Ok... it’s time to get serious about TWO certitudes regarding 49ers QBs

[Cyder]

Getting to the SB and losing is better than not getting to the SB.

By your logic the Detroit lions are better than the buffalo bills.

Dumb.

Your analogy is dumb, the Lions never made a Superbowl. The Niners, who under Montana won 4 Superbowls, were going up against much better competition in the NFC considering the Redskins and Giants both won multiple Superbowls and they had to deal with some good Bears teams as well. You can also make the argument the Niners had an advantage because there was little movement in free agency and were better able to keep their team together. Brady might be the best of all time, maybe he isn't, comparing different eras is dicey at best.
Personally, I think the best argument for GOAT revolves around Bill and his ability to keep turning over the team and win. Sure he has Brady which is an incredible help but Brady is the only real constant.

 

[SteelersPride]

I want him on the team too. There are some fans that want to trade him for draft picks but unless another team was willing to give a high pick I don't want to trade him. He is a really good backup to have

Yes sir

 

[dbldwn711]

Your analogy is dumb, the Lions never made a Superbowl. The Niners, who under Montana won 4 Superbowls, were going up against much better competition in the NFC considering the Redskins and Giants both won multiple Superbowls and they had to deal with some good Bears teams as well. You can also make the argument the Niners had an advantage because there was little movement in free agency and were better able to keep their team together. Brady might be the best of all time, maybe he isn't, comparing different eras is dicey at best.
Personally, I think the best argument for GOAT revolves around Bill and his ability to keep turning over the team and win. Sure he has Brady which is an incredible help but Brady is the only real constant.

Ok... so we are moving past the “lost 2 SBs argument”. At least that’s progress.

The salary cap and free agency are HUGE factors in determining the GOAT and why Brady is it over Montana. No question. But here’s the killer... when Brady was “stuck” on three for a while all we heard was 4>3. Now that’s it’s 6>4 it’s “oh that doesn’t matter.


It’s over Johnny

 

[Cyder]

Ok... so we are moving past the “lost 2 SBs argument”. At least that’s progress.

The salary cap and free agency are HUGE factors in determining the GOAT and why Brady is it over Montana. No question. But here’s the killer... when Brady was “stuck” on three for a while all we heard was 4>3. Now that’s it’s 6>4 it’s “oh that doesn’t matter.


It’s over Johnny

I'm not actually moving off the losing 2 part. The fact the Pats were big favorites and lost means IMP Brady takes a bit of a hit. As far as the "stuck" part, I never made that argument then and I wouldn't make it now. The salary cap and free agency dosen't IMO give Brady any more credit than he has, to me that goes to Bill. The competition also deals with the salary cap and free agency so the Pats aren't dealing with the quality teams the Niners dealt with so it goes both ways. Brady might be the greatest off all time, I always took his side in the Manning/Brady debates, but comparing the 2 across completely different era of football doesn't allow for a definitive answer. Brady got there more, Montana never lost, much less to an inferior team once he did get there.

 

[broncosmitty]

I was hoping this was really about Tim Brady and Pats fans thinking he's the greatest.




Sometimes you hope in one hand and shit in the other and you still get what you want.


Now if you'll excuse me...

 

[HaroldSeattle]

I never argued the financial side. SF had the money, the pool was pretty dry and other teams also knew NE had to let him go. No one knew he would get injured and sit out the entire year.

So if he has a decent to great year this season was it worth it? I'd say so. Minus the injury his signing hasn't hurt SF yet.

Just image if the 49ers used the 1.3 for Pat Mahomes instead of Solomon Thomas in the 2017 draft. Could of/ should of/ would have I guess. Always wondered why they didn't go QB with that pick.

 

[broncosmitty]

And the Lions are better than the Bills.


Ralph Wilson only created the Bills because he couldn't buy the Lions.

 

[Pattersonca65]

I'm not actually moving off the losing 2 part. The fact the Pats were big favorites and lost means IMP Brady takes a bit of a hit. As far as the "stuck" part, I never made that argument then and I wouldn't make it now. The salary cap and free agency dosen't IMO give Brady any more credit than he has, to me that goes to Bill. The competition also deals with the salary cap and free agency so the Pats aren't dealing with the quality teams the Niners dealt with so it goes both ways. Brady might be the greatest off all time, I always took his side in the Manning/Brady debates, but comparing the 2 across completely different era of football doesn't allow for a definitive answer. Brady got there more, Montana never lost, much less to an inferior team once he did get there.

