Gotta say I'm ok with not overpaying players

[chillerdab]

This offseason we let our QB go for nothing and then gave up one of our best young players and a valuable pick for a worse, older QB.

We also dumped our first REAL GM of my lifetime thanks to Allen and his BS.

What are we supposed to be happy about?

If GMSM was "the first real GM of your lifetime," then you haven't been around for very long, have you?

GMSM was here for like a minute. His track record was ok, but it wasn't unbelievable. I would have liked him to stay. He doesn't seem that worse for wear now - running his draft whatever out of his home in the midwest somewhere (Denver, maybe)?

It takes two to tango. If KC didn't want to be here, that's on him. The OTP wants the reason KC isn't here to be about Bruce Allen, which it could be, or it could be - as I CALLED IT LAST SUMMER - about the fact that he's a greedy SOB who wants to make as much money as possible, period.

His fully guaranteed ridiculous contract from the Vikings, that is only 3 years long, which gives him another time to cash in on free agency suggests exactly what I said last summer - that he's in it for the money. Period.

Bruce Allen doesn't seem to be getting in the way of free agents signing here. Alex Smith wanted to be here, and apparently other teams offered more. Richardson wants to be here. Scandrick wanted to be here.

You are, of course, free to subscribe to the "Everything is awful" brand of thinking. Lord knows, misery loves company.

There's plenty to be ok with, with regards to the Redskins.

 

[chillerdab]

if you had been right a tenth as often as shark you might have some backing chill. We always have a choice to read or not read. Not to mention shark does not get involved in all the name calling that you have been exhibited in the past few posts. My guess is since most don't agree with you, you are getting frustrated and your temper is has got the better of you.

I'm right at least as often as sharkinva is, though I don't feel the need to make it everybody's business. Sorry. Perhaps I should. I've been here as long as the OTP has, and have 1/30th the posts.

I don't give a crap if the OTP gets involved in the name calling or not. I'm not claiming the moral high ground. I'm neither frustrated or angry.

I feel like calling a spade a spade right now at this moment. If YOU don't like it, sporty, feel free to take your own advice.

 

[Sharkinva]

That is NOT what I am doing, OTP. I did NOT call what Bruce is doing "a smash bang job."
I'm sorry you can't comprehend what you read. That must be hard for you.

Ah forgive me for embellishing a little on what i suspect your intent was on this post.

So, if I comprehend you correctly, you arent saying Bruce is doing a great job, just a good job in light of what he took over eight years ago. Sorry if my standards are not centered around a great cap management style when accompanied by a poor over all win loss record, poor talent evaluation, a generally spotty draft record, and an over all lack of accountability for the man in charge.

I mean yea its awesome we arent trying to win the off season award for most money given to other teams free agents. But if you dont find it a little disconcerting that this team seems to end up chasing positions and when it does, going overkill because we have ignored those positions since Bruce got here. Well that makes me wonder what would be high praise for Bruce.

But again.. for the record mind you, Bruce Allen has not even done an OK job considering that we have spent $67M in guaranteed money just on starting QBs over the last six years... only to be starting over at the position.

So yea, Bruce does not get Kudos for cleaning up his own mess in my book.

MInd you thats me giving him a pass on the bounty of draft picks we have thrown at the position in one way or another just since he got here.

 

[Sharkinva]

I'm right at least as often as sharkinva is, though I don't feel the need to make it everybody's business. Sorry. Perhaps I should. I've been here as long as the OTP has, and have 1/30th the posts.

I don't give a crap if the OTP gets involved in the name calling or not. I'm not claiming the moral high ground. I'm neither frustrated or angry.

I feel like calling a spade a spade right now at this moment. If YOU don't like it, sporty, feel free to take your own advice.

Now that wouldnt be a comment about my color would it?? ( just curious)

 

[chillerdab]

Ah forgive me for embellishing a little on what i suspect your intent was on this post.

So, if I comprehend you correctly, you arent saying Bruce is doing a great job, just a good job in light of what he took over eight years ago. Sorry if my standards are not centered around a great cap management style when accompanied by a poor over all win loss record, poor talent evaluation, a generally spotty draft record, and an over all lack of accountability for the man in charge.

I mean yea its awesome we arent trying to win the off season award for most money given to other teams free agents. But if you dont find it a little disconcerting that this team seems to end up chasing positions and when it does, going overkill because we have ignored those positions since Bruce got here. Well that makes me wonder what would be high praise for Bruce.

But again.. for the record mind you, Bruce Allen has not even done an OK job considering that we have spent $67M in guaranteed money just on starting QBs over the last six years... only to be starting over at the position.

So yea, Bruce does not get Kudos for cleaning up his own mess in my book.

Nobody cares what your "Redskins GM" standards are. It is irrelevant to this post. I mean, maybe SOMEBODY cares what your standards are, but I certainly don't. You're not a GM. You've never been a GM. You don't know anybody who has ever been a GM. You don't have all the information that the Redskins GM has.

