Off Topic Lounge

[Darrell Green Fan]

It was a lot of words, but it conveys a pretty common sense principle. One of them is the fact that if your employer suspends you for a rule it's never enforced before and knows that everyone else has violated in the past, there's something awfully unfair about that. When that gets taken in front of a jury, they return some awfully large verdicts against employers for that. The concept is basic: if an employer doesn't an enforce a rule, it's not a rule in the first place.

Morning RSF. You say I keep repeating myself but there is a reason for that. You continue to fail to address my point.

You continue to post as if Brady was suspended only because he broke an obscure rule that others break. That's not the entire story. He was suspended for breaking the rule but more so for lying about it, failing to fully cooperate, and for his general dismissive behavior. That played a huge role in the size of the penalty and was cited when Goddell made the announcement.

 

[redskinsfan]

Morning RSF. You say I keep repeating myself but there is a reason for that. You continue to fail to address my point.

You continue to post as if Brady was suspended only because he broke an obscure rule that others break. That's not the entire story. He was suspended for breaking the rule but more so for lying about it, failing to fully cooperate, and for his general dismissive behavior. That played a huge role in the size of the penalty and was cited when Goddell made the announcement.

Morning to you, too. Yes, I understand that's the basis for the suspension as well. I've noted why that's not a basis for imposing the amount of the punishment. If it were up to me, based on what I know now, I'd either conclude that there was no violation and refer Brady's contumacy to the Commissioner for further review. Or, I'd conclude that Brady violated a rule, but issue at most a one-game penalty for his failure to cooperate.

Again, my point has always been that his four-game suspension was too long. The rule violation was at most technical (and had other flaws, which I've also discussed), and the obstruction didn't warrant the draconian penalty he was given. In addition to failure to cooperate, I think Brady got punished for his team's past misconduct. Whatever the merits of that misconduct (i.e., Spygate) may be, it's unfair to nail Brady, an individual, for that history if you can't say he was part of it, which, of course, he wasn't.

In the end, it's like this: your employer busts you for committing a minor rule violation that everyone else commits and suspends, and you act like a jerk when he's asking you questions about the violation. Your employer then suspends you for a month. That's what this amounts too. And it's clearly wrong.

 

[Darrell Green Fan]

Bottom line is had Tom Brady simply said after the Colts game "yes I instructed the equipment guys to let a bit of air out of the ball. I like them soft and did not feel as if I was doing anything wrong" he is not sitting on 4 games. Probably looking at a fine and that's it.

Had the Pats taken the same position instead of demanding an apology and trotting out a defense that would make Jay Paterno blush their penalty would have been much less as well. Kind of hard for me to feel sorry for either, they made this situation much much worse than it had to be.

 

[redskinsfan]

Bottom line is had Tom Brady simply said after the Colts game "yes I instructed the equipment guys to let a bit of air out of the ball. I like them soft and did not feel as if I was doing anything wrong" he is not sitting on 4 games. Probably looking at a fine and that's it.

Had the Pats taken the same position instead of demanding an apology and trotting out a defense that would make Jay Paterno blush their penalty would have been much less as well. Kind of hard for me to feel sorry for either, they made this situation much much worse than it had to be.

I completely agree with that. (Atlanta came clean immediately when faced with noise violation.) This blew up for no reason. While Brady and the Pats screwed this up on their end, the NFL should've been bigger and let it pass with a fine. However, that idiot Goodell made a mountain out of a molehill. The guy is a moron and keeps making himself and the NFL look like complete idiots. Now, he wants to hear the appeal. Unbelievable.

 

[Darrell Green Fan]

No arguments on Goodell, the worst commish I have ever seen in any sport. But even though I think the 2 draft picks was too high of a price for the team to pay I think he got the Brady penalty right. I said all along 2-4 games again mostly for lying and failure to cooperate. As is always the case the cover up is always punished harder than the crime.

As for the appeal process of course it's idiotic to have the same guy who administered the punishment hear the appeal. But this was the system Robert Kraft voted for when the new CBA was ratified. This was the same system that heard our salary cap appeal, who heard the New Orleans bountygate appeal and every other appeal. So again no sympathy from me when it's the Pats turn.

 

[Caliskinsfan]

Seastrunk cut to make more room on the roster for the Titans. Guessing his attitude hadn't changed.

 

[redskinsfan]

No arguments on Goodell, the worst commish I have ever seen in any sport. But even though I think the 2 draft picks was too high of a price for the team to pay I think he got the Brady penalty right. I said all along 2-4 games again mostly for lying and failure to cooperate. As is always the case the cover up is always punished harder than the crime.

As for the appeal process of course it's idiotic to have the same guy who administered the punishment hear the appeal. But this was the system Robert Kraft voted for when the new CBA was ratified. This was the same system that heard our salary cap appeal, who heard the New Orleans bountygate appeal and every other appeal. So again no sympathy from me when it's the Pats turn.

