Game #4 Blues vs Sharks 7:30pm

[MacJ88]

I'm too tired to type up a well thought out response so I will just keep it short and sweet. I agree with Rules 100%. Dougie knows he is on the hot seat, give him a year to clean up his mess and if it doesn't lead us to a cup, hopefully it will at least set us up for a decent future. Nobody knows this team better than him, he just needs to prove it to us now by cutting the dead weight. Goodnight fellas, it was a rough one but as always, it was a pleasure.

 

[sjrules99]

Maybe it's the short term frustration talking, but I haven't seen toughness in this team for many years. I've seen a team that's good enough to get to the playoffs every year and frankly that's not good enough. Even the Ducks have a Cup and why, because they were willing to take some reasonable risks.

I'm sick of seeing this team get outworked and after seeing years of Wilson and TMac, I dont think it's a problem with the coaching (though TMac is not without his shortcomings this year) as much as it is a problem with personnel.

And especially yes, I think Marleau is a big problem.
He is a product of a bygone era and this franchise has passed him by. I say throw him a nice ceremony on the way out but he cannot continue to be a Shark if this franchise is going to be Cup bound.

That and they drafted getzlaf and perry in 03 along with being the destination that niedermeyer wanted with his bro. Granted, if dougie had the opportunity to pull the trigger on a pronger deal and didnt, then that was a fuckup of the Nth degree, but that was not confirmed as far as I know.

I agre 100% on marleau. Though, not on the coaching. They've had 2 coaches under DW. Ron Wilson, who is a terrrrible coach, as clearly seen in SJ and in TOR. He sucks, and though dougie had the slow trigger, he did finally pull it. And then there's tmac, who simply does not know how to coach the game. His PK numbers are enough to can him right now, since that is all coaching, and we all know that it's his system, not the players, that are the problem there. A good motivator would do wonders.

If there is one gigantic failure for dougie, it has been in his coach selection. He has not found the right man for that very tough job. He's bound to fire tmac after this year. If he does, then give the new coach a year before calling for dougie's head.

 

[Mr. Teal]

Ultimately I want the guy who's going to take us to the promised land and if TMac isn't the guy, so be it.

 

[CJdublé]

I really do feel bad for Jumbo, Burns, and Nemo...they were playing good solid playoff hockey in my opinion while everyone else wasn't quite there. There is a good chance Jumbo will be our shot leader (currently 3rd), face off leader, +/- leader, TOI (of forwards) leader, and point leader in the playoffs (however short that may be). I know this board loves to rip on people, but I have been really happy with Joe's play.

 

[MrFlyingV]

That and they drafted getzlaf and perry in 03 along with being the destination that niedermeyer wanted with his bro. Granted, if dougie had the opportunity to pull the trigger on a pronger deal and didnt, then that was a fuckup of the Nth degree, but that was not confirmed as far as I know.

I agre 100% on marleau. Though, not on the coaching. They've had 2 coaches under DW. Ron Wilson, who is a terrrrible coach, as clearly seen in SJ and in TOR. He sucks, and though dougie had the slow trigger, he did finally pull it. And then there's tmac, who simply does not know how to coach the game. His PK numbers are enough to can him right now, since that is all coaching, and we all know that it's his system, not the players, that are the problem there. A good motivator would do wonders.

If there is one gigantic failure for dougie, it has been in his coach selection. He has not found the right man for that very tough job. He's bound to fire tmac after this year. If he does, then give the new coach a year before calling for dougie's head.

TMac took Ronnie's team and started 28-3 his first year?. That team was pounding goals and 50 shots a game. It has been downhill since. That President's Cup team loses to Anaheim in the 1st Round and TMac badly outcoached by Carlyle. You wonder what would have been if Dougie had hired a veteran coach over a newbie with this team at its peak.

The one constant thru all these teams is Marleau. He was there for the Calgary upset, Edmonton upset, Dallas upset, Anaheim upset, and Chicago upset (although I think Chicago was better even though Sharks had home ice). But that is alot of playoff failures when you are the favorite. He sets the tone for the blaise performances we have seen. It is a damn shame. I look back at this decade and wonder what could have been. Marleau epitomizes this quote from the Bronx Tale:

"The saddest thing in life is wasted talent, and the choices you make will shape your life forever".

Marleaus legacy? A "leader" on team that perpetually fails in the playoff and his name never to be engraved on the Cup.

