Next Year's D

[JBM73]

Just for fun, let's look ahead to the offseason in terms of the D. Coburn, Streit, Grossmann and Schenn are all signed. Gus will be a RFA. MacDonald and Timonen will be UFAs, and it's very possible Timonen retires. On the farm, Lauridsen is probably the closest to being ready for NHL duty, but he won't fill a need as the Flyers are set in terms of defensive defensemen with Coburn, Grossmann and Schenn. Top UFA non-Flyer offensive/puck-moving d-men will probably be Andrei Markov (35), Matt Niskanen (27), Meszaros (28) and Nikita Nikitin (27). If you care about left vs. right handed shots, Schenn is the Flyers only Righty. Niskanen is also a Righty.

What do you want the Flyers to do, especially assuming Timonen retires?

Could this D get the job done?

MacDonald-Schenn
Coburn-Niskanen
Streit-Grossmann
Gustafsson

Talk about a collection of 3-4 d-men.

 

[lasgop8]

Just for fun, let's look ahead to the offseason in terms of the D. Coburn, Streit, Grossmann and Schenn are all signed. Gus will be a RFA. MacDonald and Timonen will be UFAs, and it's very possible Timonen retires. On the farm, Lauridsen is probably the closest to being ready for NHL duty, but he won't fill a need as the Flyers are set in terms of defensive defensemen with Coburn, Grossmann and Schenn. Top UFA non-Flyer offensive/puck-moving d-men will probably be Andrei Markov (35), Matt Niskanen (27), Meszaros (28) and Nikita Nikitin (27). If you care about left vs. right handed shots, Schenn is the Flyers only Righty. Niskanen is also a Righty.

What do you want the Flyers to do, especially assuming Timonen retires?

Could this D get the job done?

MacDonald-Schenn
Coburn-Niskanen
Streit-Grossmann
Gustafsson

Talk about a collection of 3-4 d-men.

I would like to give the good Laurd (get it) a shot at some point. At least if he shows he cant get the job done then we move on.

 

[flyersfan4706]

It's gonna be ugly. Real ugly.

I really don't want it, but a big trade is inevitable

 

[banditshcky11]

I'm not convinced it will be a big trade, I just don't think the type of Legit #1 D-man (Weber, Chara, Doughty, Keith) is out there right now for a price they're worth paying. Then again this deadline had really low trade value on players so maybe that trend will continue.

I could however see the Flyers going after Niskanen who is a ufa and has had a monster year for Pittsburgh and pretty much been their #1 all season and giving him a hefty contract if he isn't re-signed. I could also see them making a trade with Toronto for a guy like Franson who will be a rfa but will be demanding a big raise and if they're not able to pay it the trade price would more then likely be somewhat reasonable.

I'm sure that they're going to do something but I think Homer will be gone and Hextall will be in place by then and I can't really see him following in the footsteps of his predecessors and trading the future away for today. You have to remember Hexy was in LA for years and they were not a team to make those sorts of move and I'm hoping that's something he picked up because the biggest thing we need in a GM is patience.


The D that's listed wouldn't be the worst thing in the world (if they can get another puck mover during FA), they can all play 17-20 minutes a game easily without really over exerting any one pair. It's just balanced, kinda like the forward group.

 

[awaz]

I like Niskanen, but I worry about what he'll look like after he signs the contract he'll fetch this off-season. Still, like him better than the rest of the list.

I wouldn't rule out signing timonen if he wants to play again and is willing to take 4-5 mil. It's what the rest of them will garner, and at that rate he'd be a valuable addition. Nice little one year contract. That's if they don't plan on doing anything else to improve the d.

And I don't think the homer hate is warranted. I fully expect him to be back. No reason not to. I stand by his only mistake was the Bob/bryz thing, which came from snider, not homer.

 

[wbon22]

Niskanen is the most interesting of the UFA's, to me anyway.

Lauridsen is could be insurance against the trade of Grossmann, Coburn or Schenn.

I would not be against bringing back Timmonen for a short term deal...one year would be the ideal.

