Don't Shoot The Messenger

[Vitamike]

Same argument in Detroit where fans are tired that Stafford isn't an elite QB.

The question really is do you want Jay Headcase Cutler or draft a mid tier QB like Drew Stanton and hope they develop. But understand you draft a QB your most likely writing off a season or two.

The NFL is full of Matt Schwab types and any good QB will cost. Carson Palmer was the best available QB last season and I doubt their is one in his class this off season.

Reclamation projects like RG3, Geno Smith, Jake Locker will exist but Bradford doesn't look so bad when thinking about Geno Smith under center.

Interesting take because it comes from a football guy looking in from the outside. Thanks JD!

Again, let it go, we finished right about where we were going to injury or not! New England is the exception, Their starter Bledsoe went down, Brady stepped right in, Brady did get hurt and Cassell stepped in and did good job. Philly seems to find capable QB's, there are a few other teams that do, why because those teams have more of a clue than we do! Your QB has done nothing for you in 5 years, you don't continue to think that a miracle will happen and all of a sudden he is somebody he hasn't been for 5 years!

You are right there really is only a handful of good QB's, Bradford falls into that group of average QB's, there are plenty of them out there

Thought it was 7 years?

Davis got benched because Fisher has no patience ( except for the players he falls in love with for one reason or another ).

I have no doubt that the Rams would've won those 3 games Hill started even with Davis in. The Denver game was all about the defense and Oakland and Washington are, well, Oakland and Washington. And maybe they win the SD game as well as AZ ( remember that Davis threw 2 TD's in the first AZ game before the wheels fell off in the 4th ). Hill managed to get us 2 lousy FG's.

That's 6-8 wins by a QB that had never started a regular season game. Any team would gladly take that from a young QB.

But, instead of riding out the season with Davis to see if he could turn things around, Fisher got impatient and went to an over the hill journeyman QB that did no better even though he had "experience". That was Fisher's excuse, right? He wouldn't be making those same mistakes Davis was making. Oops!

And Davis was making those mistakes against top 10 defenses. Hill fared no better when he faced those same defenses later in the season and he's a vet.

I still think Davis has potential. Too bad we will never know because Fisher wouldn't let him play out the season that was going nowhere anyways.

It's all hindsight ALR.

I gotta believe if Fisher knew he would get out of Hill much of what he got out of Davis he would have continued to roll the dice with Davis. I'm sure Fisher agrees with all of us here that neither were good enough but up to the time Fisher pulled Davis, Fisher only knew about one of them not being good enough (Davis).

I have no problem with Fish taking a chance on salvaging the season and again I'm one of the guys who wanted him to stay with Davis for the rest of the season too.

 

[27mtrcougar]

You watch, they wont re-sign Davis and he will go elsewhere and do well, and we will continue with Sadford and pay him a high salary and he will be on IR before week 2! ....all because our freakin coach is an idiot! I can see it happening!

Davis has more big-play ability than Hill, but he was even worse at avoiding turnovers (which is really incredible). Davis had 12 turnovers in nine games. That's why Fisher was forced to bench him. Not because he is loyal to Hill.. Please. Trust me you don't think they wished Davis could have got the job done so they could cut Bradford and save all that money? Of course they do. I don't know if Davis wins those games Hill does. The Defenses had tape on him and knew he couldnt make a lot of deep type out throws so they left that open and guarded the throws he could make put pressure on him and it was game over for him. Nfl defenses figure stuff out quick ask rg3.

Both Hill and Davis have incredibly weak arms and are totally incapable of throwing the deep ball. That made it impossible for the Rams to take advantage of their speedy receivers on offense. Like I said I would rather have Davis next year vs Hill. Sadford made me.

 

[27mtrcougar]

Same argument in Detroit where fans are tired that Stafford isn't an elite QB.

The question really is do you want Jay Headcase Cutler or draft a mid tier QB like Drew Stanton and hope they develop. But understand you draft a QB your most likely writing off a season or two.

