Kipr and McShay Podcast for the Skins

[j_y19]

wow. good to know.

I've been saying BPA all along. You just don't read past the first sentence. I happen to believe that Moses is the BPA in that group, followed by Benjamin. But if we chose Benjamin, I'm fine with it because I believe our scouting department knows 1000% more than you or I about these players.

 

[deanpet21]

Benjamin is not even the best WR never mind the Best overall player.

 

[j_y19]

Benjamin is not even the best WR never mind the Best overall player.

Defined how? By who is left on the board when our pick comes up?

 

[deanpet21]

Yes. Matthews, Robinson, Moncrief and Latimer are all better all around WR's than Benjamin.

 

[j_y19]

According to whom?

 

[Sharkinva]

NO one around here wanted the honey badger last year and thought Thomas and Rambo were much better. I know a few flipped a gasket at even the thought of getting him... guess who started most if not all of the season for the Cards.

 

[Skin'EmAll]

NO one around here wanted the honey badger last year and thought Thomas and Rambo were much better. I know a few flipped a gasket at even the thought of getting him... guess who started most if not all of the season for the Cards.

perfect illustration for Benjamen, but I will say we would have ruined that poor kid's life and career last season if he came to this team. LOL! its about the fit too.

 

[skinsdad62]

NO one around here wanted the honey badger last year and thought Thomas and Rambo were much better. I know a few flipped a gasket at even the thought of getting him... guess who started most if not all of the season for the Cards.

and he wrecked his knee

 

[skinsdad62]

I will simply ask, how many back corner fades did they throw to Reed last year. And as i have stated, Benjamin is more than simply a redzone threat.

For all the work we did at WR, our WR group is still flawed in that we have no size. We are built to be a between the 20's home run threat passing game. BUt I think we have the same issues on 3rd down and in the redzone as we did last year.

how many freaking back corner fades are we going to throw?

and like i said he isnt beating out jackson garcon or roberts any time soon

 

[Sharkinva]

how many freaking back corner fades are we going to throw?

and like i said he isnt beating out jackson garcon or roberts any time soon

First we dont throw many back corner fades because we simply dont have the players to run that route in the redzone, not with any consistency at any rate.

Secondly, why would he need to beat any of them out?? Are you seriously going to tell me that our wonder coach couldnt find plays or situations to use a 6'5" WR any place other than in the redzone?? You telling me that every snap it should be Jackson and Garcon on the field no matter what, and when we go three wide its always going to be roberts?? Unlike O-line, most teams do rotate their WRs if they actually have the depth to do so. If you are sitting there and saying you see no benifit in having Benjamin on this roster, I seriously call BS on that one dude.

 

[skinsdad62]

First we dont throw many back corner fades because we simply dont have the players to run that route in the redzone, not with any consistency at any rate.

Secondly, why would he need to beat any of them out?? Are you seriously going to tell me that our wonder coach couldnt find plays or situations to use a 6'5" WR any place other than in the redzone?? You telling me that every snap it should be Jackson and Garcon on the field no matter what, and when we go three wide its always going to be roberts?? Unlike O-line, most teams do rotate their WRs if they actually have the depth to do so. If you are sitting there and saying you see no benifit in having Benjamin on this roster, I seriously call BS on that one dude.

14 of the 20 td passes we through last year were in the red zone

2 more were at 23 and 24 yds respectively .

those are the numbers

i dont see why @34 i need to take a wr for that alleged need

and you are the one debating that we need the red zone threat and that is what benjamin brings

i do know this our coach likes 2 tes and was successful doing it

and i will go at this again , i dont think a # 4 wr beats out C OG RT DE Dt ILB SS FS CB on the list of needs

i will go further , martaviuos bryant 6-4 donte moncrief 6-2 , devin street 6-3, brandon coleman 6-6 all offer us height and can be had later in the draft

 

[Sharkinva]

14 of the 20 td passes we through last year were in the red zone

2 more were at 23 and 24 yds respectively .

those are the numbers

i dont see why @34 i need to take a wr for that alleged need

and you are the one debating that we need the red zone threat and that is what benjamin brings

i do know this our coach likes 2 tes and was successful doing it

and i will go at this again , i dont think a # 4 wr beats out C OG RT DE Dt ILB SS FS CB on the list of needs

i will go further , martaviuos bryant 6-4 donte moncrief 6-2 , devin street 6-3, brandon coleman 6-6 all offer us height and can be had later in the draft

Skinsdad... .with 1000 yards recieving and 15 TD on 54 receptions I think you could look at him as more than simply a redzone threat. I will give you that might be his biggest plus for the Redskins, but you simply cant overlook it because you want to draft a guy that you HOPE can beat out Polumbus. After all, last year you pretty much figured Compton or some one else would beat him out. As stubborn as you want to be, tell me you honestly think Gruden couldnt or wouldnt find a way to use a guy who caught a TD basically every 3.6 times he touched the ball. And simply put he is better than Bryant, Moncrief, street and Coleman. Why use the 34 pick on the next Mo Hurt who might not be able to beat out Polumbus any way. You dont think we can find yet another backup RT later in the draft??

 

[j_y19]

Here is a great analysis on why you need a big WR and how they are more efficient in the redone:

WR Size & Red-Zone Efficiency - Fantasy Fallout - Rotoworld.com

This isn't an endorsement, per se, of Benjamin, only that we do not have this capability on the team today and we suffer in the red zone because of it.

