Game Thread: Philadelphia Flyers at New York Rangers 3/26/14 | 8:00pm

[awaz]

I know you and I disagree on Hall's net value, awaz. I won't try to change your mind.

haha all i'm saying is while i was watching last night it seemed like hall had every even strength scoring chance the flyers had.. so to an extent, i guess i consider that playing well since he got the chances, but at the same time, he's no threat to finish those chances, we definitely agree on that!

(i was actually watching with my latest nhl conversion project last night, even he noticed hall in that light )

 

[lasgop8]

It's times like when the Flyers face a shutdown pairing such as Girardi/McDonagh that it's incredibly important that they're rolling more than one or two lines capable of putting the puck in the net.

We had three lines last night that are able to put the puck in the net on a conistant basis as we do every game. They did to us what we were supposed to do to them. Move our feet jump the man with the puck cut off time and space and create turnovers. How can any line score when we dont have the puck and when we do it gets stolen or deflected.

 

[JBM73]

We had three lines last night that are able to put the puck in the net on a conistant basis as we do every game. They did to us what we were supposed to do to them. Move our feet jump the man with the puck cut off time and space and create turnovers. How can any line score when we dont have the puck and when we do it gets stolen or deflected.

Agreed, but that was the case regardless of which defensive pairing was on the ice. I was referring specifically to the effect of the Girardi/McDonagh pairing which we were discussing. They can only be on the ice for 20-25 out of 60 minutes, which means they can only be paired against the Flyers 1 or 2 best lines. For a team to be successful against a pairing like that, they need to have the depth to roll 3 or preferably 4 lines that can score on any given night. The Flyers 2nd and 3rd lines have been incredibly streaky, good for stretches and awful for others, and the 4th line has been non-existent offensively. Come playoff time, every team has a couple of good forward lines and a couple of good defensive pairings. It's the teams with the strongest 3rd and 4th forward lines and 3rd defensive pairings (and solid goaltending, of course) that almost always separate from the also-rans as true Cup contenders. The Flyers do have 3 solid defensive pairings. IF the 2nd and 3rd lines can develop a little more consistency they're set there. The 4th line will be an achilles heel. No way come playoff time more than one of Hall or Rinaldo should be dressed on any given night. Ideally neither.

 

[JBM73]

(i was actually watching with my latest nhl conversion project last night, even he noticed hall in that light )

Nice. Working on a conversion project myself. Still in the very early stages, though.

 

[Cobiemonster]

Agreed, but that was the case regardless of which defensive pairing was on the ice. I was referring specifically to the effect of the Girardi/McDonagh pairing which we were discussing. They can only be on the ice for 20-25 out of 60 minutes, which means they can only be paired against the Flyers 1 or 2 best lines. For a team to be successful against a pairing like that, they need to have the depth to roll 3 or preferably 4 lines that can score on any given night. The Flyers 2nd and 3rd lines have been incredibly streaky, good for stretches and awful for others, and the 4th line has been non-existent offensively. Come playoff time, every team has a couple of good forward lines and a couple of good defensive pairings. It's the teams with the strongest 3rd and 4th forward lines and 3rd defensive pairings (and solid goaltending, of course) that almost always separate from the also-rans as true Cup contenders. The Flyers do have 3 solid defensive pairings. IF the 2nd and 3rd lines can develop a little more consistency they're set there. The 4th line will be an achilles heel. No way come playoff time more than one of Hall or Rinaldo should be dressed on any given night. Ideally neither.

People must be forgetting that the Flyers have a strong PK which Adam Hall has been a key part of - they're never going to scratch him for that reason alone - I do like Zac Rinaldo's energy but maybe Chris VandeVelde could still help them(although I have doubts, he never showed much offensively anyways)

 

[lasgop8]

Agreed, but that was the case regardless of which defensive pairing was on the ice. I was referring specifically to the effect of the Girardi/McDonagh pairing which we were discussing. They can only be on the ice for 20-25 out of 60 minutes, which means they can only be paired against the Flyers 1 or 2 best lines. For a team to be successful against a pairing like that, they need to have the depth to roll 3 or preferably 4 lines that can score on any given night. The Flyers 2nd and 3rd lines have been incredibly streaky, good for stretches and awful for others, and the 4th line has been non-existent offensively. Come playoff time, every team has a couple of good forward lines and a couple of good defensive pairings. It's the teams with the strongest 3rd and 4th forward lines and 3rd defensive pairings (and solid goaltending, of course) that almost always separate from the also-rans as true Cup contenders. The Flyers do have 3 solid defensive pairings. IF the 2nd and 3rd lines can develop a little more consistency they're set there. The 4th line will be an achilles heel. No way come playoff time more than one of Hall or Rinaldo should be dressed on any given night. Ideally neither.

