NBA OFF TOPIC THREAD

[Heatles84]

You may be right but this isn’t the year in which you can really judge that. He got started really late. BK is more of an acquired taste.

Mario cristobal got hired at Miami after Brian Kelly left for lsu.it’s nearly impossible to pluck kids from Louisiana that LSU wants.

 

[Wamu]

I mean Haslam is no saint but I have heard Hue say a lot of ridiculous stuff. He didn't have the balls to come out before Flores. That being said, I could care less about Haslam haha.

Until a see more evidence from Hue really can't take him at his word. Like you said his timing to mention this is odd. But the reason it's believable is Haslam's an idiot.

 

[Wamu]

do you want the truth of what really happened?

He was told by Dipo of their plan and, yes, they did tell him the plan would likely involve a lot of losing early. In fact, they told him he might not want to attend games early as things will get worse before they got better (and that was after coming off 3-13). Lucky for us, Haslam accepted their plan and let them run with it. I wonder what would have happened if they had let them make all the decisions (like hire McDermott over Hue and then not interrupt the process with Dorsey).

Can you post something to back up what you've claimed? Like I told shane the only reason I can kinda believe Hues is Haslam's a moron who's done questionable stuff in the past. I only ask this because I'm not sure if what you said is really legit or just your opinion. And not looking to start anything. But you also said K. Hunt didn't nothing wrong in that Cleveland hotel. When talking about the Browns at times you've gone the homer route.

 

[Wamu]

Hue Jackson would’ve been able to buy the league if that was the case.

Hopefully his allegations are total bullshit. But if what he's saying in true this could force Haslam to sell the team. Which would be a great thing.

 

[Heatles84]

Hopefully his allegations are total bullshit. But if what he's saying in true this could force Haslam to sell the team. Which would be a great thing.

Think you and I are in the same boat as I'd like to see Ross forced to sell the Phins.

My problem with all of this is why are you speaking up now? Why not back then? For Hue Jackson, you should've known that posting a 3-36 record while with Cleveland was going to be the end any chance of you being a HC in the NFL again, despite how disfunctional the Browns were back then. And if Hue Jackson didn't think that would be an issue, then he's an idiot.

 

[Heatles84]

@Wamu my above post is also not meant to disparage the Browns in anyway. The Dolphins have to be the most dysfunctional franchise next to Washington, so who am I to talk shit.

 

[Wamu]

Think you and I are in the same boat as I'd like to see Ross forced to sell the Phins.

My problem with all of this is why are you speaking up now? Why not back then? For Hue Jackson, you should've known that posting a 3-36 record while with Cleveland was going to be the end any chance of you being a HC in the NFL again, despite how disfunctional the Browns were back then. And if Hue Jackson didn't think that would be an issue, then he's an idiot.

I'm not trying to defend Jackson's comment. But the only thing I can think of as to the timing of this is Hue would like on an island, by himself, in making an accusation like this. With Flores speaking up he's not the only one making this claim. But in the end I really have no idea if he's being honest or if he's just bitter.

As far as the Dolphins. Firing Flores made no sense at all. He led the Dolphins to back to back winning seasons for the first time since '02-'03.

 

[Wamu]

@Wamu my above post is also not meant to disparage the Browns in anyway. The Dolphins have to be the most dysfunctional franchise next to Washington, so who am I to talk shit.

Oh no problem. And I didn't think you were trying to take any shots at the Browns. This is just something else that potentially makes Haslam look bad.

 

[Wamu]

A sad day in music history.

On this day in '59 Buddy Holly, Ritchie Valens & the Big Bopper died in a plane crash.

 

[trojanfan12]

Think you and I are in the same boat as I'd like to see Ross forced to sell the Phins.

I don't get why Flores is suing the Giants and trying to paint them as racist. It looks like the Giants decided on their new coach before they finished their interviews, but were forced to continue because they hadn't interviewed a minority yet. Plus, it's not that there aren't other HC jobs available and apparently, he was on the interview list for at least 2 of them.

It happens sometimes that you might have 5 or 6 folks lined up for interviews, but after 2 or 3, you know who you want. My guess is that the Giants would have loved to just end it when they made their decision, but they hadn't fulfilled the Rooney Rule yet.

Besides, the allegations against Ross are a far bigger problem for the NFL than the Giants conducting a faux interview because they are forced to. If Flores can prove the Ross accusations, it will likely cost him the team and Flores would likely still be hirable.