As for Homer, I have mixed feelings about his moves and period as GM. I would not mid seeing him back but not if it is going to be a repeat of Lavvy who should have been packed off before the draft.

 

[Cobiemonster]

Niskanen is the most interesting of the UFA's, to me anyway.

Lauridsen is could be insurance against the trade of Grossmann, Coburn or Schenn.

I would not be against bringing back Timmonen for a short term deal...one year would be the ideal.

As for Homer, I have mixed feelings about his moves and period as GM. I would not mid seeing him back but not if it is going to be a repeat of Lavvy who should have been packed off before the draft.

I bet one of Gross or Luke Schenn get moved in the offseason, so Ollie will step in due to his one way contract

 

[awaz]

I bet one of Gross or Luke Schenn get moved in the offseason, so Ollie will step in due to his one way contract

i dont really expect lauridsen to play for the flyers next year.. and in all honesty, if he does, the flyers will have missed the boat on what they were trying to do. i'm fine w/ lauridsen in spot duty, but right now, there's 8 dmen in the flyers system i'd take over him. more if ghost, morin, or hagg play professionally in the US next year (though i dont think that is likely for any of them)

in order of what i'd do on defense..

1. sign niskanen (sub 5 mil cap hit)
2. sign timonen (1 year contract, sub 5 mil cap hit)
3. trade (not a dumb one, chances of a good trade drive this down to 3rd place)
4. "stand pat" (sign gus to replace timonen in the top 6, sign macdonald)
5. bring up morin, trade grossmann or schenn (only if morin shows he's ready, not expected)
6. trade grossmann or schenn, bring up lauridsen

 

[Cobiemonster]

i dont really expect lauridsen to play for the flyers next year.. and in all honesty, if he does, the flyers will have missed the boat on what they were trying to do. i'm fine w/ lauridsen in spot duty, but right now, there's 8 dmen in the flyers system i'd take over him. more if ghost, morin, or hagg play professionally in the US next year (though i dont think that is likely for any of them)

in order of what i'd do on defense..

1. sign niskanen (sub 5 mil cap hit)
2. sign timonen (1 year contract, sub 5 mil cap hit)
3. trade (not a dumb one, chances of a good trade drive this down to 3rd place)
4. "stand pat" (sign gus to replace timonen in the top 6, sign macdonald)
5. bring up morin, trade grossmann or schenn (only if morin shows he's ready, not expected)
6. trade grossmann or schenn, bring up lauridsen

I don't want to get in a bidding war for Matt Niskanen though, that's dangerous - I like him a lot but I fear it's going to be a bidding war because so many teams are looking for defense

If the Flyers would start believing in Gus and just let him play every night they would know what they got in him, but they can't say they know what they have if they're not playing him every night

 

[JBM73]

i dont really expect lauridsen to play for the flyers next year.. and in all honesty, if he does, the flyers will have missed the boat on what they were trying to do. i'm fine w/ lauridsen in spot duty, but right now, there's 8 dmen in the flyers system i'd take over him. more if ghost, morin, or hagg play professionally in the US next year (though i dont think that is likely for any of them)

in order of what i'd do on defense..

1. sign niskanen (sub 5 mil cap hit)
2. sign timonen (1 year contract, sub 5 mil cap hit)
3. trade (not a dumb one, chances of a good trade drive this down to 3rd place)
4. "stand pat" (sign gus to replace timonen in the top 6, sign macdonald)
5. bring up morin, trade grossmann or schenn (only if morin shows he's ready, not expected)
6. trade grossmann or schenn, bring up lauridsen

Figuring that the Flyers can only afford 2 of Niskanen, Timonen and MacDonald, I think I'd take Niskanen and MacDonald over 1 more year of Timonen. I like Timonen, but from what I've seen this year he's lost his 1B/2 status, and really looks more like a true 3. At that level, I'm not sure he's much of an upgrade over MacDonald or Niskanen, and we risk even further deterioration of his skills next year. This assumes, of course, that the contracts for Niskanen and MacDonald are reasonable, and without the notorious NTC/NMC that Homer throws around like candy.

