ESPN First Take slamming the Bengals

[flamingrey]

How do you come to this conclusion? Because we didn't beat Pittsburgh in Pittsburgh on Sunday night?

The team won 11 games..... They had a small slump in the middle of the season before their bye week which led to poor performances against the Dolphins, Ravens and Browns (even though the game was a blow out). They won their home games by an average of 17 points. That is extremely difficult to do in this league.

Inconsistency. They've won some great games and lost some bad ones. Not sure I can say they strike fear in anyone. Be it the QB or whatever, but teams don't want to face the Brady, Manning types. Brees, Rodgers. On the flip side, teams fear the likes of Seattle and SF due to their all around great teams. Where do the Bengals fit in with that? You never know which Dalton will show up or which coaches will show up. Lastly, of the 12 teams, the only teams I put without a doubt below us are the Colts and Chargers. Doesn't make sense with the talent we have.

That said, the home streak is unbelievable. 4 of 5 games with 40+ points and the other with 30+. They have built some swagger at home. Unfortunately we only have one game there, but that should have been at least in the divisional round had it not been for the inconsistency.

 

[futballiscool]

Where the fuck is the popcorn emote thingy?!?!?

I wasn't being sarcastic. I think his posts are smart and he generally gets heat because people don't like debating with him. Mostly because he's good at it

I'm curious about the zen/fan thing though

 

[cincygrad]

Teams you mention....

The Niners lost by more than 3 scores to Indy on their home field. They were also pummeled by Seattle early in the season and had a lot of uneven efforts from their offense.

The Saints had a season much like ours.... Inconsistent effort on the road.

Seattle is the class of the NFC, but their offense was definitely not consistent.

How many teams do you put 'without a doubt' above us? I'd probably put SF and Seattle and maybe Denver. Though I think Denver is vulnerable.

 

[flamingrey]

I enjoy your posts. I'll admit you're more intelligent than I am.. I'll probably lose if this turns into a long-winded debate.. etc

Now with that said, how is it possible to be a fan of a team without making any emotional investment in them?

I get happy when they win and upset when they lose. But I'm long past the days of chucking my remote or getting angry in general when they lose. "In any way" was probably a bit of an exagerration. But I for the most part don't (or try not to) think emotionally, and part of that has to due with my training in school and beyond considering my education and occupation.

P.s. I don't believe myself smarter than anyone. 90% of football is subjective. I'm just "louder" than most people.

 

[flamingrey]

Teams you mention....

The Niners lost by more than 3 scores to Indy on their home field. They were also pummeled by Seattle early in the season and had a lot of uneven efforts from their offense.

The Saints had a season much like ours.... Inconsistent effort on the road.

Seattle is the class of the NFC, but their offense was definitely not consistent.

How many teams do you put 'without a doubt' above us? I'd probably put SF and Seattle and maybe Denver. Though I think Denver is vulnerable.

I'll start by saying we have the talent and (inconsistently) the ability to beat any team at any time.

The Saints were 3-5 on the road, the same as us. Very inconsistent. But I just can't force myself to believe a fan or player of another team would rather face the Saints than the Bengals. The x-factor being the QB. Same with the Patriots and Packers.

I'll add KC as a team I don't fear either and think we are better.

"Without a doubt" was a poor choice of words. I put us above only KC, Indy, and SD. The other teams are not only better but more "dangerous". But talent wise that shouldnt be the case. Obviously some are debateable. Its just my opinion.

 

[kramer1]

It's a QB league and Dalton does not strike fear into the hearts of opponents.

I think we're also a better team than the Panthers, though. Their offense probably doesn't score a TD against us.

 

[cincygrad]

I'll start by saying we have the talent and (inconsistently) the ability to beat any team at any time.

The Saints were 3-5 on the road, the same as us. Very inconsistent. But I just can't force myself to believe a fan or player of another team would rather face the Saints than the Bengals. The x-factor being the QB. Same with the Patriots and Packers.

I'll add KC as a team I don't fear either and think we are better.

"Without a doubt" was a poor choice of words. I put us above only KC, Indy, and SD. The other teams are not only better but more "dangerous". But talent wise that shouldnt be the case. Obviously some are debateable. Its just my opinion.

I think this is certainly true for fans.... And I think it's impossible for fans to erase old perceptions so that will always be true. I'd be interested to know what players really think.

 

[bengaldoug]

Here are the rankings according to my mechanically constructed power ratings.
1) Denver 11.5
2) Seattle 9.5
2) San Francisco 9.5
4) Cincinnati 7.5
5) Arizona 7.0
5) New Orleans 7.0
5) Kansas City 7.0
8) New England 5.5
8) Carolina 5.5
10) Philadelphia 4.0
11) San Diego 3.0
12) Green Bay 1.5 (Added 3 points for the return of Rodgers)
13) Indy 1.0

Of course Arizona, tied for fifth, is not in the playoffs. Adding three points for the return of Rodgers is a subjective call. The experts in Vegas only give the very top quarterbacks a three point adjustment, so I did research the matter. Before Rodgers went down the Pack was top five in the ratings. Generally home field is worth three points. I make a few subjective calls here, too. Seattle's 12th man is probably worth 2-3 additional points, so I make their home advantage 5 points. I also believe Green Bay's homefield is worth 5 because of the weather. I think Denver, New England and Cincy all are worth 4 points. The others all would be assigned the normal three point home advantage. So this is how I rate this week's games.