The NFL is full of Matt Schwab types and any good QB will cost. Carson Palmer was the best available QB last season and I doubt their is one in his class this off season.

Reclamation projects like RG3, Geno Smith, Jake Locker will exist but Bradford doesn't look so bad when thinking about Geno Smith under center.

Yeah nice to see an outsider view. Bradford and Stafford will never be Rodgers, Brady, Manning who I think we can agree are in the elite league but both are above avg and can make any throw when healthy and when surrounded by the right group of guys can succeed. Sam could use Megatron though lol.

 

[ksudodger]

We have seen what he can do when he is healthy. Look at the numbers he put up with ZERO talent around him (his best season as a pro saw Danny Amendola as his best WR..I mean come on). Quick quiz, is his rookie season, where we were one game from winning the division, who was his leading receiver?? It was also Amendola, but he had guys like Brandon Gibson and Laurent Robinson as #2 and #3 A healthy Bradford with THIS skill position talent throws for 4000 yards in 2014 and we win 9 or 10. Yes, I agree the health issue is a true concern, but at the end of the day I think we all know the talent is there. I am very interested to see what he can do with this group, just like I was this past summer in training camp. But I also think if we bring in someone like Jake Locker, Christian Ponder or even Matt Schaub to hedge our bets, it will make this team even better. Then let someone like Bryce Petty just worry about absorbing the playbook and we have a winning formula

 

[Smed55]

Davis got benched because Fisher has no patience ( except for the players he falls in love with for one reason or another ).

I have no doubt that the Rams would've won those 3 games Hill started even with Davis in. The Denver game was all about the defense and Oakland and Washington are, well, Oakland and Washington. And maybe they win the SD game as well as AZ ( remember that Davis threw 2 TD's in the first AZ game before the wheels fell off in the 4th ). Hill managed to get us 2 lousy FG's.

That's 6-8 wins by a QB that had never started a regular season game. Any team would gladly take that from a young QB.

But, instead of riding out the season with Davis to see if he could turn things around, Fisher got impatient and went to an over the hill journeyman QB that did no better even though he had "experience". That was Fisher's excuse, right? He wouldn't be making those same mistakes Davis was making. Oops!

And Davis was making those mistakes against top 10 defenses. Hill fared no better when he faced those same defenses later in the season and he's a vet.

I still think Davis has potential. Too bad we will never know because Fisher wouldn't let him play out the season that was going nowhere anyways.

thanks again for getting! The Sammie lovers never will, because they are blinded, cuz Sammie is so pretty!

 

[ksudodger]

I, for one, like Austin Davis and the potential. I agree 100% he should have stayed with Davis for the entire season. Not sure what is going to happen with him. If this team is truly 1 or 2 pieces away from success, I am not he is the guy I want as the backup. I know exactly where Davis would be a perfect fit because he is simply a bigger version of their current QB. He should be the backup in New Orleans. Brees can truly teach him. I love the kid, but based on what Fisher wants, he is not the right fit.

 

[Smed55]

We have seen what he can do when he is healthy. Look at the numbers he put up with ZERO talent around him (his best season as a pro saw Danny Amendola as his best WR..I mean come on). Quick quiz, is his rookie season, where we were one game from winning the division, who was his leading receiver?? It was also Amendola, but he had guys like Brandon Gibson and Laurent Robinson as #2 and #3 A healthy Bradford with THIS skill position talent throws for 4000 yards in 2014 and we win 9 or 10. Yes, I agree the health issue is a true concern, but at the end of the day I think we all know the talent is there. I am very interested to see what he can do with this group, just like I was this past summer in training camp. But I also think if we bring in someone like Jake Locker, Christian Ponder or even Matt Schaub to hedge our bets, it will make this team even better. Then let someone like Bryce Petty just worry about absorbing the playbook and we have a winning formula

Again, you are assuming that he would throw for 4,000, and if that is your point, Davis also would have thrown for over 4,000 this year if he would have played 16 games. Amendola was better that year than any receiver we have now, so at least he had that, and Gibson while not great had some good games, always came up big on 3rd downs. Bradford also had Clayton for a few games. Bradford also had a Allpro running back that year! You would think with teams going with 8 in the box to stop Jackson, Bradford should have done more than he did. Bradford, dinked and dunked his way through that year, some of it was because our OC sucks, but some of it was because Sammie checkdown as SJ calls him, did alot of that!

