Bartolo Colon

[jta4437]

I wanted them to stick to the 100 games for a second offense if that's what they were calling it. Instead they gave him a deal. That's garbage. Why wouldn't any other person with strikes against them not reach out for a deal now? You give Braun less than the full punishment, but are going full steam after A-Rod? Where is the logic in that? Be consistent.

Technically Braun was being suspended for being named in the Biogenesis documents, which is why he failed the original test, so he's basically just serving his original sentence, like Colon already did

He didn't plea it down to 65 games from 100, it was a 50 game suspension, plus 15 extra games for other rules violations (basically for looking MLB and the tester look bad), basically for being an butthole about the whole process

He's being suspended for one violation of the PED policy, not 2

http://www.jsonline.com/sports/brew...for-basic-agreement-b9965565z1-217697481.html

 

[RevSader]

Technically Braun was being suspended for being named in the Biogenesis documents, which is why he failed the original test, so he's basically just serving his original sentence, like Colon already did

He didn't plea it down to 65 games from 100, it was a 50 game suspension, plus 15 extra games for other rules violations (basically for looking MLB and the tester look bad), basically for being an butthole about the whole process

He's being suspended for one violation of the PED policy, not 2

Ryan Braun suspension includes violation for basic agreement

I don't agree with this interpretation.

 

[scotsman1948]

Even if Alex Rodriguez is banned for life, the Rangers still owe him more than $40 million | Texas Rangers Blog

$50mil ... grrrrrrrrr

if the MLB bans him for life and it stands up with the arbitrator, the Rangers go into court suing him for violating multiple articles of his contract and ask the judge to void out the $50M still owed him. the Yankees are already threatening to do that with what they have left on his contract with them which is why he's fighting it. he wants MLB to guarantee he will still get his money.

 

[jta4437]

I don't agree with this interpretation.

But that's what it is, it's not a 2nd violation, they got him for the same thing they are probably going to get Cruz for, being listed, b/c he technically got off with the first failed test

B/c of the way he handled that situation and his refusal to cooperate with MLB initially is what got him the extra 15 games

So there might have been some negotiating to come to that deal with 15 games, but a 2nd violation was not on the table

 

[Swangin]

I don't agree with this interpretation.

You might not agree, but there really wasn't anything else MLB could do. That's all I'm trying to say, he is serving what the punishment by law is. There really isn't anything MLB could do, unless they just tried to come up with a lot of crap to go through a lot of hassle and headaches for nothing.

 

[cezero]

The only thing funnier than MLB and the player's union saying they care about cutting PED use would be the NFL and their player's union saying it.

Smoke and mirrors. PR tabloid garbage that gets people talking for a few news cycles, and then lets professional athletics organizations say "see how much we care about stopping PED use!" Herp derp.

I'll believe MLB and the player's union actually care about trying to eliminate PED when as many players get caught by its own testing procedures as caught by tertiary, non-biological evidence from a weasel who runs a clinic and gives it up in an attempt to protect himself.

 

[RevSader]

But that's what it is, it's not a 2nd violation, they got him for the same thing they are probably going to get Cruz for, being listed, b/c he technically got off with the first failed test

B/c of the way he handled that situation and his refusal to cooperate with MLB initially is what got him the extra 15 games

So there might have been some negotiating to come to that deal with 15 games, but a 2nd violation was not on the table

I don't agree. The MLB originally tried to get him for 100 games, and counted the dishonesty as the second violation. That is one writers interpretation of what went down.

 

[jta4437]

You might not agree, but there really wasn't anything else MLB could do. That's all I'm trying to say, he is serving what the punishment by law is. There really isn't anything MLB could do, unless they just tried to come up with a lot of crap to go through a lot of hassle and headaches for nothing.

My issue is suspending people on heresay and circumstantial evidence, if thats the case we should've just used Jose Canseco's book to start suspending people

Improve your testing and actually catch people with failed tests, or get out of here

 

[jta4437]

I don't agree. The MLB originally tried to get him for 100 games, and counted the dishonesty as the second violation. That is one writers interpretation of what went down.

Thats how I've seen it interpreted from the beginning, from MLB in fact

 

[cezero]

But that's what it is, it's not a 2nd violation, they got him for the same thing they are probably going to get Cruz for, being listed, b/c he technically got off with the first failed test

B/c of the way he handled that situation and his refusal to cooperate with MLB initially is what got him the extra 15 games

So there might have been some negotiating to come to that deal with 15 games, but a 2nd violation was not on the table

The lifetime ban threat probably has little to do with the evidence that he juiced.

I'd be willing to bet that the main reason they could ban him from the game was for the attempts to get Biogensis people to destroy evidence.

If it were anything else, A-Fraud wouldn't be negotiating, he'd fight it. He must know they could nail him with the obstruction charge.

 

[RevSader]

Thats how I've seen it interpreted from the beginning, from MLB in fact

Then why they did they initially seek 100 games? They know their own rules.

 

[RevSader]

My issue is suspending people on heresay and circumstantial evidence, if thats the case we should've just used Jose Canseco's book to start suspending people

Improve your testing and actually catch people with failed tests, or get out of here

Yes, the testing needs to be more frequent and handled better. A player shouldn't get off because of chain of custody violation. For a billion dollar industry they don't seem all that interested in proper testing.

 

[jta4437]

Then why they did they initially seek 100 games? They know their own rules.

