Leake Signs with Cards

[scoutyjones2]

Because management had to save face and sign the player they took a 1 year rental trade on...RF defense is pretty much worthless. They get like 2 plays a game.

Cards don't need a stellar RF defender, they need a more potent offense. 13HRs and 60 RBI's wasn't going to get it done. Piscotty is a super intelligent ball player and plays very good corner defense. He has a better bat than JHey and costs nothing. Glad the Scrubs overpaid for a one time all star and not the Cards...note his only All Star appearance was his rookie year.

 

[dredinis21]

Because management had to save face and sign the player they took a 1 year rental trade on...RF defense is pretty much worthless. They get like 2 plays a game.

Cards don't need a stellar RF defender, they need a more potent offense. 13HRs and 60 RBI's wasn't going to get it done. Piscotty is a super intelligent ball player and plays very good corner defense. He has a better bat than JHey and costs nothing. Glad the Scrubs overpaid for a one time all star and not the Cards...note his only All Star appearance was his rookie year.

Playing devil's advocate here, because A) I don't have a dog in the fight and B) I don't know much about Piscotty....if Piscotty is as good as you make him out to be, then why did the Cards feel it necessary to trade serious prospects for a 1 yr rental that they were not going to re-sign? Serious question.

 

[scoutyjones2]

Playing devil's advocate here, because A) I don't have a dog in the fight and B) I don't know much about Piscotty....if Piscotty is as good as you make him out to be, then why did the Cards feel it necessary to trade serious prospects for a 1 yr rental that they were not going to re-sign? Serious question.

Good question...Piscotty was a prospect who wasn't going to be on the squad this last year but due to a large amount of injuries, he got called into play. The belief going into the 2015 was to have a RF platoon of OT and grich/jay. OT killed himself and a young mother by drinking and driving at crazy speeds so management made a chancey move. They took a risk on a player who fits the Cards style and believed they could woo him to the Cards in this off season.

Piscotty came up earlier due to these issues (injuries and the death) and played 63 games:

305/359/494/853 in 233 AB's. He made solid OF plays and hit 7 HR's with 39 RBI's. He was working on developing more power in the minors with a tweak in his swing because he's a line drive gap hitter to all fields and the Cards wanted him to spend 2015 working on it and making it his tweaked swing. The kid adjusted, and is a Stanford grad with a degree in Atmosphere and Energy Engineering.

His approach at the plate is calm and quiet with a quick bat and good foot skills. Dude's a player.

 

[StanMarsh51]

Good question...Piscotty was a prospect who wasn't going to be on the squad this last year but due to a large amount of injuries, he got called into play. The belief going into the 2015 was to have a RF platoon of OT and grich/jay. OT killed himself and a young mother by drinking and driving at crazy speeds so management made a chancey move. They took a risk on a player who fits the Cards style and believed they could woo him to the Cards in this off season.

Piscotty came up earlier due to these issues (injuries and the death) and played 63 games:

305/359/494/853 in 233 AB's. He made solid OF plays and hit 7 HR's with 39 RBI's. He was working on developing more power in the minors with a tweak in his swing because he's a line drive gap hitter to all fields and the Cards wanted him to spend 2015 working on it and making it his tweaked swing. The kid adjusted, and is a Stanford grad with a degree in Atmosphere and Energy Engineering.

His approach at the plate is calm and quiet with a quick bat and good foot skills. Dude's a player.

The problem with that sample size is that in the 2nd half, the Cards faced a relatively weak crop of opponents' pitching staffs. More than half of his plate appearances were against the 8 worst pitching staffs in baseball (going by team ERA+). You look at Heyward in the 2nd half against that same crop of pitchers, and he hit .318 with an .866 OPS.

 

[dredinis21]

The problem with that sample size is that in the 2nd half, the Cards faced a relatively weak crop of opponents' pitching staffs. More than half of his plate appearances were against the 8 worst pitching staffs in baseball (going by team ERA+). You look at Heyward in the 2nd half against that same crop of pitchers, and he hit .318 with an .866 OPS.

