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HurricaneDij's Annual Top 50 NBA Players List (Year 15)

trojanfan12

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I am very very tempted to drop LeBron under Tatum and Booker at this point.- gotta do it- results matter. Especially next year those 2 will only get better- LeBron will only continue to regress- if only slightly

Lebron is really hard to rank this year, imo.

Numbers wise, he had an MVP caliber season.

But he can't carry a team like he used to because he can't play defense like he used to. At least not more than a few minutes a game. So, as you mention, results matter and he doesn't have the wins.
 

CitySushi

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ya know what- i like this post a lot

I think that this is true.

it makes me want to push guys like Ball, Garland, VanFleet, SGA up my list.....it makes me want to push down guys like Klay, Middleton down my list.

I am kind of souring on Beal.

honestly- at this point- I kinda want to rank Ball, Garland, SGA, and VanFleet over Beal.

Id really drop Ayton.

considering what Davis has been through- do the Raptors, Hornets, Cavs trade VanFleet, Ball or Garland for him? I kind of dont think so. I think at the very least its a debate.

basically- if I am getting your argument right- you have to give guys credit for being a lead guy- and you have to give guys credit who should only improve- especially when ranking them against guys that are 2nd or 3rd guys- that are more likely to decline.

My only contention with a lead guy is that it their play also has to dictate success of their team. That's why I wouldn't put SGA higher, but could definitely make an argument to rank Ball, VanVleet and Garland higher.

Middleton and Klay are guys that are integral to a teams success. But driving force should always be a consideration (again with the caveat they're bringing success to their teams).
 

HurricaneDij39

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He has also changed the culture in Charlotte.
This is the part that gets me. Changed the culture???

We clearly have different definitions of culture change. Because unless you're hallucinating, Charlotte is the same play-in bubble team they've always been...

Admittedly, I did not realize LaMelo was an all-star this season. That said, the reason I have Dejounte Murray over him is because he was more efficient with less help and averaged close to a triple-double. Again, there was once a time this level of production would guarantee you top ten... Today's league is different, though.

If nothing else, Ball had support in the form of Rozier and Bridges.

I'll comment on Wiggy's list later.
 

CitySushi

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This is the part that gets me. Changed the culture???

We clearly have different definitions of culture change. Because unless you're hallucinating, Charlotte is the same play-in bubble team they've always been...

Admittedly, I did not realize LaMelo was an all-star this season. That said, the reason I have Dejounte Murray over him is because he was more efficient with less help and averaged close to a triple-double. Again, there was once a time this level of production would guarantee you top ten... Today's league is different, though.

If nothing else, Ball had support in the form of Rozier and Bridges.

I'll comment on Wiggy's list later.
Charlotte's win percentage before Lamelo was drafted was .354. His first season with the team they improved to .458. This year the team finished with a .524 winning percentage. That's solid growth in just two years time. He was the Rookie of the year, then followed that with his first all-star birth in his second year.

Most of the team he has in place was there prior to his arrival. Rozier and Bridges were on that .354 team without Lamelo. The team improved by 10 wins his rookie year. They improved by another 10 games this year. C'mon now...


Again his numbers aren't empty stats because they're winning. And yes, he changed the culture. Right from the mouth of Miles Bridges.

"He's always had that swag and brought that to us. That's how we've been playing. Our practices have been different. Our energy, with the crowd during the games is different"

 

msgkings322

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Charlotte's win percentage before Lamelo was drafted was .354. His first season with the team they improved to .458. This year the team finished with a .524 winning percentage. That's solid growth in just two years time. He was the Rookie of the year, then followed that with his first all-star birth in his second year.

Most of the team he has in place was there prior to his arrival. Rozier and Bridges were on that .354 team without Lamelo. The team improved by 10 wins his rookie year. They improved by another 10 games this year. C'mon now...


Again his numbers aren't empty stats because they're winning. And yes, he changed the culture. Right from the mouth of Miles Bridges.

"He's always had that swag and brought that to us. That's how we've been playing. Our practices have been different. Our energy, with the crowd during the games is different"

Wait, you're saying Cane is wrong about something here? Gotta be a 93rd.
 