1) Philly -1.5 over the Saints
2) Chiefs -3 over Indy
3) Bengals -8.5 over Chargers
4) San Fran -3 over the Packers

These are all reasonably close to the actual line, excepting the Chiefs, who appear to have value at +2.5 points....

 

[kramer1]

With your spreads I'd take...

Saints, Chiefs, Bengals, and Packers.

 

[flamingrey]

Forgot about the Eagles. They suck too. But they suck less than the Chargers.

 

[bengaldoug]

With your spreads I'd take...

Saints, Chiefs, Bengals, and Packers.

Imo the Chiefs are the bet of the week, and the Bengals are next. The other two I would pass on. I just don't trust the Saints on the road, and I think the Pack/niners is a tossup at Green Bay. If the game were at San Fran I think the niners win by 10 or so....

I think the Chiefs win straight up, and the Bengals by 10-14......of course I am often wrong. That's why it's called gambling.

 

[bengaldoug]

Forgot about the Eagles. They suck too. But they suck less than the Chargers.

According to my rankings they suck about one point less than the Chargers.....

 

[bengaldoug]

Here are the rankings according to my mechanically constructed power ratings.
1) Denver 11.5
2) Seattle 9.5
2) San Francisco 9.5
4) Cincinnati 7.5
5) Arizona 7.0
5) New Orleans 7.0
5) Kansas City 7.0
8) New England 5.5
8) Carolina 5.5
10) Philadelphia 4.0
11) San Diego 3.0
12) Green Bay 1.5 (Added 3 points for the return of Rodgers)
13) Indy 1.0

Of course Arizona, tied for fifth, is not in the playoffs. Adding three points for the return of Rodgers is a subjective call. The experts in Vegas only give the very top quarterbacks a three point adjustment, so I did research the matter. Before Rodgers went down the Pack was top five in the ratings. Generally home field is worth three points. I make a few subjective calls here, too. Seattle's 12th man is probably worth 2-3 additional points, so I make their home advantage 5 points. I also believe Green Bay's homefield is worth 5 because of the weather. I think Denver, New England and Cincy all are worth 4 points. The others all would be assigned the normal three point home advantage. So this is how I rate this week's games.

1) Philly -1.5 over the Saints
2) Chiefs -3 over Indy
3) Bengals -8.5 over Chargers
4) San Fran -3 over the Packers

These are all reasonably close to the actual line, excepting the Chiefs, who appear to have value at +2.5 points....

I will use these rankings unadjusted throughout the playoffs, unless a team shows they are significantly better or worse than these numbers. I think a ten point difference would be necessary to make a one point adjustment in the rating. The exception to that could be Green Bay, who had their rating subjectively adjusted. I'll monitor their performance closely.

 

[cincygrad]

I'd take the Saints, Bengals, Chiefs and Niners.

I trust Peyton/Brees in a playoff over first timers Kelly/Foles.

If the Bengals play up to their level, they should win by two scores.

People are judging the Indy/Chiefs game based on what happened a few weeks ago. I don't expect the Chiefs to have a second poor showing against Indy.

Even though Rogers is back, I don't think the Pack can hang with SF. It was a bad match up the last two times they played.

 

[kramer1]

I'd take the Saints, Bengals, Chiefs and Niners.

I trust Peyton/Brees in a playoff over first timers Kelly/Foles.

If the Bengals play up to their level, they should win by two scores.

People are judging the Indy/Chiefs game based on what happened a few weeks ago. I don't expect the Chiefs to have a second poor showing against Indy.

Even though Rogers is back, I don't think the Pack can hang with SF. It was a bad match up the last two times they played.

Something is extremely fishy about the whole Rodgers thing over the past few months....all of the sudden he shows up and wins on a miracle to take his team to the playoffs? I've got Green Bay in the Super Bowl. I'm absolutely convinced that other forces were at play here. Nothing will change my mind on that.

 

[cincygrad]

Something is extremely fishy about the whole Rodgers thing over the past few months....all of the sudden he shows up and wins on a miracle to take his team to the playoffs? I've got Green Bay in the Super Bowl. I'm absolutely convinced that other forces were at play here. Nothing will change my mind on that.

And he was outed in the same week!

 

[kramer1]

And he was outed in the same week!

And he'll probably come out of the closet during the week off before the Super Bowl.

 

[futballiscool]

And he was outed in the same week!

I saw that thread at the top of the SportsHoopla feed for days but figured it was division rivalry trolling. then the denial showed up on PFT...


about the game, SF's pass defense was lit up the past two games. Rodgers should throw for 500 yds this week

 

[cincygrad]

At least we now know why Cedric Benson was so happy to join the Packers.

 

[kramer1]

At least we now know why Cedric Benson was so happy to join the Packers.

That's gold, Jerry! Gold!