Series Thread: Eastern Conference Finals: (2) Lightning vs (2) Penguins

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[pixburgher66]

Well, need whomever is in net to be a difference maker in a positive way. The offense can produce, just need a goalie to make the saves they SHOULD make, and maybe a few extra robbery kinda saves. Murray hasn't been that guy in this series, need him to step it up.

 

[scoutyjones2]

Well Sid's no Pavelski

 

[scoutyjones2]

Well, need whomever is in net to be a difference maker in a positive way. The offense can produce, just need a goalie to make the saves they SHOULD make, and maybe a few extra robbery kinda saves. Murray hasn't been that guy in this series, need him to step it up.

Letang needs to play some actual Defense...goaltending has been fine

 

[pixburgher66]

Letang needs to play some actual Defense...goaltending has been fine

Letang absolutely needs to be better, but MAF last game was not good, and neither goalie has been a difference maker. It's a team sport, and I don't put full blame on either for the losses this series. That said, you can't tell me there was much good about MAFs game 5. His angles were off all night, he was flubbing routine shots, never looked comfortable, was way too aggressive out high. Now, he's rusty, so I get it, but my sympathy wanes quickly in the postseason.

 

[sabresfaninthesouth]

Letang absolutely needs to be better, but MAF last game was not good, and neither goalie has been a difference maker. It's a team sport, and I don't put full blame on either for the losses this series. That said, you can't tell me there was much good about MAFs game 5. His angles were off all night, he was flubbing routine shots, never looked comfortable, was way too aggressive out high. Now, he's rusty, so I get it, but my sympathy wanes quickly in the postseason.

As it should. You have to go with whoever gives you the best chance to win, regardless of what effects it might have on someone's psyche.

 

[pixburgher66]

As it should. You have to go with whoever gives you the best chance to win, regardless of what effects it might have on someone's psyche.

Yeah, and there are an obscene amount of sentimental Pens fans apparently. I'm really not sure how anyone thinks that last game was okay. They try to justify it with him being rusty. Yes, he was, and it's not like he had a choice in playing time or time missed for injury, but like Sully said this morning, they're not in a position to let a goalie play through some rust. The choice to put him in is easy to criticize in retrospect, because it seems like sentiment and favoring experience (of which his numbers aren't great) over ability and recent success. It's not a great position to be in, but THE POINT IS TO WIN. Murray is obviously the better choice right now. At the very least he's much better at bouncing back.

 

[sabresfaninthesouth]

Yeah, and there are an obscene amount of sentimental Pens fans apparently. I'm really not sure how anyone thinks that last game was okay. They try to justify it with him being rusty. Yes, he was, and it's not like he had a choice in playing time or time missed for injury, but like Sully said this morning, they're not in a position to let a goalie play through some rust. The choice to put him in is easy to criticize in retrospect, because it seems like sentiment and favoring experience (of which his numbers aren't great) over ability and recent success. It's not a great position to be in, but THE POINT IS TO WIN. Murray is obviously the better choice right now. At the very least he's much better at bouncing back.

I agree with everything you said, though it's no secret around these parts that I'm not an MAF fan, especially playoff MAF.

 

[pixburgher66]

I agree with everything you said, though it's no secret around these parts that I'm not an MAF fan, especially playoff MAF.

He's had two above average postseasons. That's it. 2008 was the best I've ever seen the guy, 2009 he stole enough games to win. Past few years he wasn't the issue, but there's enough history that you don't need to put him in there when there's, at the very least, a replacement that will provide the same level of play.

 

[forty_three]

Yeah, and there are an obscene amount of sentimental Pens fans apparently. I'm really not sure how anyone thinks that last game was okay. They try to justify it with him being rusty. Yes, he was, and it's not like he had a choice in playing time or time missed for injury, but like Sully said this morning, they're not in a position to let a goalie play through some rust. The choice to put him in is easy to criticize in retrospect, because it seems like sentiment and favoring experience (of which his numbers aren't great) over ability and recent success. It's not a great position to be in, but THE POINT IS TO WIN. Murray is obviously the better choice right now. At the very least he's much better at bouncing back.

I am of the opinion of if practice is structured properly AND the goalie puts game level effort into practice, "rusty" is bullshit. It could be a lack of confidence, but muscle memory, puck tracking and reflex stay honed when you work on it.

Penguins goalie troubles this series are because the Lightning are keeping the play moving laterally and always have someone on the backdoor and the Pens D is not paying enough attention to trailers. Plus the Pens don't seem to have an answer for going back to get the lazy zone entry flips. They might get to them first, but they are getting wedged out when they do. They can't get out.

 

[pixburgher66]

I am of the opinion of if practice is structured properly AND the goalie puts game level effort into practice, "rusty" is bullshit. It could be a lack of confidence, but muscle memory, puck tracking and reflex stay honed when you work on it.

Penguins goalie troubles this series are because the Lightning are keeping the play moving laterally and always have someone on the backdoor and the Pens D is not paying enough attention to trailers. Plus the Pens don't seem to have an answer for going back to get the lazy zone entry flips. They might get to them first, but they are getting wedged out when they do. They can't get out.