Like I said, I don't have a dog and/or an issue with the Pats penalty. But there's no way you can justify costing someone a quarter season-long suspension for not cooperating under Brady's circumstances. This is particularly true given the substance of the violation and the issues surrounding it, not the least of which is the fact that they shined on the the Colts deflated balls and that centers (e.g. Zak Deossie and Jamaal Jackson) talk about how they remembered feeling deflated / inflated balls by QBs and hyper-inflated balls by kickers all the time.

If this involved Christian Ponder, there wouldn't have been an investigation or, if there was one, they'd issue a slap on the wrist to Ponder. There are a lot of reasons I'm kicking around why they singled out Brady. But one thing I that's always been on my front burner is the fact that Brady sued the NFL in 2010 (over the lockout) and got a tidy settlement out of it. The NFL wasn't happy with players bucking the league and, as we all know, teams like the Redskins going against the grain of a clearly illegal edict by John Mara. Looks like the NFL got back at everyone that didn't toe the line.

 

[skinsdad62]

No arguments on Goodell, the worst commish I have ever seen in any sport. But even though I think the 2 draft picks was too high of a price for the team to pay I think he got the Brady penalty right. I said all along 2-4 games again mostly for lying and failure to cooperate. As is always the case the cover up is always punished harder than the crime.

As for the appeal process of course it's idiotic to have the same guy who administered the punishment hear the appeal. But this was the system Robert Kraft voted for when the new CBA was ratified. This was the same system that heard our salary cap appeal, who heard the New Orleans bountygate appeal and every other appeal. So again no sympathy from me when it's the Pats turn.

the players negotiated that system in the CBA so they are at fault for that . next one they will have to change

 

[skinsdad62]

Like I said, I don't have a dog and/or an issue with the Pats penalty. But there's no way you can justify costing someone a quarter season-long suspension for not cooperating under Brady's circumstances. This is particularly true given the substance of the violation and the issues surrounding it, not the least of which is the fact that they shined on the the Colts deflated balls and that centers (e.g. Zak Deossie and Jamaal Jackson) talk about how they remembered feeling deflated / inflated balls by QBs and hyper-inflated balls by kickers all the time.

If this involved Christian Ponder, there wouldn't have been an investigation or, if there was one, they'd issue a slap on the wrist to Ponder. There are a lot of reasons I'm kicking around why they singled out Brady. But one thing I that's always been on my front burner is the fact that Brady sued the NFL in 2010 (over the lockout) and got a tidy settlement out of it. The NFL wasn't happy with players bucking the league and, as we all know, teams like the Redskins going against the grain of a clearly illegal edict by John Mara. Looks like the NFL got back at everyone that didn't toe the line.

no way to know that . i doubt goodell has it in for his buddy kraft dont buy the CSI stuff

 

[redskinsfan]

no way to know that . i doubt goodell has it in for his buddy kraft dont buy the CSI stuff

It is pretty interesting how this all happened to Goodell's good buddy Kraft. Goodell supposedly spent the night at Kraft's house on night before a playoff game. How that happens is beyond me.

 

[Darrell Green Fan]

Again not sure why the penalties are surprising. This is Roger Goodell, the guy who gave Sean Payton an entire year under the pretense if he didn't know he should have. This is the same guy who has hammered AP and many many other players. Then he caught shit for being too easy on Ray Rice so you best believe the next guy to cross his path was hammer time.

Put that with the Pats history and again Brady lying to everyone's face as well as the failure to cooperate and yeah, 4 games is expected.

 

[redskinsfan]

Again not sure why the penalties are surprising. This is Roger Goodell, the guy who gave Sean Payton an entire year under the pretense if he didn't know he should have. This is the same guy who has hammered AP and many many other players. Then he caught shit for being too easy on Ray Rice so you best believe the next guy to cross his path was hammer time.

Put that with the Pats history and again Brady lying to everyone's face as well as the failure to cooperate and yeah, 4 games is expected.

I'm not saying I was surprised at the penalty. When Goodell didn't have the balls to stand up to John Mara and other owners regarding our illegal $36M cap penalty -- especially when we got it literally minutes before FA opened up -- nothing he does surprises me. But, I'll say it again, no way is Brady's suspension justified by what he did or didn't do. And I bet you're correct on the fact that his penalty was wrapped up in what the Pats did in the past, something which Brady wasn't connected to. That makes this all the more wrong.

 

[Caliskinsfan]

 

[Caliskinsfan]

I completely believe this.

 

[redskinsfan]

I completely believe this.

Absolutely. It's supposedly what happened when Snyder decided not to sue the NFL after that $36M cap penalty. That would've been quite a conceptually easy suit to win. But, as everyone knows by now, there's a bro code amongst the owners that you don't sue each other or make waves once a ruling has come down. The only one that's bucked this trend is Al Davis. And when he sued, he was absolutely right in doing so as the court ultimately agreed with him.

 

[Caliskinsfan]

 

[Caliskinsfan]

Interesting stat line on Olines around the league.

 

[Caliskinsfan]

LOL

 

[Caliskinsfan]

For those who think there might have been some behind the scenes give and take regarding the Pats stance to not pursue an appeal and TBs appeal... The answer seems to be 'no'.

I expected they were more likely separate issues but who really knows...

 

[Caliskinsfan]

Another interesting read from Andrew Brandt