Lillard Is As Good As Curry

[Shanemansj13]

He would have to be, and before this Nuggets series I would have said that was a no question deal and absolutely worth it. But now, Lillard has been bottled up CJ actually has stepped up and carried the team. But realistically if Portland wanted to make big moves it'd have to trade big players and CJ would be gone.

Maybe Portland's best hope is to build to whatever that 2020 off season brings. Try to protect Lillard, CJ, Nurk and prepare to get AD. Hope to get a solid 5 year run out of them.

Their best best is trading McCollum and maybe some other assets for AD. I really like C.J. alongside Lillard but the salaries match up then you would have the combo of Lillard and AD. The problem is you still don't have any money to get any more pieces around that team bc you are still over the cap. At least you would have two superstars though.

 

[OregonDucks]

Portland needs to somehow get rid of Turner and Leonard, throw in Aminu in there. How Leonard and Turner are still employed is beyond me, they add absolutely nothing.

 

[Shanemansj13]

Career averages:

Steph: 23.5 ppg on 17.1 shots per game, .477/.436/.905, 4.5 rpg, 6.6 apg, 1.7 spg
Dame: 23.5 ppg on 18 shots per game, .434/.368/.889, 4.2 rpg, 6.3 apg, 1.0 spg

Career achievements:

Steph (in his 11th year): 3x NBA champ, 2x MVP, 6x All-star, 2x All-NBA 1st team, 2x All-NBA 2nd team, 1x All-NBA 3rd team, 1x scoring champ, 1x steals leader, 1x 50/40/90 club, 1x 3 pt contest champ, 1x NBA sportsmanship award, NBA All-rookie team, 1x AP Athlete of the year, 1x 1st team All-American, 1x 2nd team All-American, 1x NCAA scoring leader

Dame (in his 9th year): 4x All-star, 1x All-NBA 1st team, 1x All-NBA 2nd team, 1x All-NBA 3rd team, NBA Rookie of the year, NBA All-rookie team, 1x 3rd team All-American

Exactly where is Dame better? Steph is equal or better in every category/stat other than finishing second in rookie of the year voting.

You can cross out achievements, if Curry was on Portland and Lillard was on this GS team we could very well be looking at the same accolades swapped.

Curry is no doubt a more efficient and better 3 point shooter but you could say Lillard is just as great as an overall scorer. Lillard is one of the best in the paint like Curry. Would have to give them a draw there.
Things would definitely be different if you swapped teams, Curry would have to score more imo so his numbers could definitely jump up.

As of right now, you can't go wrong with either tbh. Lillard is having the better postseason though but really only bc he is taking more shots. The efficiency levels are pretty close. I would say Lillard is playing better defense in the postseason but everything else is pretty even.

 

[shopson67]

You can cross out achievements, if Curry was on Portland and Lillard was on this GS team we could very well be looking at the same accolades swapped.

Curry is no doubt a more efficient and better 3 point shooter but you could say Lillard is just as great as an overall scorer. Lillard is one of the best in the paint like Curry. Would have to give them a draw there.
Things would definitely be different if you swapped teams, Curry would have to score more imo so his numbers could definitely jump up.

As of right now, you can't go wrong with either tbh. Lillard is having the better postseason though but really only bc he is taking more shots. The efficiency levels are pretty close. I would say Lillard is playing better defense in the postseason but everything else is pretty even.

So you're bending over backwards to basically say that Curry is a little bit better, which is what the stats show anyway.

 

[Shanemansj13]

Portland needs to somehow get rid of Turner and Leonard, throw in Aminu in there. How Leonard and Turner are still employed is beyond me, they add absolutely nothing.

The Turner contract is one of the worst in the NBA. He is a FA in 2020 though.

My fault. The summer of 2020 the Blazers would have $23M in cap. Turner and Leonard would be off the books but this is assuming AD stays with the Pelicans and doesn't sign an extension with another team, I really doubt that at this point.

They could make space for AD that summer bc Collins, Swanigan and Simons are all non-guaranteed contracts and that is over $10M. This all seems unlikely but still possible.

 

[Shanemansj13]

So you're bending over backwards to basically say that Curry is a little bit better, which is what the stats show anyway.

No, I am saying they are equals. You were obviously Steph was pretty much better or a little better in every single category and you added accolades from being on a stacked team to add to the fact. That has nothing to do with present day comparisons.

