Fighting....Place in the NHL or no?

[Voltaire26]

@ PhillyPhaithful...

To some degree, you are right, I believe....true enforcers, or the "thug on skates" no longer has a place in the league.

Just look at what happened to alot of those guys post NHL lock out of 2005. What with the removal of alot of the clutching and grabbing, and more emphasis on hockey ability, unless the enforcer in question had any kind of hockey skills, he no longer had a job with an NHL team.

I support two teams in the NHL: The Lightning and the Wild. Both of these teams put an emphasis on skill and the play, rather than beating up the opposition.
The Lightning do have Steve Downie, whom many dump on because of his past, but Downie is really a talented player, and I give him credit for doing less of the crap barbaric stuff, and more of the skillful stuff...though he certainly can be counted on to stand up for teammates.

And the Wild have Brad Staubitz, who while more of an enforcer than Downie (Downie is more a middle weight....not your classical enforcer), Staubitz still has hockey skills, albeit, he is more a third or fourth liner skills guy.

And while teams like Tampa Bay win with their skill rather than by 'beating on opposing teams', seems to me that when they play a team that DOES go the Neanderthal route, so called "experts" always seem to say..."Well, Tampa just has to get tougher"....hmmm...sounds like talking out of both sides of their heads by some people, eh?

But back to your original point...Yes, guys like Probert, McSorely, Mythres, Debrusk, Poeschek, and Ciccone probably would NOT get a job in today's NHL, simply because they just do not have the hockey skills to offset their fists. I think the New Age Enforcer is one who can play the game, but still has the qualities of being able to put fear into those that would take liberties with their teams' star players.

G

As long as you have skilled players with skates and sticks racing around at a high rate of speed and checking each other, you need fighting. The league has to monitor it case by case.

As for Probert he was a hockey player before he was a fighter. He had excellent hockey skills. I can't speak for the others ... Red Wing fan.

 

[IPostedWhat]

If it wasn't for fighting during the game, the Sabres probably don't win the game tonight against the Habs.

The McCormick/Moan fight really turned the Sabres around after they were playing like hot shit most of the 1st & 2nd period.

 

[4thstreet]

Agreed. It's pretty much impossible to suggest that it could be completely banned from the game, just like fights happen on rare occasions in pretty much every other sport even when there is no contact. Personally I think an automatic game misconduct would be a reasonable way for both sides to meet in the middle. Within a specified period of time (last 5 or 10 minutes of a game?) that game misconduct would carry over to the next game. Of course the automatic game misconduct should only apply to 2 willing participants and not to both if 1 guy clearly instigated. The other guy should be allowed to defend himself.

I agree.
If they would have done that in tonights' Flyers/Senators game,Walker and Konopka wouldn't have gotten into a 2nd fight each.

 

[elocomotive]

For those with HBO, REAL Sports had an interesting piece on hockey fighters and the recent 3 deaths in the past week. It included interviews with former fighters and some studies done by a Boston neurologist who studied the brains of retired NHLers who were fighters over the years. It was pretty moving stuff.

 

[NickVT10]

Fuck yeah there should be fighting. Only exception is no punches to the head. Let them do body shots and wrestle but no headshots. Give the guy who gets thrown down first an extra minute in the box. Safer and a little meaning to the fight.

 

[TheRobotDevil]

I think everyone knows my opinion i'm pro fighting

 

[Voltaire26]

In 1997 everyone thought the Red Wings were weak "the Russian Five are a bunch of wimps". Claude Lemieux had previously abused us by blind-siding Kris Draper into an open door by the bench. No apologies. Sometimes you have to fight when your a man (Kenny Rogers). The result ... Four Colorado Avalance bloodied and the Red Wings went on to the Stanley Cup for the first time in 42 years.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uOCXfu_mWyY

 

[skrillex26]

I don't think there is. I enjoy watching them, sure, but I still don't see what it does for the sport. It's just another venue through which a player can get injured. The clock stops during a fight, nobody can score a goal, it has no direct bearing on the outcome of the game, so why is it allowed? You don't win puck possession from a fight. There is no "hockey" benefit to fighting.

But you can lose a player for 6 weeks with a broken hand, longer with a broken jaw or orbital, or for a really long time with a concussion. That does have a bearing on what happens, because for those 6+ weeks, a team is without that player's particular skill set.

Knowing what we know about head injuries, I really think we need to reevaluate fighting's place in the sport. Take out fighting, and I sincerely believe we will see an improvement of the quality of the sport. Fights stop the flow of the game. Fights knock players out with injuries. Fights are a distraction. I think they need to be banned.

Couldn't agree more.

 

[DaBoltsNIsles]

I think fighting is a must in hockey. If it were abolished the cheapshot artists would run amuck.

 

[Bizzle McDizzle]

What say you fans?

The latest incident being Pittsburgh's Aaron Asham basically knocking out Washington's Jay Beagle.
Of course, the big story there, is Asham doing the "its over" and "go to sleep" gestures to the crowd afterwards.
Kudos for Asham for realizing it was not a classy thing to do, and he apologized, and sounded sincere about it.

