NBA OFF TOPIC THREAD

[Shanemansj13]

I joked in the other thread but did we ever find out what Higgins did to get benched?

He's CLEARLY the third best receiver on the team

I picked him up in the Fantrax league so hoping for a big output on his end lol

 

[Wamu]

seems a little harsh. average? 57K yards. Multiple Pro Bowls and SB MVPs? But, yeah, many will flip if he makes HOF and I think he will.

I call him that because of his 117-117 career record. But those 2 S.B. mvp's are really his ticket in. Not only beating Tommy Boy & his Pats twice, one of those upsets was against that undefeated team. 100+ wins, 57,000+ yards, 350+ TD's. He's in.

 

[Stakesarehigh]

I picked him up in the Fantrax league so hoping for a big output on his end lol

I bid 25

You beat me

 

[Shanemansj13]

Landry wanted the Dolphins to pay him $16 mil per year - basically pay him as a #1 WR. He's not a #1 WR. That's why Miami got rid of him.

Also, Baker's not telling OBJ what to do. He doesn't have the cache. OBJ's a head case, but you need to have a QB like Mahomes, Big Ben, Brady, RW, etc... to tell OBJ what to do. Baker's not exactly the example of a perfect QB, so he has no room to tell OBJ shit.

Landry has been nobody but a team player and leader since joining the Browns, I wouldn't hold it against him he wanted more money...he was very productive. He wasn't a #1 WR bc of his style. He isn't a big play, flashy, super athletic but he is a very reliable, possession WR.

I really do think Baker is a leader. He is the leader on this team, I would say Landry is #2. I don't think this is a leadership issue or even Odell wanting the ball more...I just think they just aren't on the same page, they don't mesh well together. You just see that sometimes...but I will say it's Baker's JOB and DUTY AS A LEADER to get on the same page and work as much as possible with the player. I think he just looked his way too often instead of going through his normal progressions and it hurt Baker. I think now he can just play like he always has and be more comfortable. We will see though, not holding my breath. I still have concerns.

 

[Shanemansj13]

I bid 25

You beat me

Yep, I had to bid high bc I had Odell and most importantly traded for his ass. I figured you would put a bid in.

 

[Shanemansj13]

Eli's the definition of average, but he's getting into the HOF. And when that happens it's gonna be funny to see peoples reactions.

Not really. I have always called Eli overrated but that's when people want to mention him in best QB's of all-time. He is far above average though.

 

[Wamu]

Not really. I have always called Eli overrated but that's when people want to mention him in best QB's of all-time. He is far above average though.

Living in Broncos country I've heard it all about Elway. He's was a great QB, not doubt about it. But he's not top 5.

 

[Heatles84]

Landry has been nobody but a team player and leader since joining the Browns, I wouldn't hold it against him he wanted more money...he was very productive. He wasn't a #1 WR bc of his style. He isn't a big play, flashy, super athletic but he is a very reliable, possession WR.

I really do think Baker is a leader. He is the leader on this team, I would say Landry is #2. I don't think this is a leadership issue or even Odell wanting the ball more...I just think they just aren't on the same page, they don't mesh well together. You just see that sometimes...but I will say it's Baker's JOB and DUTY AS A LEADER to get on the same page and work as much as possible with the player. I think he just looked his way too often instead of going through his normal progressions and it hurt Baker. I think now he can just play like he always has and be more comfortable. We will see though, not holding my breath. I still have concerns.

I mean, you just debated yourself, the juxtaposition here doesn't make any sense. Landry wanted more money, to the point he'd be a highly paid #1. I merely mentioned that the Phins let him go because they didn't want to pay him that because he's not a #1 WR. That's not a fault of his, it just is what it is.

In regards to Baker's "leadership", you constantly see him on commercials and commenting on other teammate's situations that he shouldn't (ie Duke Johnson's contract situation a couple of years ago). In terms of meshing, you're right, it's Baker's job to get right in that regard. OBJ's a proven commodity, albeit a head case, he's still proven; Baker isn't.

 

[Heatles84]

Of course Mayfield's affairs aren't in order. That dumbbell has more tv commercials than wins.

Can you say that again for the people in the back?

 

[Wamu]

Can you say that again for the people in the back?

That dumbbell has more tv commercials than wins.

 

[dtgold88]

Landry has been nobody but a team player and leader since joining the Browns, I wouldn't hold it against him he wanted more money...he was very productive. He wasn't a #1 WR bc of his style. He isn't a big play, flashy, super athletic but he is a very reliable, possession WR.

I really do think Baker is a leader. He is the leader on this team, I would say Landry is #2. I don't think this is a leadership issue or even Odell wanting the ball more...I just think they just aren't on the same page, they don't mesh well together. You just see that sometimes...but I will say it's Baker's JOB and DUTY AS A LEADER to get on the same page and work as much as possible with the player. I think he just looked his way too often instead of going through his normal progressions and it hurt Baker. I think now he can just play like he always has and be more comfortable. We will see though, not holding my breath. I still have concerns.

Much of this is true but the numbers do not bear out that last part. In fact, too often was ripped because he didn't throw enough to OBJ. The kid cannot win sometimes.

I do hope we can see the 2018 baker though.

 

[dtgold88]

Living in Broncos country I've heard it all about Elway. He's was a great QB, not doubt about it. But he's not top 5.

