Series Thread: ECF: Boston Celtics vs Cleveland Cavs

[AlpacaWine]

I get it. It was dumb and it was pretty cruel (intentional or not) from the perspective of CLE fans.

I just think the vitriol goes so far over the top. I mean, one of the most classless things you've ever seen? Are you kidding me? At the end of the day, the difference is that he announced it on TV instead of leaking it to a reporter or writing an article on SI/Players Tribune.

And I don't buy the "better ways to raise money" argument. LeBron has raised plenty of other money - and given some out of his own pocket - for many different causes. But the fact is... ESPN was gonna make millions when his decision was announced - no matter how the news broke. The whole sports world was waiting, ready to tune in whenever the news broke. LeBron's team found a way to take those $8.5 million dollars out of ESPN's pocket and give it the kids.

That boys and girls club factor did nothing for me. It was nothing except a poorly veiled attempt to buy some goodwill.

I've never been one to read too much into such public displays of donating time or money. If an athlete can't do it without a camera there, he's not doing it for the right reasons.

 

[trojanfan12]

I just think the vitriol goes so far over the top. I mean, one of the most classless things you've ever seen? Are you kidding me? At the end of the day, the difference is that he announced it on TV instead of leaking it to a reporter or writing an article on SI/Players Tribune.

Yes, one of the most classless things I've ever seen. It was like a guy showing up for an anniversary party, telling his wife in front of all of their friends and family that he's divorcing her, then driving off in a new sports car with his younger, hotter girlfriend.

And I don't buy the "better ways to raise money" argument.

Really? So you think that holding an hour long tv special, that never actually featured the kids, to crush the Cavs fanbase in front of millions of people is a good way to raise money for underprivileged kids? That's weird, because I can easily think of about 50 better ways without even trying.

Heck, Magic Johnson used to have his "Midsummer Night's Magic" basketball game every summer in which he'd get a bunch of NBA players to have a game for charity.

But "The Decision" is the best Lebron could come up with?

LeBron has raised plenty of other money - and given some out of his own pocket - for many different causes.

So Lebron has raised plenty of other money. That shows that he knew there were other ways to raise money for kids. Lots of players have raised as much or money for charities as Lebron. How many of them did it that way?

ESPN was gonna make millions when his decision was announced - no matter how the news broke. The whole sports world was waiting, ready to tune in whenever the news broke. LeBron's team found a way to take those $8.5 million dollars out of ESPN's pocket and give it the kids.

It never should have been done in the first place. Just because some good came out of it, doesn't make it a good thing. It was as classless as it gets.

Do you think Lebron is the first superstar that had millions of people waiting to see what he was going to do in free agency? How many of those guys did it the way Lebron did?

 

[gordontrue]

That boys and girls club factor did nothing for me. It was nothing except a poorly veiled attempt to buy some goodwill.

I've never been one to read too much into such public displays of donating time or money. If an athlete can't do it without a camera there, he's not doing it for the right reasons.

My opinion is the opposite. I'll never try to assume intention - from the guy in the grocery store line donating $1 to the celebrity running a PR campaign. If someone has found a way to give needed money to a good cause... nothing but applause from me. The motivation doesn't change a thing when it comes the good those kids get out of it.

In the case of LeBron, he's shown repeatedly over the years that he's serious about his charity work, and has done a lot - on and off camera.

 

[AlpacaWine]

My opinion is the opposite. I'll never try to assume intention - from the guy in the grocery store line donating $1 to the celebrity running a PR campaign. If someone has found a way to give needed money to a good cause... nothing but applause from me. The motivation doesn't change a thing when it comes the good those kids get out of it.

In the case of LeBron, he's shown repeatedly over the years that he's serious about his charity work, and has done a lot - on and off camera.

You're making a distinction there that I'm not.

I can still appreciate the fact that kids are getting something out of it while not applauding the athlete for doing it for selfish reasons.

 

[gordontrue]

Yes, one of the most classless things I've ever seen. It was like a guy showing up for an anniversary party, telling his wife in front of all of their friends and family that he's divorcing her, then driving off in a new sports car with his younger, hotter girlfriend.

I get it. But please add the caveat "in the context of sports", or something. Announcing a career move and disappointing people loyal to the company you're leaving is so far from one of the most classless things possible that its actually borderline insulting to people who have actually been wronged.

Really? So you think that holding an hour long tv special, that never actually featured the kids, to crush the Cavs fanbase in front of millions of people is a good way to raise money for underprivileged kids? That's weird, because I can easily think of about 50 better ways without even trying.

You're missing the point. Of course there are other ways (and LeBron himself has raised a lot of money a lot of other ways). But the bottom line is that $8.5 million dollars of tv viewership was on the table. ESPN was in position to grab it. LeBron's team took it from them and gave it away.

So Lebron has raised plenty of other money, but had to do it this way? Lots of players have raised as much or money for charities as Lebron. How many of them did it via that way?