True, but if that is the case and he truly was working on his swing, then his upside hitting .307/.853 vs Heyward hitting .318/.866 during a similar time period seems to prove Scotty's point further, no? Obviously BA and OPS is not the only determiner of success, just using that as an example. However, their numbers are similar enough to assume that what Scotty is saying is not out of the realm of possibility.

 

[Clayton]

I honestly don't think that you can rely on either Heyward or Piscotty to have a predictable offensive production next year. Heyward could be getting better or he could go back to the average bat that he was before. Piscotty is too young to make a prediction. Both should be really good next year but its certainly not something you can take to the bank.

I'd still like to see the Cardinals sign another outfielder.

 

[dredinis21]

I honestly don't think that you can rely on either Heyward or Piscotty to have a predictable offensive production next year. Heyward could be getting better or he could go back to the average bat that he was before. Piscotty is too young to make a prediction. Both should be really good next year but its certainly not something you can take to the bank.

I'd still like to see the Cardinals sign another outfielder.

Fair enough. I didn't think that Heyward was worth the contract that he got given his relative lack of production. By no means am I saying that Heyward sucks, but contracts around 200 mil are typically for game changers like Pujols and Arod and although he's young, his best season in the bigs was arguably his first. Then again, Wrigley is a bandbox and we see an offensive resurgence from him.

 

[scoutyjones2]

Thing is, the Scrubs don't need offense from him, just OBP. They have boppers/run producers, the Cards don't. So they can spend that amount and if he posts the same numbers in 2016 as he did in 2015 while patrolling CF for the Scrubbies, it was money well spent.

 

[navamind]

At first, I read it as (Kelly) Leak.

 

[LASports96]

Mike Leake isn't all that good lol... He has value as an innings eater and good ground ball rates, but he's a pretty meh pitcher to give $80 million dollars to. Now I fully expected him to get something around this contract but this market is fucking crazy.

And also now because Cardinals Magic, he'll be a Cy Young Candidate... WELP

 

[dredinis21]

Mike Leake isn't all that good lol... He has value as an innings eater and good ground ball rates, but he's a pretty meh pitcher to give $80 million dollars to. Now I fully expected him to get something around this contract but this market is fucking crazy.

And also now because Cardinals Magic, he'll be a Cy Young Candidate... WELP

I 100% disagree with the bolded statement above. Leake is an innings eater with a solid career ERA of 3.88 despite half of his starts happening in the launching pad that is Great America Park. There is plenty of value in that. Any pitcher with a sub 4 career ERA can't be considered "not all that good". The Cards have a more neutral home park which should only help Leake. He did pretty good for the Giants after getting off the DL last season aside from one start where he got shelled.

 

[LASports96]

.

 

[LASports96]

ERA/FIP/xFIP

3.88/4.21/3.81

doesn't scream 16 million AAV to me, but like I said the market has blown up when Mike Leake is getting this money. But not surprising.

 

[dredinis21]

ERA/FIP/xFIP

3.88/4.21/3.81

doesn't scream 16 million AAV to me, but like I said the market has blown up when Mike Leake is getting this money. But not surprising.

I'm not denying his contract (and frankly too many) is ridiculous. You argued he is not good. I disagreed on that premise.

 

[StanMarsh51]

I'm not denying his contract (and frankly too many) is ridiculous. You argued he is not good. I disagreed on that premise.

I'd say at best, he's been above average (which imo is a notch below good). He's still young however, so he could certainly elevate his game to a higher level.

 

[StanMarsh51]

True, but if that is the case and he truly was working on his swing, then his upside hitting .307/.853 vs Heyward hitting .318/.866 during a similar time period seems to prove Scotty's point further, no? Obviously BA and OPS is not the only determiner of success, just using that as an example. However, their numbers are similar enough to assume that what Scotty is saying is not out of the realm of possibility.

That's fair...the gap certainly isn't big enough to justify the salary difference. The Cubs must really be hoping that Heyward reaches his ceiling/hype from when he was in the minors (many pegged him as a guy who could hit .300 and go 30/30).