I don't think he was top 5 either, but he was damn good.

when it comes to evaluating other QBs? That's another story.

 

[dtgold88]

I mean, you just debated yourself, the juxtaposition here doesn't make any sense. Landry wanted more money, to the point he'd be a highly paid #1. I merely mentioned that the Phins let him go because they didn't want to pay him that because he's not a #1 WR. That's not a fault of his, it just is what it is.

In regards to Baker's "leadership", you constantly see him on commercials and commenting on other teammate's situations that he shouldn't (ie Duke Johnson's contract situation a couple of years ago). In terms of meshing, you're right, it's Baker's job to get right in that regard. OBJ's a proven commodity, albeit a head case, he's still proven; Baker isn't.

I mean his commercials are done in the offseason so not sure how that takes away from being a leader. Manning not a leader, either?

I agreed last year he needed to shut up and play and was definitely out of line commenting on Duke's situation...but he seems to have cleaned that up.

OBJ hasn't been the OBJ you think he is for 3 years or so.

 

[trojanfan12]

It's culture, New England established it, Tom Brady put in the work and became a Mt. Rushmore QB.

The problem is, Baker has this reputation about him where his affairs aren't in order to where he can tell a player like OBJ to shut up and get in line.

Not really on New England. Tom Brady was a 6th round draft pick that no one had ever heard of and he took over for Drew Bledsoe. But he basically took over the huddle and the locker room from the minute he was named starter.

To be fair, New England backed him up when he did and, as you point out, he put in the work. That work allowed him to maintain his being the leader of that team. I heard he used to get pissed if a teammate got to the facility ahead of him and he'd come in even earlier the next day if one did. lol

So, some of the issue may be that Baker didn't have a coach that he felt could/would back him up. Because if/when he does tell OBJ, "You worry about running your routes correctly and getting open and I'll worry about getting the ball to whoever is open" OBJ may not take it well. If he doesn't, then the coaches, etc. need to be willing to tell him to listen to Baker if he wants the ball.

And yeah, Baker also needs to make sure he has his stuff under control or his words will be hollow to everyone, not just OBJ.

 

[tlance]

I call him that because of his 117-117 career record. But those 2 S.B. mvp's are really his ticket in. Not only beating Tommy Boy & his Pats twice, one of those upsets was against that undefeated team. 100+ wins, 57,000+ yards, 350+ TD's. He's in.

Plus he is a Manning.

I think he is a career midrange franchise QB who got hot at the right time twice.

Definite HOF player, but there are dozens of superior QBs who won’t get in.

 

[dtgold88]

Not really on New England. Tom Brady was a 6th round draft pick that no one had ever heard of and he took over for Drew Bledsoe. But he basically took over the huddle and the locker room from the minute he was named starter.

To be fair, New England backed him up when he did and, as you point out, he put in the work. That work allowed him to maintain his being the leader of that team. I heard he used to get pissed if a teammate got to the facility ahead of him and he'd come in even earlier the next day if one did. lol

So, some of the issue may be that Baker didn't have a coach that he felt could/would back him up. Because if/when he does tell OBJ, "You worry about running your routes correctly and getting open and I'll worry about getting the ball to whoever is open" OBJ may not take it well. If he doesn't, then the coaches, etc. need to be willing to tell him to listen to Baker if he wants the ball.

And yeah, Baker also needs to make sure he has his stuff under control or his words will be hollow to everyone, not just OBJ.

I think it might be the opposite for Baker in that he had a coach last year who coddled him and was afraid to call him out or challenge him. He knew Baker was the only reason he got the job.

I noticed Njoku did what Duke did last year and Baker never called him out (like he did Duke). Could either be Stefanski's influence or he's growing up. Or both.

 

[dtgold88]

Plus he is a Manning.

I think he is a career midrange franchise QB who got hot at the right time twice.

Definite HOF player, but there are dozens of superior QBs who won’t get in.

I think that's a good description. Genuinely curious who you think is superior but wont get in. Not to say I doubt it, but no one comes immediately to mind. I'd like to say one of my own favorites - Bernie Kosar - but doubt he qualifies.

also could be some lesser guys in the HOF like maybe Bradshaw to be fair.

 

[tlance]

I think that's a good description. Genuinely curious who you think is superior but wont get in. Not to say I doubt it, but no one comes immediately to mind. I'd like to say one of my own favorites - Bernie Kosar - but doubt he
also could be some lesser guys in the HOF like maybe Bradshaw to be fair.

I probably would put guys like Esiason and and Kosar higher even though their stats won’t match up.

Guys like Matt Ryan and Andrew Luck and Probably even Matt Stafford today.

The difference is the Super Bowls.

 

[dtgold88]

I probably would put guys like Esiason and and Kosar higher even though their stats won’t match up.

Guys like Matt Ryan and Andrew Luck and Probably even Matt Stafford today.

The difference is the Super Bowls.

wouldn't be surprised if Ryan got in. was also thinking Esiason when Bernie came to mind. Luck I'm sure better but obvious why he wont get in.

 

[tlance]

wouldn't be surprised if Ryan got in. was also thinking Esiason when Bernie came to mind. Luck I'm sure better but obvious why he wont get in.

I would be pretty surprised if Matt Ryan gets in. He has had a really good career, but I just don’t think he is there without a couple more seasons like 2016.