 

[Smed55]

Davis has more big-play ability than Hill, but he was even worse at avoiding turnovers (which is really incredible). Davis had 12 turnovers in nine games. That's why Fisher was forced to bench him. Not because he is loyal to Hill.. Please. Trust me you don't think they wished Davis could have got the job done so they could cut Bradford and save all that money? Of course they do. I don't know if Davis wins those games Hill does. The Defenses had tape on him and knew he couldnt make a lot of deep type out throws so they left that open and guarded the throws he could make put pressure on him and it was game over for him. Nfl defenses figure stuff out quick ask rg3.

Both Hill and Davis have incredibly weak arms and are totally incapable of throwing the deep ball. That made it impossible for the Rams to take advantage of their speedy receivers on offense. Like I said I would rather have Davis next year vs Hill. Sadford made me.

Ok you can dump the defenses figured him out theory! If that is the case, then the year Manning threw 6 pick 6's, you are telling me the defenses figured him out, the two years Marino threw 5 pick 6's, again the defense figured him out. Farve threw more than 4 pick 6's four different times, oh that's right because the defense figured him out, get real.SAMMIE THREW 3 PICK 6's IN HIS 7 STARTS LAST YEAR, hmmm, I guess maybe the defense figured him out!

Not sure if you noticed but the Ram oline sucked all year until Long got hurt and the oline was shuffled, they still weren't good, but they played better. Gee what a coincident that that all happened about the same time Hill,took over, but you will say they played better because the Veteran Hill was in there, no it was because Long (the supposedly blind side protection for the QB) was out and Robinson took over and a few other guys were moved around. When do most fumbles happen, oh ya, when you are hit from behind! As far as interceptions, when you are behind all the time, there is a good chance that turnovers are going to happen.

As far as arm strength, I don't know where you are getting this idea that Sammie has any, when did this happen? At least Davis does throw downfield and he can throw the deep ball, Sammie is good a t screens and throwing the ball to the line of scrimmage, I've seen it!

 

[Smed55]

You guys can defend Sammie all you want, just look at last year when he was having his "supposed" best year ever when he took us to a 3-4 record in his 7 games, against the likes of Houston(2-14) and Jack(3-13). Come on the proof is in black and white, there is no gray area here, his Red Zone completion percentage was 45%, that is not good. Davis's was 70% this year. Tell me that's not a big difference? Davis played against alot tougher defenses this year than Sammie did last year and we still were 3-5 with Davis, and the defense lost 2 of those games!

 

[zeke2829]

Sam Bradford = HIGH RISK at this point! He's already taken 2 trips on the meat wagon for torn acl's on the same knee. First question to ask yourself is, How durable is he??

Actually the hit that knocked him out this year wasnt a very hard hit whatsoever. His leg was straight the whole time! If he gets a season ending injury that easiliy, why should we want his guy back?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sHWLvPMsWQE

 

[ksudodger]

Amendola was better that year than any receiver we have now, so at least he had that, and Gibson while not great had some good games, always came up big on 3rd downs. Bradford also had Clayton for a few games.

WOW... really?? Amendola better than Quick was this season before he got hurt?? Amendola better than Britt?? Come on man. Amendola of 2012 would have been no better than Tavon was in the offense in 2014... WOW, just WOW.

And just like we are all upset about the Rams offense now with the dink and dunk, that is PLAY CALLING, not the QB. While Davis did take chances down the field, he was consistently dumping the ball to Cunningham, Cook, Britt, Quick on crossing routes because those were the routes called.