 

[madcap9999]

How many of you guys would be willing to give up a year of playoff contention to build up a new team without Mr. Cancer that's well-coached from the ground up? I would.

 

[RaiderZar]

How many of you guys would be willing to give up a year of playoff contention to build up a new team without Mr. Cancer that's well-coached from the ground up? I would.

I actually consider this year nearly at that level anyway. We have no business being the PO's this year, so yeah, I'm on board. :ss:

 

[MrFlyingV]

How many of you guys would be willing to give up a year of playoff contention to build up a new team without Mr. Cancer that's well-coached from the ground up? I would.

Most definitely. It is rebuilding time for sure here in San Jose.

 

[Cmon_WTF]

How many of you guys would be willing to give up a year of playoff contention to build up a new team without Mr. Cancer that's well-coached from the ground up? I would.

I don't think they'd have to give up a year of PO's to retool the team. Wilson simply has to be more willing to be agressive in the UFA market. If he's willing to trade a way players like Clowe, Pavelski, Murray, possibly Marleau, etc. and replace them through UFA where he doesn't give up any assests he can transition the team and build up the prospect at the same time.

 

[rares]

UFA's coming to SJ?

I LOL-ed... :p

 

[MacJ88]

Unfortunately, it seems like SJ has a hard time reeling in the UFAs. Whether it's the location and free agents don't think it's a hockey town or they don't want to deal with the travel that west coast teams have to go through, I don't know. What I do know is, once players get traded here, they absolutely LOVE the area, the weather, the fans, etc. Hope some of the current Sharks can do some recruiting, after all, it's for their own good. This team needs a ton of help. :help:

 

[naes666]

If making 3 final fours in seven years and never missing the PO's gets you fired, then you'd have a whole lot of GM turnover. I think you gotta have at least 2 1st round bowouts or missed PO's to get fired. If they fired dougie, what would a new GM do?

Nah, dougie has done a fine job given his lack of high draft picks. He has traded away a few too many, but he's also traded for a few key ones that he didnt have, like cooch. He has managed to bring in some key future guys like burns without totally destroying the now as well. Restocking without the aid of high draft choices is extremely tough, unless you have scouts who hand you zetterbergs and datsyuks on a silver platter late in the draft. The sharks have very solid late round drafting in the last 7 years, but you get guys like braun, wingels, demers, joslin, bonino, or mitchell, not legit top 6 forward or top 4 D. Since the sharks have much more human scouts, dougie has had to maintain competitive without those kind of picks.

Besides which of his impact trades has been so bad prior to this year? Heater wasnt bad given the salary cap was a wash and heater> michalek+cheech over those years by far. Boyle wasnt bad at all. havlat was hurt, but it was a good deal given that heater needed to go and havlat's salary is reasonable. hell, he's the main reason we got into the PO's or got even a win vs. the blues. Going back further, the jumbo deal was a clear good one since the team was realllly floundering and stuey+sturm+primeau all pretty much suck. What else? the deadline deals were solid, even if they didnt work,. they needed a clear scorer so they got guerin. Need a top Dman? add campbell. Picking up wellfed off waivers was a great move.

This year was awful, Zues, moore, galiardi were all disaster deals. no argument there. But, that's really it, so I saw give him the opportunity to clean up his mess and I bet the sharks can be contenders again next year.

your points are all excellent, i am just flat out of sick of the culture of cruise control in the locker room and on the ice. i think you have to hold Doug Wilson accountable for this along with the Coach and players, getting someone new at the top would help wipe the slate clean, just my opinion but i think its time.

 

[naes666]

TMac took Ronnie's team and started 28-3 his first year?. That team was pounding goals and 50 shots a game. It has been downhill since. That President's Cup team loses to Anaheim in the 1st Round and TMac badly outcoached by Carlyle. You wonder what would have been if Dougie had hired a veteran coach over a newbie with this team at its peak.

The one constant thru all these teams is Marleau. He was there for the Calgary upset, Edmonton upset, Dallas upset, Anaheim upset, and Chicago upset (although I think Chicago was better even though Sharks had home ice). But that is alot of playoff failures when you are the favorite. He sets the tone for the blaise performances we have seen. It is a damn shame. I look back at this decade and wonder what could have been. Marleau epitomizes this quote from the Bronx Tale:

"The saddest thing in life is wasted talent, and the choices you make will shape your life forever".

