Lets talk Wide Receivers. Who do you like the best? Whose the most underrated?

[RaZon]

Smith is a Anthony Carter clone, he looks frail but gets the job done.

He is the only rookie to be that really excites me.

 

[Anointed One]

I think Waddle will have the most productive career.

 

[cwalke3408]

but a lot of his production came from manufactured touches in the form of quick screens, bubble screens, slants, and reverses. We never consistently saw Moore win with a traditional route tree, and that is something evaluators will have to consider.

I've given Moore a lot of though but this is my biggest concern with Moore. Not saying he can't be great at creating separation at the next level but it's hard to say when coming from an offense like Purdue

"Every year it seems like we have players who we all agree are excellent in college and have exciting ability with the ball in their hands. These players will usually get the “gadget” label, and the team that drafts them will then have to be creative, playing to their strengths. The issue is for every Deebo Samuel, there are five Tavon Austin’s; it is undoubtedly a risk in investing high draft capital in a gadget player. While Toney and Moore are both really good players, there are lingering questions about their ability to be a true WR1 at the next level."

Deebo was just more than a gadget player in college, you can line the guy up anywhere and he would win.

 

[SteelersPride]

I've given Moore a lot of though but this is my biggest concern with Moore. Not saying he can't be great at creating separation at the next level but it's hard to say when coming from an offense like Purdue. I hear ahal and this class is supposed to gif your

yep........i agree here

Deebo was just more than a gadget player in college, you can line the guy up anywhere and he would win.

 

[Clayton]

I've given Moore a lot of though but this is my biggest concern with Moore. Not saying he can't be great at creating separation at the next level but it's hard to say when coming from an offense like Purdue

Rondale Moore's biggest issues are certainly the two injuries and how Purdue used him. Deebo was a featured guy in college so I'd agree thats not really comparable.

WR/TEs I'd consider before Moore: Pitts, Chase, Waddle, Devonta Smith, Freirmuth, Marshall, Bateman, Brevin Jordan, Dyami Brown. I think at that point you can take a swing at a boom/bust like Moore. All of those guys are more proven in some sort of obvious role except for maybe Brown and I'd rather have him on the outside because he is 3-4 inches taller. That probably puts Rondale Moore in the mid 2nd round. Maybe late 2nd round for me. Rondale Moore could be one of the five best players in the draft, though. I think more likely he'll be seen in the same way Chiefs fans see Mecole Hardman where we have someone talented but we're still not sure if he is any good 2 years into the process.

 

[SteelersPride]

 

[ducky]

Smith is a Anthony Carter clone, he looks frail but gets the job done.

He is the only rookie to be that really excites me.

AC is a pretty good comparison.

Not sure why people are so down on Smith's size. He is just as tough if not tougher than any WR coming out in recent years. Alabama essentially used him as a battering ram at times this last season. There were drives where he would get 4 or 5 touches on a single drive on screens, reverses and short crosses. Dude proved beyond a shadow of a doubt that he is more than tough enough to play at the NFL level.

And his size isn't going to mean he can get jammed at the LOS. He has WAY too much short area quickness for that and an absolute array of moves to get off the LOS. Go look at the Georgia game where they tried to have Campbell jammed and he made him look terrible. Hell Campbell might be a 1st rounder had it not been for that game.

If people want to knock Smith, I would be waiting to see the pro day results and see if his 40 (if he runs it) comes in a little less than stellar. That what I want to see from him before deciding how high to rank him. But there is not chance that he isn't a top 10 WR prospect of the last 5 or 6 years unless that comes in at 4.6 or something ridiculous like that.

 

[Clayton]

AC is a pretty good comparison.

Not sure why people are so down on Smith's size. He is just as tough if not tougher than any WR coming out in recent years. Alabama essentially used him as a battering ram at times this last season. There were drives where he would get 4 or 5 touches on a single drive on screens, reverses and short crosses. Dude proved beyond a shadow of a doubt that he is more than tough enough to play at the NFL level.

And his size isn't going to mean he can get jammed at the LOS. He has WAY too much short area quickness for that and an absolute array of moves to get off the LOS. Go look at the Georgia game where they tried to have Campbell jammed and he made him look terrible. Hell Campbell might be a 1st rounder had it not been for that game.