Do not get me wrong, I am 100% on the Davis over Hill train. In fact, I would not be upset if he was brought back to be the #2. He is NOT, however, better than Bradford. Not that Bradford has been an all pro, but I like our chances more with a healthy Bradford than with Davis.

 

[shopson67]

I, for one, like Austin Davis and the potential. I agree 100% he should have stayed with Davis for the entire season. Not sure what is going to happen with him. If this team is truly 1 or 2 pieces away from success, I am not he is the guy I want as the backup. I know exactly where Davis would be a perfect fit because he is simply a bigger version of their current QB. He should be the backup in New Orleans. Brees can truly teach him. I love the kid, but based on what Fisher wants, he is not the right fit.

They switched away from Davis to see if Hill could be the steadier hand. Davis' play was becoming more erratic and he was getting Bulgerized. To be fair to the team as a whole (especially the defense that was coming on strong), the switch was made to Hill to be more of a game manager. It worked a bit for a while, then Hill reminded us all why he is a journeyman backup QB.

Comparing Davis to Brees is way over the top. He has some talent for sure (and could be in the mix for primary backup next year if he stays), but c'mon now. When he was cut his rookie year, he only lasted on another practice squad briefly before being let go. The only question ever about Brees was his height, and he still was the second QB drafted overall in 2001 (behind Vick) at pick 2.1.

 

[ksudodger]

Actually the hit that knocked him out this year wasnt a very hard hit whatsoever. His leg was straight the whole time! If he gets a season ending injury the easiliy, why should we want his guy back?

Have you ever torn an ACL?? If you plant the wrong way, a repaired ACL can tear again very easily. Just look at Carson Palmer in our game this year. He planted and went down. Not even hit. Also, medical research has shown that a third tear of the same ligament is 95% less likely than a 2nd. He gets 2015 to sink or swim. If he succeeds, we win. If he does not, we move on and so do Bradford,Fisher and Shotty. It is really a low risk proposition.

As for the argument of red zone percentage, I agree Smed, that DOES concern me. That is something hopefully that can be fixed. I think any QB that has these weapons will improve on 45% in red zone. Again, he (and Fisher and Shotty) get 2015 to sink or swim. But again, I would have no issue with Davis as a #2 next year at all

 

[ksudodger]

Comparing Davis to Brees is way over the top. He has some talent for sure (and could be in the mix for primary backup next year if he stays), but c'mon now.

Not really comparing him specifically to Brees, just saying he plays the same type of QB. Brees could really teach him something.

 

[Smed55]

Amendola was better that year than any receiver we have now, so at least he had that, and Gibson while not great had some good games, always came up big on 3rd downs. Bradford also had Clayton for a few games.

WOW... really?? Amendola better than Quick was this season before he got hurt?? Amendola better than Britt?? Come on man. Amendola of 2012 would have been no better than Tavon was in the offense in 2014... WOW, just WOW.

And just like we are all upset about the Rams offense now with the dink and dunk, that is PLAY CALLING, not the QB. While Davis did take chances down the field, he was consistently dumping the ball to Cunningham, Cook, Britt, Quick on crossing routes because those were the routes called.

Do not get me wrong, I am 100% on the Davis over Hill train. In fact, I would not be upset if he was brought back to be the #2. He is NOT, however, better than Bradford. Not that Bradford has been an all pro, but I like our chances more with a healthy Bradford than with Davis.[/

I assumed that when you were talking about Sammies best year you were talking about his rookie year, if you were i think amendola had like 80 catches, that is something we haven't had in many years. If you weren't talking about that, my bad. So you are going to disregard the fact that we had a guy that was an Allpro running back that year, sorry, but that does help the passing game quite a bit!