Bruce Allen is not responsible for the win/loss record any more than KC is. That's not accurate. Or bright.
The majority of the last few drafts that Bruce Allen has been a part of are STILL on the Redskins Roster. You are also bemoaning the fact that a Bruce Allen drafted player was traded this offseason to the Chiefs.

As for your incoherent mumblings about chasing positions and going overkill. I don't know what to make of it. It sounds made up.

 

[chillerdab]

Now that wouldnt be a comment about my color would it?? ( just curious)

Yup. Got me. It was a comment about your color. I could've chose the ever popular "call an orange an orange" idiom, but I decided to add race to the mix.

Just for kicks.

 

[Sharkinva]

Yup. Got me. It was a comment about your color. I could've chose the ever popular "call an orange an orange" idiom, but I decided to add race to the mix.

Just for kicks.

For the record, that was my semi sarcastic way of saying, lighten the fuck up.

 

[Sharkinva]

Nobody cares what your "Redskins GM" standards are. It is irrelevant to this post. I mean, maybe SOMEBODY cares what your standards are, but I certainly don't. You're not a GM. You've never been a GM. You don't know anybody who has ever been a GM. You don't have all the information that the Redskins GM has.

Bruce Allen is not responsible for the win/loss record any more than KC is. That's not accurate. Or bright.
The majority of the last few drafts that Bruce Allen has been a part of are STILL on the Redskins Roster. You are also bemoaning the fact that a Bruce Allen drafted player was traded this offseason to the Chiefs.

As for your incoherent mumblings about chasing positions and going overkill. I don't know what to make of it. It sounds made up.

Three things then

1. If my opinion doesnt matter, why argue it or try to some how prove it wrong.

2. A GM in this case is directly responsible for the talent we put on the field. Bruce has final say in what players we sign or dont sign, who we try to keep or let go. The buck stops with him. As the man buying the groceries as it were, he is directly involved in WHAT goes onto the field and hence plays just as big a role in wins and losses as the Coach, and the owner.

3. By the concept of chasing positions.... how long have we been chasing the other OLB position?? How many draft picks and roster spots have we used trying to chase that elite Pass Rusher to go opposite Kerrigan?? And thats just that position. BUt here is the real hint for you... How many players has Bruce given up on for "Cap Reasons" and "The Good of the team" who have gone to other places and either started or played key roles on other teams that are considered good? Mean while we are once again starting over?

 

[skinsdad62]

how does anyone get " sick and tired " being her 3 yrs and having less then 600 posts ? that averages to about twice a month . you must not have a lot of patience

bruce allen has like a 396 win percentage here . that doesnt cut the mustard and the redskins have been drama central during his entire reign

KC's cost is a direct result of the skins FO setting his market . 28 mil fully guaranteed for 3 years with an NFC title game appearance team seems like a move to a superbowl to me

the last 3 years with KC at the helm has been the best stretch of football this team has had in 2 decades

well he is gone now so now are we a better team ? in my opinion no . we got older and less skilled at qb , and at CB . the teams needs are still there . we lost 2 good starting cbs , we lost depth at OLB TM and JR , we havent added any d/lineman we lost our starting og/c , we signed an unproven wr we lost depth at wr , we still have an albatross safety and we lost a top 100 pick in the process

dean talks about FM and anderson but who takes their places ? we have the same medical staff so injuries wont be an issue ?

i think at best even if all the unproven talents does well , at best we hover around 500 . i dont think we got better

 

[Sportster 72]

For the record, that was my semi sarcastic way of saying, lighten the fuck up.

I think chill is butt hurt that no one agrees with him. So he has taken to name calling etc.

I like his statement that he was right a year ago when you shark predicted the outcome 3 years ago. Some where in there chill forgets that Cousin's would have signed at the end of 2015 for $19 million but SM and BA low balled him told him the only way they would pay him $19 million was on the tag. They wanted a prove year which Cousin's gave them, he bet on himself and won. Then after a 2nd year chill got it all figured out. Maybe chill was more selective back in 2015 or not here and cannot remember that far back. Who knows. Edge to shark three years ago.

From the 2014 draft the Redskins have Morgan Moses left. Gone this year, Murphy, Breeland, Long and Grant. No one else made the team.

From the 2015 draft - Preston Smith, Crowder and Spaight are still on the team. Kojo has been released and re-signed due to injuries. Everyone else is gone.

From the 2016 draft - Doctson and Ioannidis are still here. Fuller was traded. Keith Marshall may or may not be here. The rest are gone.

I assume you are referencing the 2017 (one year ago) players as mostly still here. From the 2014-2016 draft the team only has 6 players. I would not consider those good drafts.

 

[j_y19]

@chillerdab, I have a question. Just WHAT is there to be so optimistic about with this team? The FO has continued to make bone headed decisions that has taken positions of strength and made them weaknesses time and again. How is that even considered being "OK"? There is a difference between being OK with not overpaying for marginal players and being able to evaluate talent to know who is worth the money. Just show me one instance where Allen has shown that he can make that evaluation. I'd love to know what personnel moves that Bruce Allen has made that has actually made this team better in your opinion.