I agree with this but this can be said about 85% of the league. I just wish we were in the 15% that i cant be said about.

 

[awaz]

Nice. Working on a conversion project myself. Still in the very early stages, though.

oh ya, gotta do our part to grow the game!

 

[JBM73]

People must be forgetting that the Flyers have a strong PK which Adam Hall has been a key part of - they're never going to scratch him for that reason alone - I do like Zac Rinaldo's energy but maybe Chris VandeVelde could still help them(although I have doubts, he never showed much offensively anyways)

I'm not forgetting it. awaz and I have debated Hall's merits a few times now. My feeling is simply that Hall's (and Rinaldo's) complete offensive ineptitude outweighs his defensive contributions. Come playoff time, you can maybe get by with ONE guy in the lineup like that, but two is a recipe for disaster. It's the timely goals by the 3rd and 4th lines that are often the difference in a playoff series. Having Hall and Rinaldo both on the 4th line effectively renders it a non-factor offensively, and that will weigh like an anchor for the Flyers in the playoffs.

Playoffs.

 

[JBM73]

I agree with this but this can be said about 85% of the league. I just wish we were in the 15% that i cant be said about.

But, it will likely be one of those 15% teams that win the cup.

 

[FlyerFinFan]

But, it will likely be one of those 15% teams that win the cup.

That is exactly why I like the idea of Raffl centering the 4th line it gives them a little more zip. Remember we're not expecting the 4th line to blow the doors off just keeping things neutral with a goal now and then would be fantastic. If they help out on special teams which they do even better.

Last night the rags got some depth goals but face it they were getting most of the bounces it happens and doesn't mean that the Flyers 3rd and 4th lines are now shit. Most nights I think they have an edge as the top 3 lines match up with anyone...they just didn't have a great night and 0 bounces unless it was off their own post!

For some reason the 3rd line plays better with Downie even though everyone was ragging on him. But at the same time give them some time to gell I think McGinn can get it done. Either way they must keep Raffl on the 4th line or its shit...I'd rather leave him there and bring up another winger for the 3rd if McGinn fails before the playoffs. I wonder if keeping Talbott would have been a better move now as he was adequate in a 4th line role which would have let them play Raffl on the 3rd....ah well its done.

 

[Cobiemonster]

That is exactly why I like the idea of Raffl centering the 4th line it gives them a little more zip. Remember we're not expecting the 4th line to blow the doors off just keeping things neutral with a goal now and then would be fantastic. If they help out on special teams which they do even better.

Last night the rags got some depth goals but face it they were getting most of the bounces it happens and doesn't mean that the Flyers 3rd and 4th lines are now shit. Most nights I think they have an edge as the top 3 lines match up with anyone...they just didn't have a great night and 0 bounces unless it was off their own post!

For some reason the 3rd line plays better with Downie even though everyone was ragging on him. But at the same time give them some time to gell I think McGinn can get it done. Either way they must keep Raffl on the 4th line or its shit...I'd rather leave him there and bring up another winger for the 3rd if McGinn fails before the playoffs. I wonder if keeping Talbott would have been a better move now as he was adequate in a 4th line role which would have let them play Raffl on the 3rd....ah well its done.

It was the right move trading Max Talbot - he still had 2 years left on his contract and they got out of that contract which was nice - Scott Laughton will be up next season and will play fourth line so they had to find some space for the future - and Steve Downie was a pending UFA so they could see what they had in him - if he played well they can re-sign him, if not they can just let him go and they have some flexibility - you'll see Michael Raffl on the 3rd line next season with Scott Laughton on the fourth line