Do you think Lebron is the first superstar that had millions of people waiting to see what he was going to do in free agency? How many of those guys did it the way Lebron did?

Of course other stars have, and that's awesome. I'm not trying to build up LeBron or even say that this is some grand thing that deserves praise. Just putting into context what we're really talking about - a guy who announced he was leaving one company for another, and found a way to leverage the interest the world had in his decision to help a good cause.

 

[gordontrue]

You're making a distinction there that I'm not.

I can still appreciate the fact that kids are getting something out of it while not applauding the athlete for doing it for selfish reasons.

I hear you, but you have to accept that you're making some assumptions. I'm not comfortable making assumptions about anyone's true intentions when it comes to charity work.

 

[GNG]

It's a shame. Don't know how I'll get through life.

Try being more open minded.

 

[trojanfan12]

I get it. But please add the caveat "in the context of sports", or something. Announcing a career move and disappointing people loyal to the company you're leaving is so far from one of the most classless things possible that its actually borderline insulting to people who have actually been wronged.

I figured that "in the context of sports" was assumed. For example, was what Lebron did as classless as what Lavar Ball apparently said about Kyrie's mom? No. But just because it wasn't as classless as that, doesn't mean it wasn't classless.

You're missing the point. Of course there are other ways (and LeBron himself has raised a lot of money a lot of other ways). But the bottom line is that $8.5 million dollars of tv viewership was on the table. ESPN was in position to grab it. LeBron's team took it from them and gave it away.

The point you're missing is that ESPN and Lebron's posse (tip of the cap to Phil lol) shouldn't have been in that position in the first place. Someone should have been smart enough to say "Ya know what...this may not be the best idea." Putting lipstick on a pig, doesn't mean it's not still a pig.

Of course other stars have, and that's awesome. I'm not trying to build up LeBron or even say that this is some grand thing that deserves praise. Just putting into context what we're really talking about - a guy who announced he was leaving one company for another, and found a way to leverage the interest the world had in his decision to help a good cause.

If it was about helping a good cause, why was the good cause not featured? Lebron and ESPN could have made the whole thing a lot more palatable for a lot of folks if the focus had been on the kids he was trying to help.

The whole thing came off to me (and based on things I've read over the years, a lot of others too) as someone figuring out that it wasn't going to be very well received, bringing it up too late to stop it, so they threw together the "fundraiser" idea to try and make it not look so bad.

Not sure why it's so difficult for some of you to accept that Lebron isn't perfect and that he's done and said some fairly shitty things over the years. That doesn't make him a bad guy or take away from his greatness as a basketball player. It just means he's human.

Shit, if Lakers fans tried to defend every shitty thing Kobe has done or said...defending Kobe would take up 75% of our posts on here. lol

 

[gordontrue]

I figured that "in the context of sports" was assumed. For example, was what Lebron did as classless as what Lavar Ball apparently said about Kyrie's mom? No. But just because it wasn't as classless as that, doesn't mean it wasn't classless.

Fair enough.

The point you're missing is that ESPN and Lebron's posse (tip of the cap to Phil lol) shouldn't have been in that position in the first place. Someone should have been smart enough to say "Ya know what...this may not be the best idea." Putting lipstick on a pig, doesn't mean it's not still a pig.

Yeah, I hear you and I disagree. All I'm trying to say is that if the decision doesn't happen... that $8.5 goes straight into the pockets of ESPN. People will still tune in to ESPN to find out the news and listen to the commentary on the news. ESPN makes money off his decision either way.

Not sure why it's so difficult for some of you to accept that Lebron isn't perfect and that he's done and said some fairly shitty things over the years. That doesn't make him a bad guy or take away from his greatness as a basketball player. It just means he's human.

Shit, if Lakers fans tried to defend every shitty thing Kobe has done or said...defending Kobe would take up 75% of our posts on here. lol

LOL, you're hearing what you want to hear. I have said several times - in this exchange alone - that it was handled poorly, that it was cruel to the Cavs fanbase, and that it was a dumb move.

My goal here is not about defending LeBron - and definitely not about thinking he is perfect. Just bringing a little perspective to something that - in my opinion - is painted as a much more terrible thing than what the reality is.

 

[Heatles84]

Try being more open minded.

I'm pretty set in my ways. There's no turning back for me.

 

[GNG]

I'm pretty set in my ways. There's no turning back for me.

I assumed that after reading your posts.

 

[trojanfan12]

Yeah, I hear you and I disagree. All I'm trying to say is that if the decision doesn't happen... that $8.5 goes straight into the pockets of ESPN. People will still tune in to ESPN to find out the news and listen to the commentary on the news. ESPN makes money off his decision either way.

No, if The Decision doesn't happen and he just does a press release like every other star player in league history, ESPN isn't in a position to make that money. There is a huge difference between news and commentary about the announcement and an hour long tv show about it. ESPN was selling commercial spots and likely charging more for them than the same spot running during SportsCenter. That's where the $8.5 million came from. No Decision, no extra advertising dollars.

