Matthew Stafford

[Old Lion]

Stafford needs to learn how to lead his receivers on horizontal routes. He is constantly, constantly constantly throwing behind receivers. I undersatnd he is not terrible and the O-Line is lost, but that can not be an excuse for throwing behind players. If anything it should be the opposite if he is rushed for time he should be releasing to soon. I also notice he does not look Fuller's way nearly enough. I see Fuller open from time to time but Staff trying to force it into another WR although not so much this week.

The good news is he is seems to be getting better making decisions, Only a couple of ill advised throws and neither hurt us. The 2 Ints were on a great play by a DB and another on poor technique on a TE that should not have been on the field. The 2 ill-advised ones were incomplete.

 

[jdwills126]

Thank goodness stafford is only 26 and still not even on his prime. Theres many reasons to hate on him, I get it. But there are also many reasons to have faith tha hes getting closer and closer to breaking out. I wont make excuses for him, he needs to play better. For the record 22, currently besides tate there is not one person around stafford making plays. Hell, he even has to worry his fucking kicker will miss an easy kick.

IMO it's not hating on Stafford as much as it is figuring wTF is going on thigh the offense. If Stafford gets a better mix of plays and keeps the turnovers down the fact he is not throwing for 350 yards 3 TDs and 2 Ints is a good trade off.

The coaching staff needs to find that medium.

And we have to take into account the Detroit Lion fan factor....We want to see 400 yard games and gaudy numbers. We have to have something to cheer for when we are losing. So the fact they are winning with average QB play is something we are not really familiar with.

 

[gvsulaker82]

Exactly. The main point I'm trying to make is we can't be satisfied with this type of play all year. If the same thing as last year happens, the organization would be dumb to not start exploring other possible options. I hate when people say " get used to it he's the starter for at least the next 3 years due to his contract". Stfu, no quarterback should have that type of security.

If stafford doesnt improve during the season that can be addressed in the offseason, although I think it would be stupid to replace him. Currently the lions do not have a better option. Lets see how staff does with a healthy CJ lined up with tate before we consider him sucking for remainder of season. Yeah it sucks hes getting paid way too much money, but I believe you said the same thing about tate and tate is earning it.

 

[tpaulus_2]

Exactly. The main point I'm trying to make is we can't be satisfied with this type of play all year.

I don't think anyone is arguing that they're satisfied with Stafford's play so far.

If the same thing as last year happens, the organization would be dumb to not start exploring other possible options. I hate when people say " get used to it he's the starter for at least the next 3 years due to his contract". Stfu, no quarterback should have that type of security.

If, yes. But so far Stafford has been kind of the opposite of the Stafford that finished last season as a turn-over machine. You're making it sound like he's regressed this year from where he left off, rather than tightening things up like he has. I think the turn-overs were a major sticking-point for this new staff, and to that end he's improved a fair amount...

 

[gandydancer]

I think this sums up the offenses problem right now. I would also include Lombardi as a problem. We have all gave standing ovations to Austin for his work with the defense, but Lombardi has come over and turned an offense who, under Linehan, was a top 5-10 offense and turned it into what we are seeing.

The OL, which was a strength, under the new scheme has now become a glaring weakness. Of course, injuries have a lot to do with some of the offenses struggles, as Calvin Johnson has been out multiple games and a decoy in others. Bush and Bell have missed time. Fauria has been injured. I'd mention Ebron, but he was as productive in yesterday's game, as he was a couple weeks this year anyway. (i apologize -- had to throw that in)

Everyone wants to point at Stafford, but from listening to the game yesterday at the end -- the announcers kept saying the line isn't going Stafford time and when he had time, he had no one to throw the ball too. I don't know if they are biased toward Stafford, as I don't normally listen to the game on the radio, but they did not speak kindly of anyone on the Lions offense except for Golden Tate.

At what point do we start looking at our OC for a lot of the issues we are having?

Just can not resist? Even when you state OL play and run game are the reason.

