Hart Trophy Finalists

[thedddd]

agreed. sorry to jump down your throat there. i just hate the east coast bias thing. but i'm a west coast girl, so i guess it's natural since i always feel like my guys get slighted.

but i definitely agree on the publicity stunt. player voted awards are much better

Trust me I can see why you would feel that way. It does seem to happen A LOT.

Heck look at MLB if you aren't in Boston/NY then baseball doesn't exist.

 

[jstducky09]

Heck look at MLB if you aren't in Boston/NY then baseball doesn't exist.

yes! the two teams I hate the most. the entire darn sport of baseball exists only around these 2 teams!

 

[dare2be]

Crosby wasn't there at the end of the season, and Ovechkin wasn't at the beginning of the season.

There is a difference, however. Crosby wasn't there because he missed games due to injury. OV wasn't there because he forgot he was playing hockey.

 

[Darkstone42]

There is a difference, however. Crosby wasn't there because he missed games due to injury. OV wasn't there because he forgot he was playing hockey.

When determining who added the most net value to his team, the reason is irrelevant, really.

 

[dash]

When determining who added the most net value to his team, the reason is irrelevant, really.

I read that post in a Leonard Nimoy voice

 

[DaBoltsNIsles]

There is a difference, however. Crosby wasn't there because he missed games due to injury. OV wasn't there because he forgot he was playing hockey.

The difference is this, Pittsburgh would have made the playoffs without Crosby. I don't think Washington makes it without Ovi going nuts in the second half of the season. I know the Isles don't make it without Tavares.

 

[Jims_Doors]

The difference is this, Pittsburgh would have made the playoffs without Crosby. I don't think Washington makes it without Ovi going nuts in the second half of the season. I know the Isles don't make it without Tavares.

No offense, but that can easily be twisted around to "the Isles almost didn't make it with Tavares"

 

[juliansteed]

Taverres should and probably will win it. I don't believe in any conspiracy theories. And even if I did, it isn't hard to think up a reason why the league might want it to goto a John Tavarres.

I have no problem with Crosby being nominated. He was dominant enough during the time in which he did play to at least somewhat overcome the the fact he missed a lot of games. Not enough to win it, but enough to be nominated.

 

[DaBoltsNIsles]

I find it amazing that Toews or Kane wasn't nominated for the Hart Trophy. The Blackhawks had the best record in the entire league & so far not 1 member of the Blackhawks roster has been nominated for an award. Sorry, but I think it's wrong.

 

[Comeds]

Taverres should and probably will win it. I don't believe in any conspiracy theories. And even if I did, it isn't hard to think up a reason why the league might want it to goto a John Tavarres.

I have no problem with Crosby being nominated. He was dominant enough during the time in which he did play to at least somewhat overcome the the fact he missed a lot of games. Not enough to win it, but enough to be nominated.

I just think there were better choices. If another player duplicated his numbers and time played - but was not named Sidney Crosby - I doubt that player would be nominated.

 

[elocomotive]

In the end (based on the nominees), Tavares should win the Hart and Crosby should win the Lindsay. OV is the runner-up for both.

 

[juliansteed]

I just think there were better choices. If another player duplicated his numbers and time played - but was not named Sidney Crosby - I doubt that player would be nominated.

You might be right. I don't think Crosby was an obvious choice to be nominated but don't think it was highway robbery that he was either. Same for Ovechkin. To me Tavarres is the clear winner of this award and the other 2 nominations could have been 2 of any number of guys including these 2 guys.

 

[PhillyPhaithful48]

Says a lot coming from philly.....

That I think Crosby should win. He was hurt for weeks before anyone actually caught up to him in scoring. His stats for an even shorter short season were unreal.

That said, I really like Tavares and of course would like to see him win it. Who deserves it most? I'm leaning towards Sid

 

[Comeds]

If I was voting I'd vote for OV. He carried the team into the playoffs. I guess the same could be said for Tavares.

 

[Forty_Sixand2]

It is Ryan Clowe and it is not even close!

 

[DChero]

Why don't we ever do polls for these types of things?

I'm trying to take my mind off of the playoffs right now, so I'm jumping back into the regular season discussions, heh.

Here's my issue with Crosby not getting it. It seems like he gets penalized because he plays on a good team. Yeah, the Penguins would do better without Crosby than the Isles would without Tavares, but does that measure their exact value or the lack of value around them? Could the Penguins win the Cup without Crosby? Could the Isles win the Cup with Tavares?

They play the same position so this shouldn't be that difficult. Crosby finished the season with better numbers even though Tavares played more games. How does that not scream "more valuable?" Is showing up and not helping a team better than being on the bench and not helping?

Measuring defensive ability is difficult because we won't all agree on the variables, but we can measure offense. Since they're both forwards, that's a lot to go by.

Crosby: 36 games - 15g - 41a - 56p - +26 - .543 FO%
Tavares: 48 games - 28g - 19a - 47p - -2 - .494 FO%

Which one do you think adds more value? To me, Crosby contributed more to his team's offense in 36 games than Tavares could in 48. This is why I believe that Crosby deserves the Hart as adding the most value to his team.

/Sorry about all the freaking questions in this

 

[awaz]

i think it depends on if you look at it as relative value to the team, or overall value.

if you have $100 and someone gives you a $50, that $50 is really valuable relatively speaking.

if you have $1,000,000 and someone gives you a $100, it's really not that valuable to you, but it's more valuable than a $50.

if case #1 is what you look at, tavares or OV wins. if case #2 is, crosby is the winner.

i look at it in terms of case #1 because the award for case #2 is called the ted lindsay (or art ross i guess).

 

[dash]

Here's my issue with Crosby not getting it. It seems like he gets penalized because he plays on a good team. Yeah, the Penguins would do better without Crosby than the Isles would without Tavares, but does that measure their exact value or the lack of value around them?

I think Toews was penalized for the very same reason, but since he plays in the West and there was no inter-conference play this season, the Eastern writers forgot about him.

Could the Penguins win the Cup without Crosby?

Possibly, but it would be a heck of a lot tougher.

Could the Isles win the Cup with Tavares?

They couldn't win it with him (still a few too many gaps on the team, but they're getting closer)

 

[pixburgher66]

Nothing wrong with having that opinion. I do agree that people don't want Sid to win it merely because of the name. His numbers were crazy good. I still would vote for JT for value in his situation. That said, no one is as consistent as Sid. The guy doesn't have too many off nights.

 

[DChero]

i think it depends on if you look at it as relative value to the team, or overall value.

if you have $100 and someone gives you a $50, that $50 is really valuable relatively speaking.

if you have $1,000,000 and someone gives you a $100, it's really not that valuable to you, but it's more valuable than a $50.

if case #1 is what you look at, tavares or OV wins. if case #2 is, crosby is the winner.

i look at it in terms of case #1 because the award for case #2 is called the ted lindsay (or art ross i guess).

I would argue that it is about case #2 here because we're talking about 3 forwards. Can anyone make a case that one is better at defense over another? The +/- is subjective to the overall team in a lot of cases, but FO% to me is a big factor for the defensive side because it's an opportunity to directly defend the puck from your opponent. Crosby is known to do this regularly on the Penguins penalty kill. The reason that I didn't put up OV's numbers is because his don't really apply across the board in the same way as the two centers.