This may sound strange coming from a female, but I DO believe there is a place for fighting in the NHL. It really does serve a purpose. And contrary to popular belief, there is generally a respect among NHL enforcers, and many unwritten and unspoken rules that they abide by when going about their business.

Hockey by its nature is a very emotional game. It's what makes it what it is. It's what helps give the league parity. Yes, I said PARITY. Name me another sport that relies on emotion so much, that even a very mediocre team can outplay, and just pummel a much more talented team, simply because they are fired up, emotional, and just want it so bad they can taste it? Sure, it happens in other sports too, but outside of hockey, it's more the exception.....in the NHL, its pretty much the rule.

And what more emotional stirring can there be than a good ol' fashioned slugfest to get players, their teams, and their fans going? Not only that, but the fighting portion and its enforcers help to regulate many of the cheap shotting, coward play, and general weasel behavior that some players in the NHL would go rampant with if there were no fighting and enforcers to make sure they stay honest. And hey, fans, its not like fighting is the ENTIRE NHL. Not like every game features fights and that's whats being promoted....but it does serve a purpose, and it is exciting for fans.

With the NHL being extra sensitive to head shots and concussions, it is understandable that fighting is now in the cross hairs, because really, you don't take many more direct shots to the head than that way. But still, enforcers know what they sign on for when they take on those roles. Many know that if it weren't for their ability to fight, they wouldn't even BE in the NHL. Though, to the NHL's credit, and player's talents, many enforcers nowadays actually CAN play the game. Gone are the days of pure goons who are basically thugs on skates (though a few remnants still remain).

Heck, if you think about it, the fact that fighters make their way on to teams suggests the NHL itself understand the necessity of these guys, and the utter chaos that would ensue should non-fighting cheap shot artists be allowed to run the show. So, it just seems a bit hypocritical to me if the NHL should pursue the removal of fighting, saying it has no place in the game. Uh huh...do that, and cowardly play by sniveling little men would rule the day. Guaranteed they steal the spotlight from the "stars" you so desperately want to give it to by removing the enforcers....

Anyways, bottom line:
I believe fighting still belongs in the NHL. Its not only a tradition, but has proven itself useful in more ways than one. It is a good thing that most enforcers do have respect for each other and the game, though regulation on the NHL's part for excessive actions resulting during and after fights most certainly is welcome.

The NHL wants their stars to be stars. Hence the many rule changes that reward more skillful play, rather than sloppy grabbing and interfering. That's fine. I am on board with that, obviously. But good enforcement by players themselves is a key component to be sure that the star players are allowed to be just that.

And back to the Aaron Asham incident: most enforcers go about their business, then march on over to the penalty box, and let the fans and their teammates exude their emotions from there. Asham didn't do that. He took things to extremes, but again, he called himself on it, and showed that enforcers can be classy and remorseful in the face of uncalled for actions.

I promise you unconditional rep love from a SE compadre... if you promise to never write that much in a single post ever again.

We are men.

Simple.

Keep it simple.

Maybe some bullet points.

 

[PhillyPhaithful48]

I promise you unconditional rep love from a SE compadre... if you promise to never write that much in a single post ever again.

We are men.

Simple.

Keep it simple.

Maybe some bullet points.

I prefer my lectures in powerpoint

 

[SandyBeach26]

I promise you unconditional rep love from a SE compadre... if you promise to never write that much in a single post ever again.

We are men.

Simple.

Keep it simple.

Maybe some bullet points.

Well, sorry. If that much reading makes your simple brain explode, I suggest just moving on to the next thread.

 

[Bizzle McDizzle]

Well, sorry. If that much reading makes your simple brain explode, I suggest just moving on to the next thread.

Who's gonna make me?
Oh yeah??
Really??
You and what army?
So there.


pffft.

chicks.

 

[SandyBeach26]

Who's gonna make me?
Oh yeah??
Really??
You and what army?
So there.


pffft.

chicks.

Hehehe...and there we have it folks....

 

[SLY]

I promise you unconditional rep love from a SE compadre... if you promise to never write that much in a single post ever again.

We are men.

Simple.

Keep it simple.

Maybe some bullet points.

Or pics of hot ice girls/ring girls...

 

[beantownmaniac]

I am the smartest person on SportsHoopla, so...

Seriously, though, I turn everything into a numbers game, and the fighting argument is no different for me.

Pffft, how do yew know you the smartist? :mmph:

 

[Bizzle McDizzle]

Pffft, how do yew know you the smartist? :mmph:

college kids are always the smartest

just ask them

they'll tell you

 

[beantownmaniac]

YES!!!

 

[Darkstone42]

college kids are always the smartest

just ask them

they'll tell you

 

[Automattic]

college kids are always the smartest

just ask them

they'll tell you

I love living in a college town.

Not using the crosswalk at the stoplights + my big red truck motoring along = an early return on all of mommy and daddy's money