They miss having another puck mover in the d-zone in Daley with those dump ins. They're being beaten with their own game there. Flip the puck high, let your speed guys go attack the dmen who are forced to turn their backs. It's about decision making, and quick decision making. You have to move the puck quickly, you have to have support, or you'll get hemmed in and your top line is stuck in the d-zone an entire shift. To me, a big part of beating this is simply doing it yourself. They need to be the aggressor, and the issue there is offensive zone entries.

Zone entries were something that I absolutely noticed big time in game 4. I was on the Pens shoot twice end, and they couldn't get controlled entries going at all. Now, certain circumstances call for a dump/chase, but I think I read their puck retrieval on dump ins was like 15%, which is a sign that you have to adjust. I think part of that is having defensemen like Ben Lovejoy who just is never comfortable with the puck on his stick, unless it's to immediately fling that puck as far from him as possible. It's maddening to watch. The other part sure seemed like the Bolts stacking the blue line. That's where those short of medium dump-in/flips work, and are something the Bolts use too. The Pens aren't as effective on the boards, so do those 'zone-passes', let the speed guys beat their defense. Which they are very capable of. Basically any time that Hedman is off the ice, the Bolts D is weakened, need top players to take advantage of that.

 

[sabresfaninthesouth]

I am of the opinion of if practice is structured properly AND the goalie puts game level effort into practice, "rusty" is bullshit. It could be a lack of confidence, but muscle memory, puck tracking and reflex stay honed when you work on it.

Penguins goalie troubles this series are because the Lightning are keeping the play moving laterally and always have someone on the backdoor and the Pens D is not paying enough attention to trailers. Plus the Pens don't seem to have an answer for going back to get the lazy zone entry flips. They might get to them first, but they are getting wedged out when they do. They can't get out.

I don't think you can ever have a practice - no matter how well designed - that truly emulates game conditions. Players won't be playing the same - for example, hitting and blocking shots - and the speed won't be the same.

That said, fatigue definitely seemed to be an issue down the stretch for MAF though, as his angles and rebound control appeared to deteriorate as the game went on, which leads me to believe the amount of conditioning lost while he was recovering was greater than perhaps anyone realized. The workout/reconditioning routine is definitely something they could have more control over.

 

[pixburgher66]

I don't think you can ever have a practice - no matter how well designed - that truly emulates game conditions. Players won't be playing the same - for example, hitting and blocking shots - and the speed won't be the same.

That said, fatigue definitely seemed to be an issue down the stretch for MAF though, as his angles and rebound control appeared to deteriorate as the game went on, which leads me to believe the amount of conditioning lost while he was recovering was greater than perhaps anyone realized. The workout/reconditioning routine is definitely something they could have more control over.

I tend to agree with this. I guess rust would've been letting in an early goal. And conditioning off ice, no matter how hard, is never the same. Especially in a position where you're mentally engaged for a full sixty minutes.

 

[forty_three]

I don't think you can ever have a practice - no matter how well designed - that truly emulates game conditions. Players won't be playing the same - for example, hitting and blocking shots - and the speed won't be the same.

That said, fatigue definitely seemed to be an issue down the stretch for MAF though, as his angles and rebound control appeared to deteriorate as the game went on, which leads me to believe the amount of conditioning lost while he was recovering was greater than perhaps anyone realized. The workout/reconditioning routine is definitely something they could have more control over.

You can put game condition drills into a practice. If you focus on skill drills all practice it hurts the goalies (and the skaters IMO, what good is it to teach someone fancy stick handling without teaching them how to avoid the guy coming to take the puck away?). You can't do it all practice of course, but you have a 15 minute block and blow the whistle when someone does something stupid. Stopped them in their tracks and go over the system you want there.

Last night my son practiced with a different high school team (they offered free ice time for goalies), and three of the drills they ran were essentially 3 on 0. He was pissed at the end. Mainly because he stopped 12 of 15 3 on 0s and the coach got pissed an made everyone skate ladders because they "weren't playing hard enough". He was like "I guess I shouldn't have stopped so many, then I'd be able to feel my lungs."

And as a coach, if players aren't playing game condition drills with game condition effort, that's when I bag skate them. And then we do the drill again until they do it the way I want.

And the harder you practice, the better your conditioning is. If your conditioning is not up to snuff after injury, you should not return. That simple. MAF didn't look ready. And Murray wasn't to blame for the previous game. I would have given Murray the net the next game after pulling him. One reason you pull a goalie is to slap your team in the face. Putting the same goalie back in next game tells the team you expect them to make it up to him.

 

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Apologies if already posted...

 

[forty_three]

Apologies if already posted...

*Offer void if you are James Reimer.

 

[dash]

Dickie V is looking for some PTPers...

 

[forty_three]

Took me way too long to figure out who they were referring to as "cuckoo".

Slater Koekkoek | General Fanager


Drouin scores, but it's under review because he may have been a millimeter offside half an hour before.

If they call it offside and no goal, they should give him a penalty shot because Murray threw his stick.


No goal. Drouin was STANDING STILL, just had his back skate off the ice.

 

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I have no dog in this fight, but this offside challenge needs to go.

 

[Dacks]

Horrible puck watching by Letang and Malkin, but saved by the review.

Still think it's a dumb rile but very happy now.