It's like comparing Lebron to Giannis right now. You don't add in Lebron's accolades.

 

[OregonDucks]

The Turner contract is one of the worst in the NBA. He is a FA in 2020 though.

My fault. The summer of 2020 the Blazers would have $23M in cap. Turner and Leonard would be off the books but this is assuming AD stays with the Pelicans and doesn't sign an extension with another team, I really doubt that at this point.

They could make space for AD that summer bc Collins, Swanigan and Simons are all non-guaranteed contracts and that is over $10M. This all seems unlikely but still possible.

Portland would want to keep Collins. He has a bright future.

 

[shopson67]

No, I am saying they are equals. You were obviously Steph was pretty much better or a little better in every single category and you added accolades from being on a stacked team to add to the fact. That has nothing to do with present day comparisons.

It's like comparing Lebron to Giannis right now. You don't add in Lebron's accolades.

All-star and All-NBA are not accolades from being on a stacked team; they are recognition of quality play. Most of those years, Steph was chosen over Dame when both were established players. That is NOT the situation with Lebron and Giannis, as Lebron came into the league long before Giannis, and was a much more polished product than Giannis (who is still raw even today). Not a good comparison IMO.

 

[shopson67]

The Turner contract is one of the worst in the NBA. He is a FA in 2020 though.

My fault. The summer of 2020 the Blazers would have $23M in cap. Turner and Leonard would be off the books but this is assuming AD stays with the Pelicans and doesn't sign an extension with another team, I really doubt that at this point.

They could make space for AD that summer bc Collins, Swanigan and Simons are all non-guaranteed contracts and that is over $10M. This all seems unlikely but still possible.

You have to factor in cap holds for any open roster spots to get to 12 minimum filled roster spots too, which limits the advantage from dumping the non-guaranteed contracts a bit.

 

[msgkings322]

Well...breaking down two very talented PGs at this level and trying to determine who is better typically boils down to the player you like most.

I will say...support cast can effect some stats such as assists, and shooting %.

Exactly, comparing great players is not really a provable scientific thing. They are both great, and they have skillsets that blend with different players differently.

But it is fair to say it's gone from Curry being obviously better to a lot closer now.

 

[Shanemansj13]

All-star and All-NBA are not accolades from being on a stacked team; they are recognition of quality play. Most of those years, Steph was chosen over Dame when both were established players. That is NOT the situation with Lebron and Giannis, as Lebron came into the league long before Giannis, and was a much more polished product than Giannis (who is still raw even today). Not a good comparison IMO.

We are still comparing players this year, right now, I don't care how many times somebody won ALL-NBA in the past, players improve like Lillard has. Right now at this point in time, they are equals imo.

But everyone is going to have a preference or different opinion, especially when the comparison are this close.

 

[shopson67]

Exactly, comparing great players is not really a provable scientific thing. They are both great, and they have skillsets that blend with different players differently.

But it is fair to say it's gone from Curry being obviously better to a lot closer now.

I think it appears that way because of Durant. If the team still ran through Curry as it used to, he would still be the MVP candidate he was in the past. I guess we'll see next year if that's true.

 

[trojanfan12]

For some reason I thought AD was a free agent this year, that is why the Pelicans shut him down and he practically gave up for half the season.

Good grief is he going to sit out all of next year too then?

No. They didn't officially shut him down, the NBA basically told them they couldn't. But they did cut his minutes way down. I think he was only playing about 20 minutes or so per game over the last half of the season.

Apparently David Griffin intends to try to get AD to stay and AD is said to be open to it.

I can see one of the following 3 things happening (in no particular order):

1. Griffin makes moves designed to entice AD to stay, the moves work, the Pels have a good season and he stays.

2. Griffin makes moves to try and entice him to stay, they don't work and the Pels trade him at the deadline.

3. AD and Klutch tell Griffin that AD is gone after the season no matter what they do (or he is unable to make any moves that are good enough to keep him) and he gets traded in the off-season.

 

[Shanemansj13]

No. They didn't officially shut him down, the NBA basically told them they couldn't. But they did cut his minutes way down. I think he was only playing about 20 minutes or so per game over the last half of the season.

Apparently David Griffin intends to try to get AD to stay and AD is said to be open to it.

