Historically Underrated Players

[StanMarsh51]

He was a good pitcher, but I would dare to disagree. IMO, his .518 win % is kind of weak, as was his 4.22 e.r.a. And, he gave up a ton of homers.

However, the guys who use these new fangled metrics probably have something where they can compensate for his pitching in the homer dome, so......?

For Radke's career, (1995-2006), the AL starting pitcher ERA was 4.80 and WHIP was 1.43, compared to Radke's 4.22 ERA and 1.23 WHIP, and that's before taking into account ballpark factors and that he averaged over 200 innings/season for his career. So his ERA is certainly better than it looks on the surface because of him pitching right in the middle of the 'steroid era.'

And regarding the record, you can definitely argue lack of run support hurt him (Twins were never known for their offense). In seasons like 1999 and 2004, he finished top 5 in ERA, but couldn't win 13 games in either of those seasons (while making 33+ starts in each). In 2000, he led the AL in losses despite having an above average ERA.

I'd argue he's underrated.

 

[gunnarthor]

He was a good pitcher, but I would dare to disagree. IMO, his .518 win % is kind of weak, as was his 4.22 e.r.a. And, he gave up a ton of homers.

However, the guys who use these new fangled metrics probably have something where they can compensate for his pitching in the homer dome, so......?

ERA+ is adjusted era. It's not that new fangled. It just tries to adjust era to the ballpark, with 100 being avg, above being better and below being below avg. Radke's ERA+ is 113. For comparison, Josh Beckett's is 111 while his era is 3.94.

 

[HammerDown]

In recent years...

Jeff Bagwell. Seems people don't realize how rare a combination of skills he had.
Kenny Lofton. Not a HOFer, but not that far off either, and certainly worthy of staying on the ballot for more than one year.
Mike Mussina. Anytime you see the HOF discussion threads, his name is casually dismissed while people put Glavine in the HOF, when Mussina was clearly better than Glavine.

There are only two problems with saying Jeff Bagwell was underrated and here they are.

1.) He wasn't underrated.
2.) He used steroids.

Pete Incaviglia was underrated but wouldn't have been if Bagwell had given him a sample of the juice he always begged him for.

 

[iowajerms]

IDK if he is underrated or just lost in history, but Cap Anson.

 

[HammerDown]

Understanding that I am biased, I'd like to put Dale Murphy and Andruw Jones on the list.

From a completely separate bias, I think that Kevin Brown was a bit underrated.

The whole idea of "underrated/overrated" is problematic, since different people rate different players differently. That said, I think that Pudge Rodriguez is underrated by many, probably due to having spent his best years playing for Rangers teams that never got much national attention.

Kevin Brown (HGH) and Pudge Rodriguez (steroids) used PEDs. How can they possibly be underrated?

Who are we going to say next? Slammin Sammy and Rafael "Finger" Palmeiro?

 

[soxfan1468927]

There are only two problems with saying Jeff Bagwell was underrated and here they are.

1.) He wasn't underrated.
2.) He used steroids.

Pete Incaviglia was underrated but wouldn't have been if Bagwell had given him a sample of the juice he always begged him for.

Evidence that Bagwell used steroids? A test? Mitchell Report mention?

 

[HammerDown]

Evidence that Bagwell used steroids? A test? Mitchell Report mention?

Every player in the league at the time knew. He fuckin TOLD Astros reporters "off the record" that he did. Why do you think the HoF will never let him in?

 

[JR Hart]

IF PED use is a DQ from being mentioned as a great player. Then let's exclude at least 70% of all players who played between 1985 and 2005. Anyone who doesn't think that tons of players got away with it, is an absolute fool.

 

[JR Hart]

Underrated players

Tony Oliva

Cesar Cedeno

Both fantastic in their primes

 

[da55bums]

Tori Hunter will be one of the most unrated players...just look at his career...as long as he never gets associated with PED's extending his career...he will never be a high voted guy when his time is up.

 

[DragonfromTO]

I could name quite a few, a lot of good choices have already been named. One pitcher and one hitter, both recent enough that people will know them

Kevin Appier
Will Clark

 

[DragonfromTO]

Every player in the league at the time knew. He fuckin TOLD Astros reporters "off the record" that he did. Why do you think the HoF will never let him in?

His percentage has steadily risen in the 3 years he's been on the ballot and he was at 60% on the last ballot, strongly suggesting that he'll make it before his 15 years are up. Are there any steroid users whose HoF results look like that? McGwire and Palmeiro are losing votes every year, not gaining them. And Bagwell even gained votes last year when there was a bulge of new names on the ballot.

 

[Logicallylethal]

Frank Thomas

 

[Brahmsian]

I watched Cedeno when he was, for a very short time, with my native city's '89ers, then a Houston farm club.

For a couple of months they had Cedeno batting 3rd with John Mayberry batting 4th.

Can you imagine those two against AAA pitching?

Can you imagine the publicity Cesar would have gotten if he'd played for a New York team?

 

[gunnarthor]

Rocky Colvito. I bet most people don't even know who he was but he was a very good hitter for 10 years.

 

[ImSmartherThanYou]

There are only two problems with saying Jeff Bagwell was underrated and here they are.

1.) He wasn't underrated.
2.) He used steroids.

Pete Incaviglia was underrated but wouldn't have been if Bagwell had given him a sample of the juice he always begged him for.

You're the expert, I guess.

 

[ImSmartherThanYou]

Tori Hunter will be one of the most unrated players...just look at his career...as long as he never gets associated with PED's extending his career...he will never be a high voted guy when his time is up.

I looked at his career. Meh. He hasn't been particularly good.

He was never a particularly good hitter. Solid but unspectacular career line of .278/.335/.466 with a 111 OPS+. And his defense was always overrated. He was good, but won a shit ton of gold gloves based on highlight reel catches. Meanwhile, I've never seen an outfielder turn more singles into triples in my life by diving for balls he had no chance to catch.

And for all this he's made 5 all-star teams, won a bunch of awards, and received MVP votes in 4 seasons. Hard to consider that underrated.

 

[steveringo]

How about Bernie Williams? He was consistantly above average for a long time... But I haven't heard much about him sice he "retired".



And, here's B/R's list. I saw some names I had forgotten about...

The 50 Most Underrated MLB Players of All Time | Bleacher Report

 

[gunnarthor]

I looked at his career. Meh. He hasn't been particularly good.

Hasn't been particularly good? Are you trying to troll people? His OPS+ as a center fielder was 109, as a RF, he's posted a 119 OPS+. 109 for a centerfielder is pretty good. He's amassed basically 50 WAR in 15 seasons, which is actually around the borderline HOF list. He has over 2000 career hits and nearly 800 extra base hits. He's posted an .858 OPS in 146 post season games. I don't think he's underrated (he's made nearly 150m and every team talks about how great he is) but to say he isn't "particularly good" is flat out wrong. Most ML players will never have close to his career.

 

[gunnarthor]

How about Bernie Williams? He was consistantly above average for a long time... But I haven't heard much about him sice he "retired".

I think it's pretty hard for a Yankee to be underrated but if someone was, it would probably be him.