Marleaus legacy? A "leader" on team that perpetually fails in the playoff and his name never to be engraved on the Cup.

the other constant is DOUG WILSON! HAHA

 

[naes666]

Unfortunately, it seems like SJ has a hard time reeling in the UFAs. Whether it's the location and free agents don't think it's a hockey town or they don't want to deal with the travel that west coast teams have to go through, I don't know. What I do know is, once players get traded here, they absolutely LOVE the area, the weather, the fans, etc. Hope some of the current Sharks can do some recruiting, after all, it's for their own good. This team needs a ton of help. :help:

none one has stopped to consider the culture of choking here? it's very much like the Warriors, NO ONE WANTS TO COME PLAY FOR THEM! Sure the Sharks have had some decent playoff runs but they constantly fall short...everyone and their brother that is not a Sharks fan considers them chokers, unless the $$$ are big enough, what player would want to come play here.

how do you change that? blow it the fuck up starting with the GM, he is the one who is responsible for these chokers, he hires them.

i know, who is going to be the new GM? well even an interim would be worth it just to send shockwaves through the ranks...sometimes change can have a very positive wake up call for all.

 

[naes666]

a lot of people want to get rid of Marleau, but doesn't he have a no trade clause?

 

[rares]

a lot of people want to get rid of Marleau, but doesn't he have a no trade clause?

Yes, he does. As do Thornton, Boyle and Handzus:

CapGeek.com :: It's a numbers game :: NHL :: Salary Cap Chart

 

[Cmon_WTF]

a lot of people want to get rid of Marleau, but doesn't he have a no trade clause?

He has a No Movement Clause. If he doesn't agree to waive the NMC the only way to move him would be to put him on unconditional waivers and hope someone claims him. If no one claims him then he can be bought out. A buy out would cost the Sharks $2.3m in cap space over the next 4 years.

 

[naes666]

Yes, he does. As do Thornton, Boyle and Handzus:

CapGeek.com :: It's a numbers game :: NHL :: Salary Cap Chart

omfg, i should have never clicked that link, now im completely depressed.

what a fucking mess...and seriously you people want to keep Doug Wilson around? dude has fucked us good.

 

[naes666]

He has a No Movement Clause. If he doesn't agree to waive the NMC the only way to move him would be to put him on unconditional waivers and hope someone claims him. If no one claims him then he can be bought out. A buy out would cost the Sharks $2.3m in cap space over the next 4 years.

i don't suppose he wants to go to Columbus?

 

[SJVP408]

That and they drafted getzlaf and perry in 03 along with being the destination that niedermeyer wanted with his bro. Granted, if dougie had the opportunity to pull the trigger on a pronger deal and didnt, then that was a fuckup of the Nth degree, but that was not confirmed as far as I know.

I agre 100% on marleau. Though, not on the coaching. They've had 2 coaches under DW. Ron Wilson, who is a terrrrible coach, as clearly seen in SJ and in TOR. He sucks, and though dougie had the slow trigger, he did finally pull it. And then there's tmac, who simply does not know how to coach the game. His PK numbers are enough to can him right now, since that is all coaching, and we all know that it's his system, not the players, that are the problem there. A good motivator would do wonders.

If there is one gigantic failure for dougie, it has been in his coach selection. He has not found the right man for that very tough job. He's bound to fire tmac after this year. If he does, then give the new coach a year before calling for dougie's head.

I've also alluded to this in the past. Todd stepped into a very tough situation as an NHL rookie head coach. He was in charge of getting a team that has underachieved and had high expectations. He's taken them to two conference finals where they got beat by better teams, easily beaten.

When I watch the Sharks, I don't see a lot of offensive creativity on the rush, and zero aggressiveness on defense. I'm sick of the passive defense and the lack of scoring off rushes. On a rush, Sharks forwards are instructed to pull up on the wing and wait for a trailer. Guess what, most of the time the late trailer is an offensively inept defenseman. There is no criss crossing, no aggressive drives to the net when there is an even man rush (2 on 2, 3 on 3), always pull up short of the half boards and wait for a trailer. Todd also leaves it up to the players to motivate themselves which is the wrong move with this roster.

I'm done with (in order):
1. this coaching staff: terrible schemes, lack of motivational skills
2. Patty: nuff said
3. Murray: too slow. A shitty PK also takes away his aggressiveness.
4. Clowe: Sharks have Thornton, no need for another playmaker that likes to hang out on the perimeter. Would definetly miss his ornery attitude, but let's get some speed and two way play in this spot.
5. Demers: coach him up or trade him. He is a trainwreck in the defensive zone.