If people want to knock Smith, I would be waiting to see the pro day results and see if his 40 (if he runs it) comes in a little less than stellar. That what I want to see from him before deciding how high to rank him. But there is not chance that he isn't a top 10 WR prospect of the last 5 or 6 years unless that comes in at 4.6 or something ridiculous like that.

Imo, I think its the opposite. His 40 is almost irrelevant because he can get separation. Even if he ran a 4.3 no one is going to believe he is Will Fuller. If he runs a 4.6 then people will think he is injured.

I don't think its so much as being down on Smith's side. Its just his one flaw. Like Chase's one flaw is that he isnt great at getting separation. Bateman is in the same camp which is why people are making a big deal about his 40 time. Waddle isn't going to wow you with precise route running. Marshall is charmin soft. Rondale Moore doesn't have a lot of film that translates into the NFL.

 

[RaZon]

AC is a pretty good comparison.

Not sure why people are so down on Smith's size. He is just as tough if not tougher than any WR coming out in recent years. Alabama essentially used him as a battering ram at times this last season. There were drives where he would get 4 or 5 touches on a single drive on screens, reverses and short crosses. Dude proved beyond a shadow of a doubt that he is more than tough enough to play at the NFL level.

And his size isn't going to mean he can get jammed at the LOS. He has WAY too much short area quickness for that and an absolute array of moves to get off the LOS. Go look at the Georgia game where they tried to have Campbell jammed and he made him look terrible. Hell Campbell might be a 1st rounder had it not been for that game.

If people want to knock Smith, I would be waiting to see the pro day results and see if his 40 (if he runs it) comes in a little less than stellar. That what I want to see from him before deciding how high to rank him. But there is not chance that he isn't a top 10 WR prospect of the last 5 or 6 years unless that comes in at 4.6 or something ridiculous like that.

AC is a pretty good comparison.

Not sure why people are so down on Smith's size. He is just as tough if not tougher than any WR coming out in recent years. Alabama essentially used him as a battering ram at times this last season. There were drives where he would get 4 or 5 touches on a single drive on screens, reverses and short crosses. Dude proved beyond a shadow of a doubt that he is more than tough enough to play at the NFL level.

And his size isn't going to mean he can get jammed at the LOS. He has WAY too much short area quickness for that and an absolute array of moves to get off the LOS. Go look at the Georgia game where they tried to have Campbell jammed and he made him look terrible. Hell Campbell might be a 1st rounder had it not been for that game.

If people want to knock Smith, I would be waiting to see the pro day results and see if his 40 (if he runs it) comes in a little less than stellar. That what I want to see from him before deciding how high to rank him. But there is not chance that he isn't a top 10 WR prospect of the last 5 or 6 years unless that comes in at 4.6 or something ridiculous like that.

AC is a pretty good comparison.

Not sure why people are so down on Smith's size. He is just as tough if not tougher than any WR coming out in recent years. Alabama essentially used him as a battering ram at times this last season. There were drives where he would get 4 or 5 touches on a single drive on screens, reverses and short crosses. Dude proved beyond a shadow of a doubt that he is more than tough enough to play at the NFL level.

And his size isn't going to mean he can get jammed at the LOS. He has WAY too much short area quickness for that and an absolute array of moves to get off the LOS. Go look at the Georgia game where they tried to have Campbell jammed and he made him look terrible. Hell Campbell might be a 1st rounder had it not been for that game.

If people want to knock Smith, I would be waiting to see the pro day results and see if his 40 (if he runs it) comes in a little less than stellar. That what I want to see from him before deciding how high to rank him. But there is not chance that he isn't a top 10 WR prospect of the last 5 or 6 years unless that comes in at 4.6 or something ridiculous like that.

Smith is a 4.45ish 40 guy which is just ok as an NFL WR, but his initial burst is off the charts, then that agility. I see a can't miss talent here, and don't see his size being a factor at all.

Carter kinda forgotten and it's a shame.

Always marvel at how Jerry Rice was just a 4.6 guy, he sure looked faster than that.

 

[SteelersPride]

Imo, I think its the opposite. His 40 is almost irrelevant because he can get separation. Even if he ran a 4.3 no one is going to believe he is Will Fuller. If he runs a 4.6 then people will think he is injured.

