Is This Real About Kelenic?

[SeattleCoug]

 

[wazzu31]

Agreed with the GM part.

Ownership would be a great way to get him here. Theo would be the opposite type President than Mather as far as job duties so a GM would have to be willing assistant type to Theo which there are a lot of those guys out there and quality ones at that. This should be interesting which is a Mariner thing as well. Off field more interesting than on field.

I am really interested in what Manfred and the owners do. IMO this is worse than Sterlings or I think Richardson from the NBA and NFL that the leagues forced them into selling. The remarks about the players is a black eye for sure but he torched the owners as well. Revealing a back door deal with Fauci about having the athletes skipping the line to get vaccines contradicts what all the leagues and politicians have said.

The more I think about it, the more I think taking Mather’s spot in ownership is probably the only way a “baseball” person would take the job right now unless they just promote Dipoto. In a way a sickening thought is guess what beloved former Mariner was out trying to buy the Mets.

 

[wazzu31]

I think that was confirmed wasn’t it? When it comes to Evan White/Kelenic. Evan White wasn’t MLB ready but he signed his extension and was given 1B immediately. Kelenic declined and the Mariners needed OF help all year (which Mather didn’t say though when the contract was offered did he). Granted, there is a good argument of not bringing him up last year in a pointless season and they had a boatload of utility guys they were trying to look at.

 

[SeattleCoug]

I think that was confirmed wasn’t it? When it comes to Evan White/Kelenic. Evan White wasn’t MLB ready but he signed his extension and was given 1B immediately. Kelenic declined and the Mariners needed OF help all year (which Mather didn’t say though when the contract was offered did he). Granted, there is a good argument of not bringing him up last year in a pointless season and they had a boatload of utility guys they were trying to look at.

I do think they are ultimately doing the right thing based on the rules. Not stuff every other team isnt doing. Its just basically them finding a way to Mariner it. However if he plays well and the team starting winning in the next few years no one will care about this.

 

[SeattleCoug]

I am really interested in what Manfred and the owners do. IMO this is worse than Sterlings or I think Richardson from the NBA and NFL that the leagues forced them into selling. The remarks about the players is a black eye for sure but he torched the owners as well. Revealing a back door deal with Fauci about having the athletes skipping the line to get vaccines contradicts what all the leagues and politicians have said.

The more I think about it, the more I think taking Mather’s spot in ownership is probably the only way a “baseball” person would take the job right now unless they just promote Dipoto. In a way a sickening thought is guess what beloved former Mariner was out trying to buy the Mets.

Yea my original thoughts back a couple days ago is that this ultimately becomes a good thing for the franchise in terms of them having to change something. Probably wishful thinking but one can hope

 

[wazzu31]

I do think they are ultimately doing the right thing based on the rules. Not stuff every other team isnt doing. Its just basically them finding a way to Mariner it. However if he plays well and the team starting winning in the next few years no one will care about this.

Winning cures everything. But I can see the issue with the MLBPA because teams are trying to lose while also suppress wages as opposed to NFL and NBA teams still have to have salaries that are what 4 times as much as then entire Oakland organization. The service time honestly wasn’t/isn’t a big deal had baseball kept up with inflation like the NFL and NBA which I think the MLBPA thought it would when they were cool with “screwing the younger guys” and thinking the luxury tax would force small market teams in spending that money instead of pocketing it.

 

[NWinAZ]

unless they just promote Dipoto

I read that is a strong possibility.

 

[wazzu31]

I read that is a strong possibility.

If you have to choose, Jerry or ARod?

 

[NWinAZ]

If you have to choose, Jerry or ARod?

I would choose a hot steamy pile of dog crap over AFraud so...

 

[wazzu31]

I would choose a hot steamy pile of dog crap over AFraud so...

Lol just funny thought of an either or

 

[SeattleCoug]

FWIW

 

[NWinAZ]

FWIW

Leave him his ownership. He fits in well with the rest of the pukes in ownership.

 

[seahawksfan234]

I said this in another thread, but if Kelenic is the star we think he'll become, he might not feel all that loyal to the organization when it comes to future contract negotiations.

I think if the Mariners manipulate his service time he'll be a free agent after the 2026 or 2027 season, and if he decides to test free agency and goes elsewhere, I think we will know who to blame.

 

[wazzu31]

I said this in another thread, but if Kelenic is the star we think he'll become, he might not feel all that loyal to the organization when it comes to future contract negotiations.

I think if the Mariners manipulate his service time he'll be a free agent after the 2026 or 2027 season, and if he decides to test free agency and goes elsewhere, I think we will know who to blame.