 

[skinsdad62]

Skinsdad... .with 1000 yards recieving and 15 TD on 54 receptions I think you could look at him as more than simply a redzone threat. I will give you that might be his biggest plus for the Redskins, but you simply cant overlook it because you want to draft a guy that you HOPE can beat out Polumbus. After all, last year you pretty much figured Compton or some one else would beat him out. As stubborn as you want to be, tell me you honestly think Gruden couldnt or wouldnt find a way to use a guy who caught a TD basically every 3.6 times he touched the ball. And simply put he is better than Bryant, Moncrief, street and Coleman. Why use the 34 pick on the next Mo Hurt who might not be able to beat out Polumbus any way. You dont think we can find yet another backup RT later in the draft??

so what ? i have seen numerous 1000 yd wr bust out in the NFL and who said drafting the next mo hurt ? i am saying a number 4 wr isnt that high on my needs list

and just how many footballs do we have ? garcon , jackson reed roberts passes to backs ? how many footballs do we have ?

i certainly think we can find a starting RT later in the draft (round 3 ?) and that would be a great debate if i advocated RT or bust , but i do not . i advocate looking at other needs that are higher in priority rather then a luxury pick

take the RT or bust debate to dean where it belongs

 

[j_y19]

We were rated near the bottom last year in both Red Zone efficiency as well as TD passes in the red zone. Clearly its an issue. One reason is clear. We don't have a physical WR that can go over the opposing DB and grab the ball. We lost 6 games last year by one TD or less. In 5 of those games, we had the ball at the end and were driving yet failed to score. To claim that a physical, Dez type player wouldn't have made a difference in at least some of those games is not being honest.

 

[Sharkinva]

Welcome to the Dark side j_y.

My argument DOES have merit.

 

[j_y19]

Welcome to the Dark side j_y.

My argument DOES have merit.

Oh, I've always agreed that our WR corps is incomplete and I do believe that a talent such as Benjamin is nearly impossible to pass up. But I also believe that this is all a moot argument. He is not going to be there at 34. If he is, I would be hard pressed to find a better player than him on the board.

 

[skinsdad62]

We were rated near the bottom last year in both Red Zone efficiency as well as TD passes in the red zone. Clearly its an issue. One reason is clear. We don't have a physical WR that can go over the opposing DB and grab the ball. We lost 6 games last year by one TD or less. In 5 of those games, we had the ball at the end and were driving yet failed to score. To claim that a physical, Dez type player wouldn't have made a difference in at least some of those games is not being honest.

to claim that it solves everything is equally delusional

plus i can get the tall physical presence later in the draft or by drafting a TE

how much of that rating is attributable to play calling ? run , run pass kick ? ring a bell ?

14 of our 20 tds passes were in the red zone somebody caught them

so please let me know what you want here? a red zone target guy who solves all our red zone woes because he is 6-5 and that has more value then a 10 year starter in the o/line ? or LB or d/line or secondary .

or do you think this guy will bench roberts , djax or garcon ? and regulate reed to oblivion ?

and all of this mind you on our next year super bowl winning team after a division title ? because after all shark you think the promised one will lead us on his white stallion to victory even though we cant block or tackle anyone let alone hold a team under 30 points .

 

[Sharkinva]

to claim that it solves everything is equally delusional

plus i can get the tall physical presence later in the draft or by drafting a TE

how much of that rating is attributable to play calling ? run , run pass kick ? ring a bell ?

14 of our 20 tds passes were in the red zone somebody caught them

so please let me know what you want here? a red zone target guy who solves all our red zone woes because he is 6-5 and that has more value then a 10 year starter in the o/line ? or LB or d/line or secondary .

or do you think this guy will bench roberts , djax or garcon ? and regulate reed to oblivion ?

and all of this mind you on our next year super bowl winning team after a division title ? because after all shark you think the promised one will lead us on his white stallion to victory even though we cant block or tackle anyone let alone hold a team under 30 points .

Dude, you are just being stubborn if you think gruden would ONLY use Benjamin if its first and goal from the nine. In fact WR likely SHOULD be the most rotate position on the field followed closely by DB. You realize gruden carried Wr at one point last year right?? I doubt they carried 7 all year and eight at one point just cause it was cool.

 

[j_y19]

to claim that it solves everything is equally delusional

plus i can get the tall physical presence later in the draft or by drafting a TE

how much of that rating is attributable to play calling ? run , run pass kick ? ring a bell ?

14 of our 20 tds passes were in the red zone somebody caught them

so please let me know what you want here? a red zone target guy who solves all our red zone woes because he is 6-5 and that has more value then a 10 year starter in the o/line ? or LB or d/line or secondary .

or do you think this guy will bench roberts , djax or garcon ? and regulate reed to oblivion ?

and all of this mind you on our next year super bowl winning team after a division title ? because after all shark you think the promised one will lead us on his white stallion to victory even though we cant block or tackle anyone let alone hold a team under 30 points .

Never claimed a tall WR solved everything, said it was one problem.

Most TEs won't do it. You need a WR that can split out wide one on one against a CB. We have aTE that will be our target between the hash marks.

Play calling probably has a huge influence. But why? was it because we didn't have the capabilities we needed to call a full suite of plays?

What do I want? First, to lay the facts out. 6 red zone TDs by WRs is nothing to write home about. Its piss poor. We have red zone scoring issues. Second, I want to win these close games. To do that we need flexibility and capabilities we haven't had in the past. To claim this isn't an issue, that is being delusional. To also think that adding a talent like Benjamin to our capabilities and it wouldn't make a difference is being delusional.

I don't care who gets benched, if anyone. I want the best players out there regardless of their history or contracts.

again, this isn't an endorsement of Benjamin, per se, but only that we need this capability at crucial times in games and we haven't had a go to guy in the red zone for years. Maybe a 5th round big WR could suffice, I don't know of one.