I don't think its so much as being down on Smith's side. Its just his one flaw. Like Chase's one flaw is that he isnt great at getting separation. Bateman is in the same camp which is why people are making a big deal about his 40 time. Waddle isn't going to wow you with precise route running. Marshall is charmin soft. Rondale Moore doesn't have a lot of film that translates into the NFL.

 

[Clayton]

Simms WR rankings

1. Ja'marr Chase
2. Devonta Smith
3. Dyami Brown
4. Jaylen Waddle
5. Kadarius Toney
6. Terrace Marshall Jr

Said Waddle wasn't as fast as the other guys and should spend most of his time in the slot. This is almost an objectively incorrect statement but it wouldn't stun me is Dyami Brown was a sleeper rd1 talent.

Said Jaleon Darden should be rd2. Eskridge and Atwell in the same group.

Bateman and Moore are lower on a few 'scouts' who have been talking lately. Bateman in particular if he ends up going mid-late rd2 is going to make some fanbase probably jump for joy if they get him in that range.

 

[ducky]

Simms WR rankings

1. Ja'marr Chase
2. Devonta Smith
3. Dyami Brown
4. Jaylen Waddle
5. Kadarius Toney
6. Terrace Marshall Jr

Said Waddle wasn't as fast as the other guys and should spend most of his time in the slot. This is almost an objectively incorrect statement but it wouldn't stun me is Dyami Brown was a sleeper rd1 talent.

Said Jaleon Darden should be rd2. Eskridge and Atwell in the same group.

Bateman and Moore are lower on a few 'scouts' who have been talking lately. Bateman in particular if he ends up going mid-late rd2 is going to make some fanbase probably jump for joy if they get him in that range.

Bateman is such a conundrum. Ideally college kids make improvements every year. And you can see it on tape.

With him he actually went backwards this last year.

He flat out should have opted out. I was laughing when I saw him as a top 10 prospect. He is NOT that. But if he had sat out all season, he likely would be thought of as a lock 1st round pick.

Personally I don't see him as any more than a mid round 2nd type of prospect. But as we have seen over the years, it is EXACTLY that type of prospect that can pan out in big ways. Devonte Adams, DJ Chark, Michael Thomas, Courland Sutton, Allen Robinson ect, ect, ect.

Been this way for a long time now. I dont have the time to do it but I bet a deep dive draft analysis would show that taking a 2nd round WR prospect actually pans out better than taking a 1st round. Seems like that anyways over the last decade plus or so anyways.

 

[Clayton]

Bateman is such a conundrum. Ideally college kids make improvements every year. And you can see it on tape.

With him he actually went backwards this last year.

He flat out should have opted out. I was laughing when I saw him as a top 10 prospect. He is NOT that. But if he had sat out all season, he likely would be thought of as a lock 1st round pick.

Personally I don't see him as any more than a mid round 2nd type of prospect. But as we have seen over the years, it is EXACTLY that type of prospect that can pan out in big ways. Devonte Adams, DJ Chark, Michael Thomas, Courland Sutton, Allen Robinson ect, ect, ect.

Been this way for a long time now. I dont have the time to do it but I bet a deep dive draft analysis would show that taking a 2nd round WR prospect actually pans out better than taking a 1st round. Seems like that anyways over the last decade plus or so anyways.

I'm guessing you've seen more of him than I have if you're a Minnesota guy.

I think he could have been a top 10 type of prospect based on what he was doing early on and continued improvement but imo Bateman is a high floor prospect and not a high ceiling prospect. The announcers talking about him as a Freshman were marveling at his speed but the knock on him for the NFL is his lack of 'twitch'. Bateman does show speed on film but its a product mostly of his ability to snatch the ball out of the air without losing a step. So in the NFL I could see him tearing up zone coverage and the questions arise as to whether or not he has the acceleration to keep people from jamming him at the line too much. He seems strong so...probably? I think he'll go rd1.

 

[WNY_FOOTBALL_DUDE]

I don't think we mentioned him on here. Great find by Mr. Simms.

 

[ducky]

Rondale Moore and a 42.5 inch vertical and a 4.3 40 and lightening quick short area tests.

Measured in shorter than expected though.

But the athletic numbers are going to boost him up to the 1st IMO and the 4th WR off the board. Some team is going to look at him as an instant slot/joker playmaker and take him.

 

[Clayton]

Rondale Moore and a 42.5 inch vertical and a 4.3 40 and lightening quick short area tests.

Measured in shorter than expected though.