LOL, you're hearing what you want to hear. I have said several times - in this exchange alone - that it was handled poorly, that it was cruel to the Cavs fanbase, and that it was a dumb move.

And then you defend it by saying "it was for the children." It was a dumb, classless move and a charitable donation doesn't change that.

My goal here is not about defending LeBron - and definitely not about thinking he is perfect. Just bringing a little perspective to something that - in my opinion - is painted as a much more terrible thing than what the reality is.

It came off as Lebron thinking he's bigger than the game. I blame Lebron's posse and ESPN almost as much as I blame Lebron. Someone should have been smart enough to say that this wasn't going to be very well received and put a stop to it or at least changed the focus from Lebron to the kids.

I put more of the blame on Lebron because, at the end of the day, he had the final say on whether it happened or not. But his posse and ESPN definitely have their fair share as well. Especially ESPN, who should have known better.

 

[LogicMan]

Lebron is as much a nemesis for Boston as was Magic. But Magic just had a good way to make you like him and respect him.

 

[gordontrue]

No, if he The Decision doesn't happen and he just does a press release like every other star player in league history, ESPN isn't in a position to make that money. There is a huge difference between news and commentary about the announcement and an hour long tv show about it. ESPN was selling commercial spots and likely charging more for them than the same spot running during SportsCenter. That's where the $8.5 million came from. No Decision, no extra advertising dollars.

A very fair point. It wouldn't have been as much $... but I still think it generates a considerable chunk of change for ESPN.

 

[TurnUpTheHeat]

Yes, one of the most classless things I've ever seen. It was like a guy showing up for an anniversary party, telling his wife in front of all of their friends and family that he's divorcing her, then driving off in a new sports car with his younger, hotter girlfriend.



Really? So you think that holding an hour long tv special, that never actually featured the kids, to crush the Cavs fanbase in front of millions of people is a good way to raise money for underprivileged kids? That's weird, because I can easily think of about 50 better ways without even trying.

Heck, Magic Johnson used to have his "Midsummer Night's Magic" basketball game every summer in which he'd get a bunch of NBA players to have a game for charity.

But "The Decision" is the best Lebron could come up with?



So Lebron has raised plenty of other money. That shows that he knew there were other ways to raise money for kids. Lots of players have raised as much or money for charities as Lebron. How many of them did it that way?



It never should have been done in the first place. Just because some good came out of it, doesn't make it a good thing. It was as classless as it gets.

Do you think Lebron is the first superstar that had millions of people waiting to see what he was going to do in free agency? How many of those guys did it the way Lebron did?

How many of "those guys" were offered anything, let alone millions?
I'm still waiting for the list of people who would turn down millions to sit in a chair for 90 minutes and announce what team they were going to.
As far as the Cavs/Cavs fans, the writing was on the wall.
James hadn't communicated with the Cavs front office for quite some time.
It was pretty much the same pattern that he did with the Heat.
Riley shouldn't have been so shocked IMO.

 

[LAD]

From a PR perspective, yeah, of course. I'm just reminding that at the end of the day we're talking about a TV show that raised millions of dollars for under privileged kids. Words like "disgusting" are so far over the top, and don't apply, imo.

Well most might agree with you if the charity portion wasn't in the shadows of the intended message- which was to stick it to the rest of the league.

Maybe if he had an ounce of brains he would've found a more creative way for his TV announcement to let the world know he wanted to play in Miami AND benefit under privileged kids without seeming like a dick in the process.

 

[bksballer89]

Think I'm going to give this game a try tonight since Boston won G3.

 

[trojanfan12]

A very fair point. It wouldn't have been as much $... but I still think it generates a considerable chunk of change for ESPN.

I don't see how it would generate any extra change as a SportsCenter announcement. Those advertising spots are sold far in advance because it's a daily show. The Decision was a separate, one off type program, so they could sell advertising spots for it where they couldn't for SportsCenter.

 

[trojanfan12]

How many of "those guys" were offered anything, let alone millions?

Who knows? For all we know, they were and turned it down. I'm pretty sure that guys like Magic, MJ, Bird, Shaq, Kobe etc. could have gotten a tv special to announce their intentions had they wanted to.

I'm still waiting for the list of people who would turn down millions to sit in a chair for 90 minutes and announce what team they were going to.

So Lebron got millions for that? I thought the money was for the kids?

 

[TurnUpTheHeat]

Who knows? For all we know, they were and turned it down. I'm pretty sure that guys like Magic, MJ, Bird, Shaq, Kobe etc. could have gotten a tv special to announce their intentions had they wanted to.



So Lebron got millions for that? I thought the money was for the kids?

Sadly James got more for that then some of the all times greats made when they played.

Nobody ever said the kids got ALL the money, but they have received X amount of millions and still growing.

I guess I never gave it a second thought because:
A. It's business. FA can go wherever they want.
B. Perspective. It's a game. I don't understand how fans could get that attatched to a player/stranger to be that upset if he left their team.