HurricaneDij39

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Charlotte's win percentage before Lamelo was drafted was .354. His first season with the team they improved to .458. This year the team finished with a .524 winning percentage. That's solid growth in just two years time. He was the Rookie of the year, then followed that with his first all-star birth in his second year.

Most of the team he has in place was there prior to his arrival. Rozier and Bridges were on that .354 team without Lamelo. The team improved by 10 wins his rookie year. They improved by another 10 games this year. C'mon now...


Again his numbers aren't empty stats because they're winning. And yes, he changed the culture. Right from the mouth of Miles Bridges.

"He's always had that swag and brought that to us. That's how we've been playing. Our practices have been different. Our energy, with the crowd during the games is different"

I wouldn't want Bridges to say anything different about his teammate, but if you view the profile of Bridges himself you can't possibly not say he was a different player this season vs what he was during his first three seasons.

And LOL @ anyone that takes Draymond's podcast seriously. Anyone that defends his stupid ass is usually resorted into playing the race card. Cringeworthy.
 

msgkings322

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I wouldn't want Bridges to say anything different about his teammate, but if you view the profile of Bridges himself you can't possibly not say he was a different player this season vs what he was during his first three seasons.

And LOL @ anyone that takes Draymond's podcast seriously. Anyone that defends his stupid ass is usually resorted into playing the race card. Cringeworthy.
Oh like the race card you just played ^^^ ?
 

CitySushi

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I wouldn't want Bridges to say anything different about his teammate, but if you view the profile of Bridges himself you can't possibly not say he was a different player this season vs what he was during his first three seasons.

And LOL @ anyone that takes Draymond's podcast seriously. Anyone that defends his stupid ass is usually resorted into playing the race card. Cringeworthy.
So just ignoring facts to support your narrative. Checks out. Really disappointing.
 

HurricaneDij39

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So just ignoring facts to support your narrative. Checks out. Really disappointing.
So the Hornets improved by a certain amount of games with each season. Good for them, but the end result was still the same - Zero playoff appearances since 2016.

Honestly, I probably would’ve rated Ball a little higher had a realized right off the bat that he was an all-star. That said, when your only modicum of postseason success was a 27-point loss to the Pacers and a 29-point loss to the Hawks you shouldn’t expect a ranking in the 20’s range.

Same goes for Miles Bridges. If these Hornets players are going to generate more respect on my lists they are going to need to perform better when the pressure is on.
 

HurricaneDij39

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One more thing, I’ll pipe down on the Draymond bashing somewhat.

No one that has attended Michigan State is literally stupid, he just insists on doing stupid things. It perturbs me that most need to play the race card in order to defend him. J.J. Redick did so last week.

The reality is the “haters” would feel the same about him if his skin was white, blue, orange, yellow, or purple. Draymond was also validated by the at idiot Memphis weatherman who frankly seems like a piece-of-work trumpie. Draymond needs to stop playing he race card and own up to his own antics.

And yes, I have another good reason to hate on the man after I lost a local NWI follower (a fellow writer) when I was trying to make my point when Draymond went on his Twitter rant over the Nuggets COVID postponement. For a celebrity of his caliber, it is unprofessional to pick internet fights with random Denver fans, yet he suffered zero consequences and I did.

So there’s that. @CitySushi
 

msgkings322

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One more thing, I’ll pipe down on the Draymond bashing somewhat.

No one that has attended Michigan State is literally stupid, he just insists on doing stupid things. It perturbs me that most need to play the race card in order to defend him. J.J. Redick did so last week.

The reality is the “haters” would feel the same about him if his skin was white, blue, orange, yellow, or purple. Draymond was also validated by the at idiot Memphis weatherman who frankly seems like a piece-of-work trumpie. Draymond needs to stop playing he race card and own up to his own antics.

And yes, I have another good reason to hate on the man after I lost a local NWI follower (a fellow writer) when I was trying to make my point when Draymond went on his Twitter rant over the Nuggets COVID postponement. For a celebrity of his caliber, it is unprofessional to pick internet fights with random Denver fans, yet he suffered zero consequences and I did.