But the athletic numbers are going to boost him up to the 1st IMO and the 4th WR off the board. Some team is going to look at him as an instant slot/joker playmaker and take him.

Marshall Jr is definitely going to get drafted ahead of him. 5 star, LSU champion, played the same spots as the best WR out of the last draft class. Not a super polished WR but much closer to the ideal 1st round product that can play inside or outside and way less risky.

I'm not sure which team has the luxury to take Moore in rd1. Packers? Thats about it and even then they seem like they have some serious needs.

 

[ducky]

Marshall Jr is definitely going to get drafted ahead of him. 5 star, LSU champion, played the same spots as the best WR out of the last draft class. Not a super polished WR but much closer to the ideal 1st round product that can play inside or outside and way less risky.

I'm not sure which team has the luxury to take Moore in rd1. Packers? Thats about it and even then they seem like they have some serious needs.

That is EXACTLY the team that I could see taking him.

They started flirting with Tyler Ervin in the joker role last year. I could see them looking at Moore for the slot/joker for their offense as a MAJOR upgrade and kind of a "I'm sorry" statement to Rodgers for last year's 1st round pick.

 

[Southieinnc]

So yo

Rondale Moore and a 42.5 inch vertical and a 4.3 40 and lightening quick short area tests.

Measured in shorter than expected though.

But the athletic numbers are going to boost him up to the 1st IMO and the 4th WR off the board. Some team is going to look at him as an instant slot/joker playmaker and take him.

u think a 5'7" WR is going to be picked in 1st round?

 

[ducky]

So yo

u think a 5'7" WR is going to be picked in 1st round?

He's essentially the exact same size as Tyreek Hill with all the same athletic ability.

You don't think that is worth a 1st round pick?

People are so far behind the times in the NFL. Size isn't needed. The game is played is space these days. And defenses can't maul WR's like they used to. You will see way more 1st round sub 5'10" WR's in the 1st round moving forward than you will guys over 6'3". Being too big at WR often means you aren't quick enough to create separation. Long gone is the days where offenses felt good about throwing a less than 50/50 jump ball to a WR. Not when you can drag a speed guy across the field and hit him 70% of the time.

....and he just posted a 42.5" vertical. He plays bigger than he actually is. I just think a team without a ton of pressing needs later in the 1st round could view him as an instant, versatile playmaking threat.

But yeah I'm not sure that he will go 1st round or not but he is certainly in the mix with the combine results he just had.

 

[Clayton]

He's essentially the exact same size as Tyreek Hill with all the same athletic ability.

You don't think that is worth a 1st round pick?

People are so far behind the times in the NFL. Size isn't needed. The game is played is space these days. And defenses can't maul WR's like they used to. You will see way more 1st round sub 5'10" WR's in the 1st round moving forward than you will guys over 6'3". Being too big at WR often means you aren't quick enough to create separation. Long gone is the days where offenses felt good about throwing a less than 50/50 jump ball to a WR. Not when you can drag a speed guy across the field and hit him 70% of the time.

....and he just posted a 42.5" vertical. He plays bigger than he actually is. I just think a team without a ton of pressing needs later in the 1st round could view him as an instant, versatile playmaking threat.

But yeah I'm not sure that he will go 1st round or not but he is certainly in the mix with the combine results he just had.

The problem is that size matters at the college level and his college couldn't get him the football because you need an accurate QB to work with a small target.

Mahomes is good with Hill (and Alex Smith was, too) because Hill is a featured guy in the offense because Hill can track the ball and goes up and gets it downfield if he is covered. CEH isn't a developed receiver and I've seen Mahomes overthrow him a couple of times that a normal receiver would've caught.

The thing with Rondale Moore is that we already knew he was going to kill the combine. Thats not where the questions lie even though its good to see that he is healthy. The WR is a very technical position. Its the reason why WRs usually don't peak at 18 or 19. It usually takes a couple of years to learn the position. He'll either be WR 5, 6, 7, or 8 depending on how he does in interviews and on the chalkboard and where he is at with route running.

That 42.5" vertical is nutty, though. Not a lot of WRs with nutty verticals. Chris Conley? Too small of a sample size for me to really judge and thats Moore as a whole. If he didn't have some really impressive footage as a Freshman then he would be a 3rd rounder. But he does...so...I'm guess mid rd2.