 

[JBM73]

i dont really expect lauridsen to play for the flyers next year.. and in all honesty, if he does, the flyers will have missed the boat on what they were trying to do.

With a one-way contract, wouldn't Lauridsen have to clear waivers in order to be sent down? It's unlikely he'd clear.

 

[awaz]

I don't want to get in a bidding war for Matt Niskanen though, that's dangerous - I like him a lot but I fear it's going to be a bidding war because so many teams are looking for defense

If the Flyers would start believing in Gus and just let him play every night they would know what they got in him, but they can't say they know what they have if they're not playing him every night

oh ya, definitely worried about what niskanen will get. probably the best UFA dman in a league starved for mobile puck-movers, i wouldn't be shocked at all if some poor team pays him 6 mil +. i just really hope that poor team isn't the flyers.

 

[awaz]

With a one-way contract, wouldn't Lauridsen have to clear waivers in order to be sent down? It's unlikely he'd clear.

1. i believe you are correct.
2. i dont think it's that unlikely that he'll clear. a 7th round draft pick with 15 NHL games to his name? i mean he looked fine in those 15 games, but he wasn't a difference maker and i highly doubt many people, outside of fans, expect him to be one.

 

[banditshcky11]

I really think Niskanen will get $4.5-5.5m a year in his next contract and if I'm the Flyers I would be willing to pay that in a second. I see Niskanen being a Keith Yandle type D-man albeit probably a little better defensively this will more then likely make him a #1 D-man for some teams. I also thing AMac will get about the somewhere in the same ballpark and if we could sign those 2 guys with Timonen either retiring or taking a severely discounted salary (ala Hossa in Detroit) we would be in pretty good shape. I also really think this draft will be very busy as far as trades go so there may be a deal to be made that upgrades our back end even more to compliment the depth we have up front. The biggest thing n ow is that the Flyers need to make sure that whoever they put back there makes a good first pass and is physically capable of not getting out muscled all the time but if we have 3 pairing that can all play 17-22 minutes a game that would probably go a long way to helping the D stay healthy and energized. Another guy who could be available depending on his contract demands and the cap issue could be Cody Franson & he's another guy I would target but he is a rfa not a ufa.


I keep hearing talk of Weber being available and that the Flyers are going to make a big push for him, I think that's not a smart move. The thing is Nashville believes that Weber is worth more the 4 1st round picks and while he is a franchise and easily top 5 D-man in the league the fact that they are struggling so severely and every team knows it I doubt they can get the kind of package that they want for him. If I was the Flyers GM (not saying who because I really feel Homer is getting relieved at the end of this season) and Nashville asked for anything more then the Schenn brothers I would hang up the phone and to be clear I'm a big fan of both Schenns (if they did ask for both Schenns I would have to think about it though). The thing is that Nashville is rebuilding so realistically I would offer something like Laughton, Read, Gustaffson & maybe a pick for Weber. That way we clear some cap space and send them some good young players and a proven NHL player who can play in all situations and F positions oh and he scores which is something Nashville is missing. If other teams want to go all out and give up a ton for Weber let them, we just don't have the same quality prospect pool and our depth at F is our biggest strength now.

 

[awaz]

Figuring that the Flyers can only afford 2 of Niskanen, Timonen and MacDonald, I think I'd take Niskanen and MacDonald over 1 more year of Timonen. I like Timonen, but from what I've seen this year he's lost his 1B/2 status, and really looks more like a true 3. At that level, I'm not sure he's much of an upgrade over MacDonald or Niskanen, and we risk even further deterioration of his skills next year. This assumes, of course, that the contracts for Niskanen and MacDonald are reasonable, and without the notorious NTC/NMC that Homer throws around like candy.

i agree w/ that.. assuming only 2 are signed, and the contracts are reasonable, i would prefer niskanen and macdonald. as much as i love timonen.