 

[Heatles84]

I'm not trying to defend Jackson's comment. But the only thing I can think of as to the timing of this is Hue would like on an island, by himself, in making an accusation like this. With Flores speaking up he's not the only one making this claim. But in the end I really have no idea if he's being honest or if he's just bitter.

As far as the Dolphins. Firing Flores made no sense at all. He led the Dolphins to back to back winning seasons for the first time since '02-'03.

I think Flores has promise as a HC, which is baffling why he chose the stance he has. He was going to get a HC position either this year or next, that's gone now for the foreseeable future.

I always view it as this - there's two aspects to consider when you're a coach and how you hold onto your job - are you producing results? And how's relationships with upper management and ownership.

Flores at least deserved another year. But his offense was always a circus and the staff turnover was significant every year where I do wonder if he was difficult to work with. On top of that, I think it's the latter point where he didn't have a great relationship with the owner and GM.

And Flores isn't the only coach to get fired, not based on results, but the relationship aspect. This isn't a race thing either as Jimmy Johnson is a prime example of how important that relationship aspect is. Dude had won 2 SBs, made it to a conference title game, and was fired the year the 49ers won the SB.

But we'll see what comes out of it. Hopefully the Browns and Dolphins ownership are forced to sell, but I doubt that happens.

 

[Heatles84]

I don't get why Flores is suing the Giants and trying to paint them as racist. It looks like the Giants decided on their new coach before they finished their interviews, but were forced to continue because they hadn't interviewed a minority yet. Plus, it's not that there aren't other HC jobs available and apparently, he was on the interview list for at least 2 of them.

It happens sometimes that you might have 5 or 6 folks lined up for interviews, but after 2 or 3, you know who you want. My guess is that the Giants would have loved to just end it when they made their decision, but they hadn't fulfilled the Rooney Rule yet.

Besides, the allegations against Ross are a far bigger problem for the NFL than the Giants conducting a faux interview because they are forced to. If Flores can prove the Ross accusations, it will likely cost him the team and Flores would likely still be hirable.

From what I read, the Giants had already interviewed Lezlie Frazier, so they satisfied the quota.

Out of the 3 teams in the spotlight (Giants/Dolphins/Broncos), I think it's the Broncos that have a black eye from his if Flores' allegations about Elway coming in hungover to interview him. The Dolphins at worst look to have potential tampering charges and purposefully tanking that will result in a heavy fine and some draft capital being taken away. The Giants look like they're free of any wrongdoing.

Also, on the Broncos, I saw an old quote that surfaced from back in 2020 where Flores described it as a positive experience in terms of his interview with the Broncos. I'm not a legal expert, but I'd imagine that'd be used against him if this goes to court and/or settlement.

 

[trojanfan12]

From what I read, the Giants had already interviewed Lezlie Frazier, so they satisfied the quota.

Out of the 3 teams in the spotlight (Giants/Dolphins/Broncos), I think it's the Broncos that have a black eye from his if Flores' allegations about Elway coming in hungover to interview him. The Dolphins at worst look to have potential tampering charges and purposefully tanking that will result in a heavy fine and some draft capital being taken away. The Giants look like they're free of any wrongdoing.

Also, on the Broncos, I saw an old quote that surfaced from back in 2020 where Flores described it as a positive experience in terms of his interview with the Broncos. I'm not a legal expert, but I'd imagine that'd be used against him if this goes to court and/or settlement.

Hadn't heard anything about the Broncos situation. It just seems like there are 2 different lawsuits here. 1 for, if his allegations are true, being fired for winning when he was told to lose and 1 for discrimination even though there were more jobs available that he was reportedly a candidate for.

I'm no lawyer and from what has been reported, the law firm he hired is very well respected, so I'm sure they know what they are doing. Just seems like odd timing for the discrimination part, especially since that is unlikely to make it to trial. The NFL will write him a big check and he'll go coach a college team somewhere on that one.

It seems like if he just stuck with suing the Dolphins, he'd still be hirable in the NFL and would still get a big check.

 

[fightinfunbags]

I'm not trying to defend Jackson's comment. But the only thing I can think of as to the timing of this is Hue would like on an island, by himself, in making an accusation like this. With Flores speaking up he's not the only one making this claim. But in the end I really have no idea if he's being honest or if he's just bitter.

As far as the Dolphins. Firing Flores made no sense at all. He led the Dolphins to back to back winning seasons for the first time since '02-'03.