That is why I don't bother with this. It is a very subjective analysis when different eras are crossed. For some reason it is often a Montana comparison but the league has been around since the 1920s. There are many very good QBs that played before the 1980s and it is hard to compare the passing game today to the passing game prior to the 1980s. Back then DBs were allowed to make contact beyond 5 yards. If the defensive game remained the same as the 1960s and 1970s we would nowhere near see the numbers we are seeing today.

 

[Cyder]

That is why I don't bother with this. It is a very subjective analysis when different eras are crossed. For some reason it is often a Montana comparison but the league has been around since the 1920s. There are many very good QBs that played before the 1980s and it is hard to compare the passing game today to the passing game prior to the 1980s. Back then DBs were allowed to make contact beyond 5 yards. If the defensive game remained the same as the 1960s and 1970s we would nowhere near see the numbers we are seeing today.

I agree. But I love the simply counting titles thing, as if Trent Dilfer and his one makes him better than Dan Marino or Dan Fouts. The way I usually look at it is "Is he in the argument" when it comes to the best few QB's of all time.

 

[huskers1217]

JImmy G was drafted into a system and didn't get good coaching when he was young. We have seen it before in Matt Cassell.

Even Tom Brady would have looked like Andy Dalton anywhere else.

 

[Jikkle]

Just image if the 49ers used the 1.3 for Pat Mahomes instead of Solomon Thomas in the 2017 draft. Could of/ should of/ would have I guess. Always wondered why they didn't go QB with that pick.

Shanahan's master plan was Kirk Cousins which is why they didn't pick a QB and just brought in Hoyer as a stopgap.

 

[HaroldSeattle]

Shanahan's master plan was Kirk Cousins which is why they didn't pick a QB and just brought in Hoyer as a stopgap.

Was it? Think they had enough cap space to make that happen. Sometimes just doing the obvious is the best plan ( draft your franchise QB).
Garoppolo may work out or not, we'll see. Think I'm letting certain posters who act like Garoppolo is a sure elite QB get me going.

 

[SteelersPride]

Was it? Think they had enough cap space to make that happen. Sometimes just doing the obvious is the best plan ( draft your franchise QB).
Garoppolo may work out or not, we'll see. Think I'm letting certain posters who act like Garoppolo is a sure elite QB get me going.

The one has expertly avoided this thread like the plague

 

[HaroldSeattle]

The one has expertly avoided this thread like the plague

Yeah that guy.

 

[SteelersPride]

Yeah that guy.

He knows what he saw

 

[NWPATSFAN]

Just image if the 49ers used the 1.3 for Pat Mahomes instead of Solomon Thomas in the 2017 draft. Could of/ should of/ would have I guess. Always wondered why they didn't go QB with that pick.

In their defense all draft picks are a crap shoot. Teams swing and miss all the time.

I'm sure they're kicking themselves for passing on Mahomes and signing Thomas. Even Chicago should be pissed off. Turbs is a nice QB but no Mahomes. Some guys excel and others never cut it. That's why counting on a draft is dangerous business. Compound that with questionable FO decision makers and Could of/ should of/ would have.

Mahomes is special. He has the ability to set all kinds of new records if he can stay healthy. As long as that organization doesn't screw it up.

 

[HaroldSeattle]

In their defense all draft picks are a crap shoot. Teams swing and miss all the time.

I'm sure they're kicking themselves for passing on Mahomes and signing Thomas. Even Chicago should be pissed off. Turbs is a nice QB but no Mahomes. Some guys excel and others never cut it. That's why counting on a draft is dangerous business. Compound that with questionable FO decision makers and Could of/ should of/ would have.

Mahomes is special. He has the ability to set all kinds of new records if he can stay healthy. As long as that organization doesn't screw it up.

Draft picks are a crap shoot, hoping a back up develops is a crap shot. One gives you cap relief, the other gives you a big hit to your cap space.

 

[NWPATSFAN]

Depending on the back up and their entire body of work, it should make the crap shoot odds lean in the favor of the team.

In this case SF didn't need cap relief. They needed help everywhere and they had enough cap $ to do it. So sure they may get some relief for 4 years before they offer say a Mahomes $ that's going to make Jimmy G's deal likely look like peanuts.

Did SF overpay for Jimmy
Do I personally care? it gave NE a 2nd rounder.

So SF had the $, took a chance, Jimmy got injured, so we still don't know what they have really? The money isn't the issue. The real argument is/was should they have drafted a QB, if so which one (pretty easy to say now) or get a Jimmy G and still pick the #1 rated DE coming out? Sucks for SF Solomon hasn't done shit. Then again SF has been BAD these past couple seasons? Maybe Solomon will surprise once they get healthy and some decent coaching

 

[PDay8810]

He knows what he saw

and everyone else is just dumb

 

[SteelersPride]

bingo

and everyone else is just dumb