 

[gvsulaker82]

IMO it's not hating on Stafford as much as it is figuring wTF is going on thigh the offense. If Stafford gets a better mix of plays and keeps the turnovers down the fact he is not throwing for 350 yards 3 TDs and 2 Ints is a good trade off.

The coaching staff needs to find that medium.

And we have to take into account the Detroit Lion fan factor....We want to see 400 yard games and gaudy numbers. We have to have something to cheer for when we are losing. So the fact they are winning with average QB play is something we are not really familiar with.

Well based on kretons stats I think its pretty obvious the offensive line is the biggest problem with the offense. Whether that be raiola and sims, the new blocking scheme or a combination of both, IM not sure...but until thats addressed I believe the concerns will continue. As the lions defense has demonstrated so well, you win games in the trenches. I know brees is much better than stafford, but look how fuckin good the saints offensive line is and look how that allows brees to pick apart defenses.

 

[tpaulus_2]

Stafford needs to learn how to lead his receivers on horizontal routes. He is constantly, constantly constantly throwing behind receivers. I undersatnd he is not terrible and the O-Line is lost, but that can not be an excuse for throwing behind players. If anything it should be the opposite if he is rushed for time he should be releasing to soon. I also notice he does not look Fuller's way nearly enough. I see Fuller open from time to time but Staff trying to force it into another WR although not so much this week.

The good news is he is seems to be getting better making decisions, Only a couple of ill advised throws and neither hurt us. The 2 Ints were on a great play by a DB and another on poor technique on a TE that should not have been on the field. The 2 ill-advised ones were incomplete.

Solid analysis. Growth in some areas (turn-overs, decision-making) and room for growth in other areas (accuracy, touch).

 

[Kreton]

Thank goodness stafford is only 26 and still not even on his prime. Theres many reasons to hate on him, I get it. But there are also many reasons to have faith tha hes getting closer and closer to breaking out. I wont make excuses for him, he needs to play better. For the record 22, currently besides tate there is not one person around stafford making plays. Hell, he even has to worry his fucking kicker will miss an easy kick.

I have some excuses for him. The running game is non existent so teams dont have to plan much for that. The O line is confused and a glaring weakness, and he's missing his best weapon and the only guy he has been able to trust. And there is a new scheme he is learning.

So plenty of reasons for him to be experiencing trouble, and much of it correctable. He is making fewer dangerous throws so there is reason to think it will get back. The blocking has to get better for me to really say if Stafford is playing poorly because is not as good as I have thought he was, or if other factors are making him look worse.

 

[gvsulaker82]

I have some excuses for him. The running game is non existent so teams dont have to plan much for that. The O line is confused and a glaring weakness, and he's missing his best weapon and the only guy he has been able to trust. And there is a new scheme he is learning.

So plenty of reasons for him to be experiencing trouble, and much of it correctable. He is making fewer dangerous throws so there is reason to think it will get back. The blocking has to get better for me to really say if Stafford is playing poorly because is not as good as I have thought he was, or if other factors are making him look worse.

Oh I agree with all of your excuses, and there are more. I just didnt want to come across as a stafford apologist, because it seems as if I defend stafford on here at the same time stating he needs to vastly improve then other posters assume I think theres nothing wrong.

 

[gandydancer]

That's a great way to put it.

While Stafford has been frustrating because we all know he can do better, he also hasn't been bad, per se. It seems like he's always chasing an ever-shifting gold-standard on here...

Who is putting a gold standard on him? I sure as fuck am not.

Just imagine what his ACCURACY would be if he did correct that tiny little flaw Trevor?

That condescending line did not go unnoticed. Sure it is always the naysayers though being condescending around here.

 

[Wazmankg]

So let's see... We blamed the OC and WR's for QB's play. So switched OC and upgraded WR. Now blaming new OC and OL for same QB's play. When do we blame QB?

Not going to rehash my opinion of Staff's play except to say I think he's been about average given what he has to work with currently. But if you don't think the OL is the biggest problem with the offense's lack of production you must not be watching the games.