From what I and many others on here remember, as many have alluded to Sammie being Bulgerized, Sammie panicked quite often and dumped off, alot, true a lot of our so"called game plan" seems to revolve around that. I will give you the fact that our oline has sucked for years, but alot on here don't cal him Checkdown Sammie for nothing!

As far as Davjs being better than Sammie, I never said that, I think he is just as good, I've seen it, the results for both also show that. And results are what matter!

 

[ksudodger]

I assumed that when you were talking about Sammies best year you were talking about his rookie year, if you were i think amendola had like 80 catches, that is something we haven't had in many years. If you weren't talking about that, my bad. So you are going to disregard the fact that we had a guy that was an Allpro running back that year, sorry, but that does help the passing game quite a bit!

I was actually alluding to both 2010 and 2012 (his two years he played 16 games). I agree Amendola was solid, but he really was the ONLY option. And yes, it helps to have SJ39 in the backfield. I agree there.

Davis is going to be a solid NFL QB if given an opportunity. I just do not think it will be in St Louis. Like I said, either Bradford swims this year or he, along with Fisher and Shotty, are sunk and they will either give the ball to the QB we drafted in round 3 this year (Bryce Petty.. cough cough) or maybe make a play for Connor Cook in 2016.

 

[Smed55]

Interesting take because it comes from a football guy looking in from the outside. Thanks JD!

Thought it was 7 years?

It's all hindsight ALR.

I gotta believe if Fisher knew he would get out of Hill much of what he got out of Davis he would have continued to roll the dice with Davis. I'm sure Fisher agrees with all of us here that neither were good enough but up to the time Fisher pulled Davis, Fisher only knew about one of them not being good enough (Davis).

I have no problem with Fish taking a chance on salvaging the season and again I'm one of the guys who wanted him to stay with Davis for the rest of the season too.

Ok Vita, you stumped me, I give up? Don't know what the 7 years reference is for

 

[27mtrcougar]

They switched away from Davis to see if Hill could be the steadier hand. Davis' play was becoming more erratic and he was getting Bulgerized. To be fair to the team as a whole (especially the defense that was coming on strong), the switch was made to Hill to be more of a game manager. It worked a bit for a while, then Hill reminded us all why he is a journeyman backup QB.

Comparing Davis to Brees is way over the top. He has some talent for sure (and could be in the mix for primary backup next year if he stays), but c'mon now. When he was cut his rookie year, he only lasted on another practice squad briefly before being let go. The only question ever about Brees was his height, and he still was the second QB drafted overall in 2001 (behind Vick) at pick 2.1.

thats exactly what happen. good point on being fair to the team. I think Kdoger was just saying Davis could learn from Brees if he was his back up.

 

[shopson67]

I'm not sure how much the Saints will be spending though, as they need to cut about $24M in salary before next season. Good thing they made things worse by overpaying for Jairus Byrd, who of course immediately got hurt again. The had the other McCown and Griffin (whom they were high on) at backup QB, but McCown is a free agent. Maybe Davis fits there, but in a meager FA QB crop, Davis might have some competition for his services.

 

[Smed55]

Actually the hit that knocked him out this year wasnt a very hard hit whatsoever. His leg was straight the whole time! If he gets a season ending injury the easiliy, why should we want his guy back?

Have you ever torn an ACL?? If you plant the wrong way, a repaired ACL can tear again very easily. Just look at Carson Palmer in our game this year. He planted and went down. Not even hit. Also, medical research has shown that a third tear of the same ligament is 95% less likely than a 2nd. He gets 2015 to sink or swim. If he succeeds, we win. If he does not, we move on and so do Bradford,Fisher and Shotty. It is really a low risk proposition.

As for the argument of red zone percentage, I agree Smed, that DOES concern me. That is something hopefully that can be fixed. I think any QB that has these weapons will improve on 45% in red zone. Again, he (and Fisher and Shotty) get 2015 to sink or swim. But again, I would have no issue with Davis as a #2 next year at all

Not sure about this KSU, but that 95% figure might not involve a guy that is still trying to play
football?