I can see one of the following 3 things happening (in no particular order):

1. Griffin makes moves designed to entice AD to stay, the moves work, the Pels have a good season and he stays.

2. Griffin makes moves to try and entice him to stay, they don't work and the Pels trade him at the deadline.

3. AD and Klutch tell Griffin that AD is gone after the season no matter what they do (or he is unable to make any moves that are good enough to keep him) and he gets traded in the off-season.

Either way the Pels hiring Griffin was a pretty genius move. He will either: 1. get max value for AD 2. Build around AD with a number of acquistions, I've seen him do it before.

Will be interesting to see it all unfold though. I still think AD is out but if there was one guy to entice AD to stay it would be Griffin (along with a couple other GM's).

 

[ATL96Steeler]

No. They didn't officially shut him down, the NBA basically told them they couldn't. But they did cut his minutes way down. I think he was only playing about 20 minutes or so per game over the last half of the season.

Apparently David Griffin intends to try to get AD to stay and AD is said to be open to it.

I can see one of the following 3 things happening (in no particular order):

1. Griffin makes moves designed to entice AD to stay, the moves work, the Pels have a good season and he stays.

2. Griffin makes moves to try and entice him to stay, they don't work and the Pels trade him at the deadline.

3. AD and Klutch tell Griffin that AD is gone after the season no matter what they do (or he is unable to make any moves that are good enough to keep him) and he gets traded in the off-season.

I think either #2 or #3 will play out.

If he goes the other way and stays in NO...kudos to him.

NO is a classic example of there being maybe 3 to 4 markets that are just tough to build a sustainable winner. They've had a legit star player in AD now for several seasons...unless you're a hardcore NBA fan, I think most of us would struggle to name ONE of AD's teammates.

 

[ATL96Steeler]

Either way the Pels hiring Griffin was a pretty genius move. He will either: 1. get max value for AD 2. Build around AD with a number of acquistions, I've seen him do it before.

Will be interesting to see it all unfold though. I still think AD is out but if there was one guy to entice AD to stay it would be Griffin (along with a couple other GM's).

I think there are just too many teams that leap into the playoff picture the day he (AD) signs so for him to stay will be a huge windfall for the Pels...don't see it happening unless they hit with Zion.

 

[mrwallace2ku]

Prove me wrong.

6-20 shooting in game4 loss to nuggets…guy could have had at least 14 more assists instead of 14 missed shots.

he'll prove me wrong shortly tho.

 

[SJ76]

There is a strong possibility that no one gives a shit because modern professial basketball is suckily unwatchable.

"Hey, let's throw defense out the window, shoot 30 jumpers for 60 minutes, and act like gangsta wannabes."

This is funny.

Oh and Curry is still the best shooter in the game. And that is what the game has become.

 

[shopson67]

No. They didn't officially shut him down, the NBA basically told them they couldn't. But they did cut his minutes way down. I think he was only playing about 20 minutes or so per game over the last half of the season.

Apparently David Griffin intends to try to get AD to stay and AD is said to be open to it.

I can see one of the following 3 things happening (in no particular order):

1. Griffin makes moves designed to entice AD to stay, the moves work, the Pels have a good season and he stays.

2. Griffin makes moves to try and entice him to stay, they don't work and the Pels trade him at the deadline.

3. AD and Klutch tell Griffin that AD is gone after the season no matter what they do (or he is unable to make any moves that are good enough to keep him) and he gets traded in the off-season.

3 is the most likely answer, and the trade could come at the deadline. However, with Kyrie likely leaving, Boston may be out of the AD rental trade market, so it remains to be seen if Griffin can get even decent value back for AD. The better bet is this summer vs at the deadline.

What moves are there to be made to placate AD? The Pelicans are currently over the cap, but can get about $16M under if they cut loose their free agents to lift their cap holds (Stanley Johnson, Elfrid Payton, Darius Miller, Cheick Diallo, and Ian Clark). If Randle turns down his $9M option, that creates another cap hold, but the Pels could cut him loose to push that cap space to $24M or so. Okafor has a non-guaranteed $1.7M contract for next season, and cutting him loose would free up about $1M. Who on this team is legitimately trade bait though, other than AD? Holiday at $26.7M per?

 

[shopson67]

I think there are just too many teams that leap into the playoff picture the day he (AD) signs so for him to stay will be a huge windfall for the Pels...don't see it happening unless they hit with Zion.

Huge windfall? For a one-year rental?