 

[gandydancer]

Oh I agree with all of your excuses, and there are more. I just didnt want to come across as a stafford apologist, because it seems as if I defend stafford on here at the same time stating he needs to vastly improve then other posters assume I think theres nothing wrong.

I will not judge a guy who sees both sides. A QB who has all the tools to be special, and wants him to use them. Once he vastly improves I can compare a season stat to season stat and not a game stat to a current season stat of a HOFer.

 

[gandydancer]

He only has one fumble lost though, so unless he really starts losing them, it won't be 7 total fumbles lost.

I can only go by the season stats presented to me. Adjust the stats and I will give my statement on said stats.

 

[gvsulaker82]

I will not judge a guy who sees both sides. A QB who has all the tools to be special, and wants him to use them. Once he vastly improves I can compare a season stat to season stat and not a game stat to a current season stat of a HOFer.

We can all agree, stafford has guts, determination, and heart. Theres no doubt about that. So getting in his head a second, hes always been a winner, hes always been the MAN. Now hes playing against complex, fast NFL defenses. Its a huge adjustment, he still wants to do everything he can to win but hes learning to inhibit those mistakes slowly. Imagine you being him driving the lions down the field and thinking how prater clanked one off the uprights earlier (a 21 yarder), how the lions missed so many FGS this year. Im thinking its hard for staff to trust his teammates when so many are letting him down and hes a winner, he feels he has to do everything, but hes doing his best to inhibit those poor throws. Hes getting better.

 

[gvsulaker82]

I will not judge a guy who sees both sides. A QB who has all the tools to be special, and wants him to use them. Once he vastly improves I can compare a season stat to season stat and not a game stat to a current season stat of a HOFer.

All IM saying is, worst offensive oline in league equals little production both running and passing. Saints one of the better olines and they have the number two offense.

 

[gvsulaker82]

Not going to rehash my opinion of Staff's play except to say I think he's been about average given what he has to work with currently. But if you don't think the OL is the biggest problem with the offense's lack of production you must not be watching the games.

couldnt agree more, well said wazman.

 

[Kreton]

So stats don't tell everything, you say, but you keep hanging your hat on ESPN's QBR stat as if it's the end-all-be-all measurement for QBs...

I think it is a more telling statistic than completion % since it incorporates more than one aspect of the game. And i'll use stats here and there, but I openly state pretty often that stats are fun, but dont tell the whole story. I am hanging my hat on watching the Lions and Stafford play for years. Stafford can throw for 500 yards and 9 TD's next week, but if he is making bad throws and his recievers are making great plays then i dont give a shit about his stats, Stafford played poorly. Same if he throws for 100 yards and 5 picks if hes hitting hit recievers and they are dropping the ball and letting it pop up to be picked then Stafford probably had a good game.

QBR is a stat I like. It shows the effectiveness of the QB more so than most others but in the end, it doesn't paint a good picture of Staffords performance, more an evaluation of the overall passing game.

 

[gandydancer]

Solid analysis. Growth in some areas (turn-overs, decision-making) and room for growth in other areas (accuracy, touch).

I spoke of both these earlier for Stafford. No love for the fat bastard you loathe at the moment?

I must be bashing when speaking of inaccuracy and turnovers and touch and decision making. Old Lion give good analogies

Must be a perception issue you speak of with certain people here. Rubbing off I guess

 

[tpaulus_2]

Oh I agree with all of your excuses, and there are more. I just didnt want to come across as a stafford apologist, because it seems as if I defend stafford on here at the same time stating he needs to vastly improve then other posters assume I think theres nothing wrong.

I feel ya there. There's plenty wrong with his overall game right now. But there's also plenty right with it, imo. He's been average so far this season on the whole, imo. Not good enough, given what we know he's capable of, but good enough for 5 wins (or good enough, at least, not to lose thus far).

 

[tpaulus_2]

Well. Laker and I are in near complete agreement on something again... I think that says a lot about this issue, as we don't always quite see eye-to-eye...