Flores and Jackson will be the first of many that will sign on to this class action suit. This looks to be the line drawn in the sand with black coaches. It looks like the hope is that many of these guys will stand together and join the class action suit with the hopes of painting a broad picture. We will see how much participation they get among their ranks.

 

[Wamu]

I think Flores has promise as a HC, which is baffling why he chose the stance he has. He was going to get a HC position either this year or next, that's gone now for the foreseeable future.

I always view it as this - there's two aspects to consider when you're a coach and how you hold onto your job - are you producing results? And how's relationships with upper management and ownership.

Flores at least deserved another year. But his offense was always a circus and the staff turnover was significant every year where I do wonder if he was difficult to work with. On top of that, I think it's the latter point where he didn't have a great relationship with the owner and GM.

And Flores isn't the only coach to get fired, not based on results, but the relationship aspect. This isn't a race thing either as Jimmy Johnson is a prime example of how important that relationship aspect is. Dude had won 2 SBs, made it to a conference title game, and was fired the year the 49ers won the SB.

But we'll see what comes out of it. Hopefully the Browns and Dolphins ownership are forced to sell, but I doubt that happens.

The way I see it if the Dolphins don't win at least 10 games next season it was a mistake to fire Flores. I think this firing is a real head scratcher.

 

[Wamu]

Flores and Jackson will be the first of many that will sign on to this class action suit. This looks to be the line drawn in the sand with black coaches. It looks like the hope is that many of these guys will stand together and join the class action suit with the hopes of painting a broad picture. We will see how much participation they get among their ranks.

All I can say about black coaches in the NFL is heard last night in 101 years of NFL football there's only been 19 black HC's. That to me is a very troubling number.

 

[fightinfunbags]

All I can say about black coaches in the NFL is heard last night in 101 years of NFL football there's only been 19 black HC's. That to me is a very troubling number.

And that’s what the suit will eventually look like when they’re done. They’re going to stack the personal stories of numerous coaches to paint a broad picture of reduced access.

 

[Heatles84]

The way I see it if the Dolphins don't win at least 10 games next season it was a mistake to fire Flores. I think this firing is a real head scratcher.

I'm fine with the firing, if Grier would've went along with him. Apparently Flores wanted to sell the boat to get Watson who may never play a snap again in the NFL given his pending legal issues. There's also grumblings that he sabotaged Tua (I think Tua's an average QB and not even in Watson's league as a QB) and wasn't bought into him (hence why Grier should be gone as well).

Grier has been constantly trying to build out the Phins OL and it's never been developed. Both Grier and Flores should've been fired, or they both should've received one year. Dolphins figured out how to screw that up by keeping one and not the other.

 

[trojanfan12]

I'm not saying there isn't or hasn't been an issue in the NFL's hiring of black head coaches. But there needs to be some context.

It keeps being thrown around that 70% of the league is black and that the number of coaches should reflect that. My question would be: Why don't the numbers reflect that? Is it racism? Or are, for example, black former players choosing not to go into coaching. I've seen the 2 hosts of Speak For Yourself, who are both black former players, sitting in a tv studio talking about the lack of black coaches...maybe many or most black former are choosing to go into broadcasting or to pursue other business interests like those 2 did?

Coaching is long hours of sitting in the facility and reviewing film, game planning, etc., long after all of the players, trainers, etc. have gone home. Maybe a lot of black former players are saying "To heck with that, I want time with my family" and choosing other options that allow for more family time?

I'd be interested to see what the numbers are, if there are any, of black former players who weren't hired for assistant coaching positions because of racism? How many, if any, black coaches from college programs have been denied NFL jobs because of racism? Because those are the kinds of things they are likely going to have to prove.

 

[thunderc]

I don't get why Flores is suing the Giants and trying to paint them as racist. It looks like the Giants decided on their new coach before they finished their interviews, but were forced to continue because they hadn't interviewed a minority yet. Plus, it's not that there aren't other HC jobs available and apparently, he was on the interview list for at least 2 of them.

It happens sometimes that you might have 5 or 6 folks lined up for interviews, but after 2 or 3, you know who you want. My guess is that the Giants would have loved to just end it when they made their decision, but they hadn't fulfilled the Rooney Rule yet.

Besides, the allegations against Ross are a far bigger problem for the NFL than the Giants conducting a faux interview because they are forced to. If Flores can prove the Ross accusations, it will likely cost him the team and Flores would likely still be hirable.

Thats why he made it a class action and added in the NFL. This has the potential to get huge, all because the NFL put in a rule that they really didn’t have to do.