 

[Skins2021]

@chillerdab, I have a question. Just WHAT is there to be so optimistic about with this team? The FO has continued to make bone headed decisions that has taken positions of strength and made them weaknesses time and again. How is that even considered being "OK"? There is a difference between being OK with not overpaying for marginal players and being able to evaluate talent to know who is worth the money. Just show me one instance where Allen has shown that he can make that evaluation. I'd love to know what personnel moves that Bruce Allen has made that has actually made this team better in your opinion.

He may just be a troll who follows Shark around these boards.

The team has been utterly dysfunctional since Snyder bought the team. The worst part about it is that every time you think Snyder and co have turned over another leaf they immediately revert back to their old ways and rip your heart out again.

At least, IMO, Snyder and Allen arent being subtle about it anymore.

 

[gkekoa]

I think chill is butt hurt that no one agrees with him. So he has taken to name calling etc.

I like his statement that he was right a year ago when you shark predicted the outcome 3 years ago. Some where in there chill forgets that Cousin's would have signed at the end of 2015 for $19 million but SM and BA low balled him told him the only way they would pay him $19 million was on the tag. They wanted a prove year which Cousin's gave them, he bet on himself and won. Then after a 2nd year chill got it all figured out. Maybe chill was more selective back in 2015 or not here and cannot remember that far back. Who knows. Edge to shark three years ago.

From the 2014 draft the Redskins have Morgan Moses left. Gone this year, Murphy, Breeland, Long and Grant. No one else made the team.

From the 2015 draft - Preston Smith, Crowder and Spaight are still on the team. Kojo has been released and re-signed due to injuries. Everyone else is gone.

From the 2016 draft - Doctson and Ioannidis are still here. Fuller was traded. Keith Marshall may or may not be here. The rest are gone.

I assume you are referencing the 2017 (one year ago) players as mostly still here. From the 2014-2016 draft the team only has 6 players. I would not consider those good drafts.

I would say the 2014 draft was very good. Just because we were too stupid to resign these guys, doesn’t make the draft bad. Murphy, Moses, Breeland, and Long are true starters in the league.

2015 was good too. We got three starters, one of which is All Pro.

2016 and 2017 are too early to tell.

 

[Sharkinva]

I would say the 2014 draft was very good. Just because we were too stupid to resign these guys, doesn’t make the draft bad. Murphy, Moses, Breeland, and Long are true starters in the league.

2015 was good too. We got three starters, one of which is All Pro.

2016 and 2017 are too early to tell.

Finding talent has improved (slightly) over the past 4-6 years, so the identification portion has improved. For that I give Bruce SOME credit because he has been willing to a degree to listen to those around him initially. But the rub is, if you find talent, bring it into your organization and develop it....

You cant simply say well if I cant keep it for cheap, then I will just let it walk and start all over. In most other business, that would be like hiring a kid straight out of college, paying for said kid to get his masters degree, then saying well I realize you have improved your skill set, but I want you to work for less than what you are worth. Otherwise I will just go hire another kid out of college and start all over.

 

[Sportster 72]

I would say the 2014 draft was very good. Just because we were too stupid to resign these guys, doesn’t make the draft bad. Murphy, Moses, Breeland, and Long are true starters in the league.

2015 was good too. We got three starters, one of which is All Pro.

2016 and 2017 are too early to tell.

No argument from me gk, we brought in talent that others value after their rookie contract. You have to question why our FO does not value these guys. I know we can't keep them all but you do have to keep some or as shark said we just keep re-starting/rebuilding. Our FO operates like a minor league team, we develop and then send them off for others to reap the benefits from.

 

[gkekoa]

No argument from me gk, we brought in talent that others value after their rookie contract. You have to question why our FO does not value these guys. I know we can't keep them all but you do have to keep some or as shark said we just keep re-starting/rebuilding. Our FO operates like a minor league team, we develop and then send them off for others to reap the benefits from.

Well you see...they aren’t quite old enough after their first contract to pay them.

 

[Stymietee]

Actually, our success was perfectly aligned with KC. We were a floundering mess until he took the reigns. That is why the FO gets no credit. If we continue to improve, then they get credit.

Just asking...Did not the floundering change and KC success both perfectly line up with the hiring of J. Gruden?

 

[Sharkinva]

Just asking...Did not the floundering change and KC success both perfectly line up with the hiring of J. Gruden?

Not really, they sucked ass Grudens first year with that other QB.

Just saying.

 

[gkekoa]

Just asking...Did not the floundering change and KC success both perfectly line up with the hiring of J. Gruden?

Not quite. We sucked in 2014.

 

[Stymietee]

Not really, they sucked ass Grudens first year with that other QB.

Just saying.

Kirk was part of that suckage too, just saying.