to me and don't insult me because I haven't done ANY of that to you.

 

[Yo Tee]

Great moments in James Harden defensive history - ESPN Video

I tried to embed this, but got a message that I could not embed this specific link.

What the link will show, is the very first thing that pops up when you google "James Harden defense". It is quite hilarious if you watch it. The other top items listed are either varying forms of these, or articles explaining why he might not be as completely terrible as his reputation dictates.

Still, @Terry Rode, you said on multiple occasions that Harden would be a player to target for his defense to pair him up with a guy like IT. You lumped him in with Gobert and D. Jordan and tried to defend it. At very best, Harden is a below average defensive player.

If you care so much about people respecting you, then my advice is to show some humility and admit you might be wrong. There are some opinions that are indefensible. Harden as a good defensive player is one of them.

I'm done with this back and forth because you obviously haven't read a single thing I've said. I never said Harden was a good defensive player. I have LITERALLY said that Butler had defensive fundamentals that Harden doesn't have but on a statistical level, per game averages between the two are even. Along with the fact that I can get Gobert, Jordan, Whiteside, Howard, other guys who are MUCH better at defense than anyone on that list or Harden.

 

[K.I.G.]

Give me....

George
Butler
Thomas
A garbage can
Kyrie

 

[ManuForever]

This is why some fantasy league guys are so annoying. They watch stats, not games and think they know basketball.

I like to think I know basketball...and I still blow at fantasy basketball.

 

[trojanfan12]

I like to think I know basketball...and I still blow at fantasy basketball.

lol Pretty sure that the more you know basketball, the worse you are at fantasy basketball.

Spoiler

Pretty sure that's gonna rustle a jimmy or 2 on here.

 

[tlance]

lol Pretty sure that the more you know basketball, the worse you are at fantasy basketball.

Spoiler

Pretty sure that's gonna rustle a jimmy or 2 on here.

Unless you are able to completely separate the two.

There are a lot of really good players who are mediocre in fantasy and a lot of mediocre real life players who are really good in fantasy.