50 for the PED violation, and however many they wanted to do for the other violations, They could only pop him once for PEDs though, I agree he plead it down, just not the PED violation, the 15 game part

 

[RevSader]

50 for the PED violation, and however many they wanted to do for the other violations, They could only pop him once for PEDs though, I agree he plead it down, just not the PED violation, the 15 game part

Ultimately he had no choice but to plea. That information would have ruined his career had it been released. So he loses 3.5 million, gets to heal up the nagging injuries, and doesn't have to play on a crappy team for 3 months. Would be so nice to get of on being dishonest snake. Braun could be a Wall Street Banker.

 

[jta4437]

Ultimately he had no choice but to plea. That information would have ruined his career had it been released. So he loses 3.5 million, gets to heal up the nagging injuries, and doesn't have to play on a crappy team for 3 months. Would be so nice to get of on being dishonest snake. Braun could be a Wall Street Banker.

I agree, they were going to try and nail him to the wall IN ADDITION to the PED violation, b/c of the things he said and did after getting away with it the first time

 

[Swangin]

My issue is suspending people on heresay and circumstantial evidence, if thats the case we should've just used Jose Canseco's book to start suspending people

Improve your testing and actually catch people with failed tests, or get out of here

If the evidence is there, they can't ignore it. And apparently the evidence is pretty obvious from how it looks. It wasn't just someone naming names.

I have no clue how testing works, how masking test works, how easy and hard it is. I don't even pretend to know. I do however feel there have been steps taking in the right direction. I just don't think people grasp how hard it is to catch everyone that is using, and totally clean something up that was so out of control. Hardly anything that is wide spread gets cleaned up as fast as people would like. And if people think any sport will ever be totally clean they are foolish.

I guess my biggest problem is, what do people want to change? Do you want players to be tested every morning and night? Be tested in front of cameras? Create some test that can never be masked by something? With everything I have to go by I feel it has cleaned up a lot, I never would expect it to be totally clean. I just don't know what people want or expect I guess?

 

[RevSader]

If the evidence is there, they can't ignore it. And apparently the evidence is pretty obvious from how it looks. It wasn't just someone naming names.

I have no clue how testing works, how masking test works, how easy and hard it is. I don't even pretend to know. I do however feel there have been steps taking in the right direction. I just don't think people grasp how hard it is to catch everyone that is using, and totally clean something up that was so out of control. Hardly anything that is wide spread gets cleaned up as fast as people would like. And if people think any sport will ever be totally clean they are foolish.

I guess my biggest problem is, what do people want to change? Do you want players to be tested every morning and night? Be tested in front of cameras? Create some test that can never be masked by something? With everything I have to go by I feel it has cleaned up a lot, I never would expect it to be totally clean. I just don't know what people want or expect I guess?

Where you see real change, I see the illusion of change. I am a skeptical guy for a myriad of reasons. They banned PEDs 22 years ago, and finally now they are serious about eradicating them? Hard for me to trust them when they say they are serious about it now.

 

[jta4437]

If the evidence is there, they can't ignore it. And apparently the evidence is pretty obvious from how it looks. It wasn't just someone naming names.

I have no clue how testing works, how masking test works, how easy and hard it is. I don't even pretend to know. I do however feel there have been steps taking in the right direction. I just don't think people grasp how hard it is to catch everyone that is using, and totally clean something up that was so out of control. Hardly anything that is wide spread gets cleaned up as fast as people would like. And if people think any sport will ever be totally clean they are foolish.

I guess my biggest problem is, what do people want to change? Do you want players to be tested every morning and night? Be tested in front of cameras? Create some test that can never be masked by something? With everything I have to go by I feel it has cleaned up a lot, I never would expect it to be totally clean. I just don't know what people want or expect I guess?

If people like Braun, who have a TON to lose by using PEDs, then there is truly something wrong with the way they are doing it,

Guys like Colon they're just trying to get by, they have everything to gain by cheating, those guys will always exist

Its the Brauns that truly have something to lose, the goal should be to have a system where those guys never feel its worth using PEDs

And it should be done with testing and not with documents

 

[Swangin]

Where you see real change, I see the illusion of change. I am a skeptical guy for a myriad of reasons. They banned PEDs 22 years ago, and finally now they are serious about eradicating them? Hard for me to trust them when they say they are serious about it now.

The drug and testing policy didn't happen until about 6 years ago. HGH became more popular and they now put that into the testing process as well. If you wanted players to be tested 24/7 and MLB to have the most advanced testing policy on planet earth the day after steroid talk became such a huge conversation than ok, I don't know what to say.

I'm simply saying there are now rules put in place, there is more advance testing, how good it works, I don't know. But I know by simply having it in place it will cut down on a lot of use itself. And the more players that are against it, the more it will cut down. In the late 90's it wasn't a big deal, and people wouldn't talk out against it. You have players today on their twitter ridiculing Braun, no way something like that happens even 10 years ago. I look at numbers, and there isn't these huge gaps between players from one year to the next. I don't know the actual numbers, but yeah, it seems to be cleaner to me.

If you are wanting a totally clean sport that will probably never happen.

 

[Swangin]

If people like Braun, who have a TON to lose by using PEDs, then there is truly something wrong with the way they are doing it,

Guys like Colon they're just trying to get by, they have everything to gain by cheating, those guys will always exist

Its the Brauns that truly have something to lose, the goal should be to have a system where those guys never feel its worth using PEDs

And it should be done with testing and not with documents

Braun did get tested, and failed. If not for the technicality the testing WOULD have busted him