So there’s that. @CitySushi
If Charles Barkley had been born in 1990, you'd feel EXACTLY the same about him. He was perceived almost exactly like Draymond, before the internet really happened, more violent even. And now he's cuddly Uncle Chuck. It's going to happen bruh.
 

fightinfunbags

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One more thing, I’ll pipe down on the Draymond bashing somewhat.

No one that has attended Michigan State is literally stupid, he just insists on doing stupid things. It perturbs me that most need to play the race card in order to defend him. J.J. Redick did so last week.

The reality is the “haters” would feel the same about him if his skin was white, blue, orange, yellow, or purple. Draymond was also validated by the at idiot Memphis weatherman who frankly seems like a piece-of-work trumpie. Draymond needs to stop playing he race card and own up to his own antics.

And yes, I have another good reason to hate on the man after I lost a local NWI follower (a fellow writer) when I was trying to make my point when Draymond went on his Twitter rant over the Nuggets COVID postponement. For a celebrity of his caliber, it is unprofessional to pick internet fights with random Denver fans, yet he suffered zero consequences and I did.

So there’s that. @CitySushi
You’re fucked up
 

CitySushi

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So the Hornets improved by a certain amount of games with each season. Good for them, but the end result was still the same - Zero playoff appearances since 2016.

Honestly, I probably would’ve rated Ball a little higher had a realized right off the bat that he was an all-star. That said, when your only modicum of postseason success was a 27-point loss to the Pacers and a 29-point loss to the Hawks you shouldn’t expect a ranking in the 20’s range.

Same goes for Miles Bridges. If these Hornets players are going to generate more respect on my lists they are going to need to perform better when the pressure is on.

Here's the thing:

1) Fan(me and others around here) said that Lamelo changed the Culture. Your response: LMAO what?
2) Teammate said that Lamelo changed the culture. Your response: He's supposed to say that.
3) Opponent and basketball savant (whether you want to admit it or not, he is one) said Lamelo changed the culture. Your response: LOL at anyone that listens to him.

So fans, teammates and opponents all agree he's changed the culture. You're harping on post season success like that's to be expected in his 2nd year in the league when he joined a 23 win team previously and has since lead them to be a 43 win team. The fact that you didn't even know he was an all-star this year is what's really bothersome if you're trying to accomplish a ranking of players and then defending it.
 

CitySushi

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One more thing, I’ll pipe down on the Draymond bashing somewhat.

No one that has attended Michigan State is literally stupid, he just insists on doing stupid things. It perturbs me that most need to play the race card in order to defend him. J.J. Redick did so last week.

The reality is the “haters” would feel the same about him if his skin was white, blue, orange, yellow, or purple. Draymond was also validated by the at idiot Memphis weatherman who frankly seems like a piece-of-work trumpie. Draymond needs to stop playing he race card and own up to his own antics.

And yes, I have another good reason to hate on the man after I lost a local NWI follower (a fellow writer) when I was trying to make my point when Draymond went on his Twitter rant over the Nuggets COVID postponement. For a celebrity of his caliber, it is unprofessional to pick internet fights with random Denver fans, yet he suffered zero consequences and I did.

So there’s that. @CitySushi
See this post highlights the majority of the reason you catch flack around here. It's your fundamental inflexibility in viewing basketball and life in terms of purely black and white, without any grey area in between.

I honestly don't mind one bit that you dislike Draymond. Plenty of other posters around here feel the same way. If I'm being completely honest, if he wasn't on our team I might be inclined to feel the same way about his demonstrativeness on the court. I'm not here to change your opinion. You haven't seen me go after you simply because you hate him as a player. You have seen me come after you for not acknowledging that he knows what he's doing on the court. You can hate a player and still acknowledge what they bring to the table. I hated Kobe as a player but I respected his greatness and still do. I hate Chris Paul. Doesn't mean that I don't appreciate what he's done in this league is absolutely world class and special. You on the other hand throw everything out the window.

To completely discount anything he said because you don't like him is just weird. Even the posters around here who hate him respect his opinion on the game because he's incredibly high IQ when it comes to basketball. There's a reason why as an active player he has a network deal already with TNT.