True, but the thing is, no one knows how contracts will be like with the new CBA (I think there will still be a strike). The players want the service time gone, but what are they going to give up for it. Maybe a franchise type tag, or like in the NBA where they got the Larry Bird rule of the team he is on can offer more years and more money. My thing as a fan is, the Mariners are putting themselves in the KC Royals situation where they are going to have a rash of young prospects all going to be eligible for free agency at the same time (pre whatever the new CBA is).

 

[seahawksfan234]

True, but the thing is, no one knows how contracts will be like with the new CBA (I think there will still be a strike). The players want the service time gone, but what are they going to give up for it. Maybe a franchise type tag, or like in the NBA where they got the Larry Bird rule of the team he is on can offer more years and more money. My thing as a fan is, the Mariners are putting themselves in the KC Royals situation where they are going to have a rash of young prospects all going to be eligible for free agency at the same time (pre whatever the new CBA is).

I haven't really followed the new CBA so I'll have to defer to you on that, but I do think the players have a legitimate argument when it comes to that. This is purely an anecdotal example but it seems like these days players are ready for the majors earlier than they used to be. I think the whole situation with Kelenic shows that the organization feels he's ready, but doesn't want to put him out there due to the service time issue.

Haven't really given it much thought until writing this, but you're probably right. There will be big changes with the new CBA. Baseball is so much different in terms of player development in comparison to the NBA and NFL, I feel like it would be difficult to try to translate their agreements to that of baseball.

 

[The Q]

True, but the thing is, no one knows how contracts will be like with the new CBA (I think there will still be a strike). The players want the service time gone, but what are they going to give up for it. Maybe a franchise type tag, or like in the NBA where they got the Larry Bird rule of the team he is on can offer more years and more money. My thing as a fan is, the Mariners are putting themselves in the KC Royals situation where they are going to have a rash of young prospects all going to be eligible for free agency at the same time (pre whatever the new CBA is).

expanded playoffs is a really big chip. That makes the owners a lot of money.

 

[wazzu31]

I haven't really followed the new CBA so I'll have to defer to you on that, but I do think the players have a legitimate argument when it comes to that. This is purely an anecdotal example but it seems like these days players are ready for the majors earlier than they used to be. I think the whole situation with Kelenic shows that the organization feels he's ready, but doesn't want to put him out there due to the service time issue.

Haven't really given it much thought until writing this, but you're probably right. There will be big changes with the new CBA. Baseball is so much different in terms of player development in comparison to the NBA and NFL, I feel like it would be difficult to try to translate their agreements to that of baseball.

I truly think owners and the MLBPA are fine with suppressing younger guys salaries or guys who haven’t played yet. It only started becoming an issue with social media IMO. I would hate to be the MLBPA when it comes to finding solutions to this. The more they lessen service the less of the pie the vets get, which is their entire purpose. And a must for the MLBPA is to not put anything that can be interrupted as a salary cap. But it is going to be an ugly negotiations IMO.

The NFL is the best example because no player is drafted and is a top 10 player that year. But problem with the NFL was the rookies were making so much money the middle class got squeezed out. The MLBPA’s main priority has always been to make an upper middle class of veterans. It was the unspoken agreement that they suppress your earning ability until you reach arbitration then teams massively over pay you in free agency. But with the new stats guys in front offices those aren’t happening all over the sport. The Tatis deal without question is the best for him personally but contracts aren’t all suppose to be for the best of the player but the best for the union. Such as with ARod situation where the trade was completed, went to the MLB and MLBPA approval and the MLBPA nixed it because it would’ve “restructured” ARod’s contract.

 

[wazzu31]

expanded playoffs is a really big chip. That makes the owners a lot of money.

Yeah it does, but rumors are players want to shorten the season though. The biggest fight is just going to be within the union on who gets the largest piece of the pie.

 

[The Q]

Yeah it does, but rumors are players want to shorten the season though. The biggest fight is just going to be within the union on who gets the largest piece of the pie.

they need to raise the minimum salary and have a shorter path to fa. So guys are hitting fa at 27/28 and not 30.

 

[wazzu31]

they need to raise the minimum salary and have a shorter path to fa. So guys are hitting fa at 27/28 and not 30.

Service time is an issue that the union wants to fix. But what are they going to give up to get? Keeping the young guys underpaid until they hit their prime helps the union just as much as the owners. I am completely cool with the NFL model of you draft a guy or sign an international free agent and have to come to terms and those are the terms regardless.....but that leads to a salary cap or the interpretation of a salary cap and that is something they will not allow.