 

[awaz]

I really think Niskanen will get $4.5-5.5m a year in his next contract and if I'm the Flyers I would be willing to pay that in a second. I see Niskanen being a Keith Yandle type D-man albeit probably a little better defensively this will more then likely make him a #1 D-man for some teams. I also thing AMac will get about the somewhere in the same ballpark and if we could sign those 2 guys with Timonen either retiring or taking a severely discounted salary (ala Hossa in Detroit) we would be in pretty good shape. I also really think this draft will be very busy as far as trades go so there may be a deal to be made that upgrades our back end even more to compliment the depth we have up front. The biggest thing n ow is that the Flyers need to make sure that whoever they put back there makes a good first pass and is physically capable of not getting out muscled all the time but if we have 3 pairing that can all play 17-22 minutes a game that would probably go a long way to helping the D stay healthy and energized. Another guy who could be available depending on his contract demands and the cap issue could be Cody Franson & he's another guy I would target but he is a rfa not a ufa.


I keep hearing talk of Weber being available and that the Flyers are going to make a big push for him, I think that's not a smart move. The thing is Nashville believes that Weber is worth more the 4 1st round picks and while he is a franchise and easily top 5 D-man in the league the fact that they are struggling so severely and every team knows it I doubt they can get the kind of package that they want for him. If I was the Flyers GM (not saying who because I really feel Homer is getting relieved at the end of this season) and Nashville asked for anything more then the Schenn brothers I would hang up the phone and to be clear I'm a big fan of both Schenns (if they did ask for both Schenns I would have to think about it though). The thing is that Nashville is rebuilding so realistically I would offer something like Laughton, Read, Gustaffson & maybe a pick for Weber. That way we clear some cap space and send them some good young players and a proven NHL player who can play in all situations and F positions oh and he scores which is something Nashville is missing. If other teams want to go all out and give up a ton for Weber let them, we just don't have the same quality prospect pool and our depth at F is our biggest strength now.

i'm ok with, and agree with, the top section. aside from the niskanen yandle comparison. i think yandle is a lot better offensively, and a lot worse defensively.

the bottom part.. i dont think weber is available. and if he is, read+laughton+gus+pick won't even get you a call back. which is fine, because i'm with you, i dont go after weber.

 

[banditshcky11]

i'm ok with, and agree with, the top section. aside from the niskanen yandle comparison. i think yandle is a lot better offensively, and a lot worse defensively.

the bottom part.. i dont think weber is available. and if he is, read+laughton+gus+pick won't even get you a call back. which is fine, because i'm with you, i dont go after weber.

I said yandle type, meaning more offensive then defensive minded. I probably should have clarified that.

That's my point about Weber. I can't see any team offering Nashville a package that they think is worthy of trading Weber. So if I was the Flyers GM I would throw an offer out there and then forget about it until they called back, if they did and then deal with it then. There are quite a few "insiders" saying that they believe Weber will be available at the draft, with where Nashville is now and knowing there ownership group is not the most stable financially I could see Weber and Rinne being available.

 

[awaz]

I said yandle type, meaning more offensive then defensive minded. I probably should have clarified that.

That's my point about Weber. I can't see any team offering Nashville a package that they think is worthy of trading Weber. So if I was the Flyers GM I would throw an offer out there and then forget about it until they called back, if they did and then deal with it then. There are quite a few "insiders" saying that they believe Weber will be available at the draft, with where Nashville is now and knowing there ownership group is not the most stable financially I could see Weber and Rinne being available.

fair enough.

i still think the insiders are just generating hits with the weber stuff. the financially tough part of his contract his over. it was all about the 1st year or two of the contract and his bonuses. it was structured to make the up front cost to the preds next to impossible to pay, but they paid it. now they should be fine

 

[Maverick426h]

I think that Ghost is the defenseman that we truly need. I don't know that he'll be able to start for us as soon as next season though. I hope he at least makes the jump to pro hockey though.

 

[awaz]

I think that Ghost is the defenseman that we truly need. I don't know that he'll be able to start for us as soon as next season though. I hope he at least makes the jump to pro hockey though.

i think he said he plans on finishing his career at union.. that was early this year though so who knows what he's thinking now.

but i agree 100%, he's potentially, the dynamic offensive defensemen the flyers haven't had in a long time