Lastly, no one hates him because he's black. But the racists tell on themselves. So he's not playing the race card. Draymond's not out here saying people hate him because they're racists. What the hell kind of thinking is that. How is Draymond playing the race card if OTHERS are coming at him with racist comments. That's just idiotic.
 

Shanemansj13

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If Charles Barkley had been born in 1990, you'd feel EXACTLY the same about him. He was perceived almost exactly like Draymond, before the internet really happened, more violent even. And now he's cuddly Uncle Chuck. It's going to happen bruh.
Except Draymond is a mouth breather and Chuck wasn't. He needs to keep that mouth shut, who knows what flies into that trap on a daily basis

 

msgkings322

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Except Draymond is a mouth breather and Chuck wasn't. He needs to keep that mouth shut, who knows what flies into that trap on a daily basis

That's fair. When Barkley has his mouth open it's only to shovel food in there.
 

trojanfan12

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Here's the thing:

1) Fan(me and others around here) said that Lamelo changed the Culture. Your response: LMAO what?
2) Teammate said that Lamelo changed the culture. Your response: He's supposed to say that.
3) Opponent and basketball savant (whether you want to admit it or not, he is one) said Lamelo changed the culture. Your response: LOL at anyone that listens to him.

So fans, teammates and opponents all agree he's changed the culture. You're harping on post season success like that's to be expected in his 2nd year in the league when he joined a 23 win team previously and has since lead them to be a 43 win team. The fact that you didn't even know he was an all-star this year is what's really bothersome if you're trying to accomplish a ranking of players and then defending it.

DAMN...You sunk his battleship.
 

HurricaneDij39

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If Charles Barkley had been born in 1990, you'd feel EXACTLY the same about him. He was perceived almost exactly like Draymond, before the internet really happened, more violent even. And now he's cuddly Uncle Chuck. It's going to happen bruh.
Was two years old in 1990 and obviously didn’t follow basketball at the time. I’m sure he was quite hated back then. But why should Chuck’s actions in 1990 valid Draymond’s in 2022? Shouldn’t times have evolved? :scratch:
 

HurricaneDij39

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Here's the thing:

1) Fan(me and others around here) said that Lamelo changed the Culture. Your response: LMAO what?
2) Teammate said that Lamelo changed the culture. Your response: He's supposed to say that.
3) Opponent and basketball savant (whether you want to admit it or not, he is one) said Lamelo changed the culture. Your response: LOL at anyone that listens to him.

So fans, teammates and opponents all agree he's changed the culture. You're harping on post season success like that's to be expected in his 2nd year in the league when he joined a 23 win team previously and has since lead them to be a 43 win team. The fact that you didn't even know he was an all-star this year is what's really bothersome if you're trying to accomplish a ranking of players and then defending it.
Believe it or not, a #41 ranking is quite warm and fuzzy compared to what one of my Twitter buddies here in NWI said about LaMelo the day Borrego got fired. He calls him a glorified D’Angelo Russell… Time will tell when the next rankings come out if your current stance on Ball is justified.

If you want to live in your Warriors bubble and label Draymond a “basketball savant” then that’s on you. Others like myself who live in different parts of the country have a different approach.

I’ve spent the last couple days in Lansing, Michigan on a minor league baseball trip, so Draymond has been on the mind for other reasons beyond what’s been going on this board.

As someone that blogs young athletes you can imagine I’d be extra sensitive about him flipping off a full stadium of fans with kids present. Are we REALLY going to send the message to our youth that this behavior is OK???

A 25K fine for that was a slap on the hand (not the wrist), literally a high five. He should have been SUSPENDED for a game. Hold his team accountable for enabling that behavior…
 

msgkings322

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Was two years old in 1990 and obviously didn’t follow basketball at the time. I’m sure he was quite hated back then. But why should Chuck’s actions in 1990 valid Draymond’s in 2022? Shouldn’t times have evolved? :scratch:
They have evolved, Dray does less of the stuff that Barkley did. That's my point, what you call some irredeemable thug is a pale echo of the Chuckster, back in the day. Brace yourself dude, Dray gonna be all over the NBA after he's done playing. Just like Chuck.
 
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