And it has started

[NetsGotBanned21]

I say the problem is coaching due in large part, because of things like not stretching the field. Not having formations that cause matchups. Great coaches create matchup problems. Look at what Payton did for the Saints this year and just recently Monday night. Same talent that started off 0-4 last year is now 4-0 this season. Watching the game Monday night you see Sproles motion out to the X WR position, this gives Brees not only the ability to see if the Fins are playing man or zone, but also place the inside WR which could be Colston, Graham, etc the matchup against a LB like Ellerby. The creative mind that Sean is creates that, opens up the field. I promise you that Dez is faster than Colston, Graham, etc yet those guys can stretch the field, because of the formations, not because the are fast. This team will not be better until the coaching becomes better. Disagree with me all you want, but that is what I see. Sure the players have to do better themselves; but it's the responsibilty of the coach(s) to place the players in a position to do better. How many times do you see Murray motion out of the backfield? How many screens have we had this season? How many times have we stacked 3 or 4 WR's/TE's on one side to create problems for the secondary? These are the things that need to change. Our O is VERY basic to me. It goes far beyond the lack of not running the ball, and more to the fact that not only do we not run enough, but we also have a basic O playbook with nothing being mixed into it. Complicate things please!

 

[Schmoopy1000]

How much faster do you guys think Cruz is than our WRs? You act as if he is running a 4.3 40. And either way, that doesn't make it easier to hit a guy in stride if he is running a 4.3 anyway..and that post is just a big excuse. Both guys know and practice the pattern. The WR often only adjusts if it is thrown poorly. You act as if every go pattern was done via "a wink and a nod" at teh LOS after noticing single coverage or a mismatch.

In pads he seems to burn DBs much better than our WRs, as someone pointed out. 40 times isn't what makes a deep threat. & adjusting to catch passes happens a lot more than just for poorly thrown balls. Fading to the left or right as the ball is coming to them instead of adjusting at the last second happens probably on most deep balls. It is more rare than it looks to run straight & the ball lands on the WR in stride. Other times a WR may slow up a tic while running so they can catch it in stride & once have the ball speed up, instead of slowing up at the last moments killing his momentum. Although on TV it looks like it was just dropped into the WRs hands. lots of subtle adjustments WRs make on a long pass to catch them in stride.

 

[jarntt]

First off, Romo isn't Brees, we don't have a Graham and Murray is nowhere near the talent of Sproles IN SPACE.

I do agree with most of what you say, but I can't agree that coaching is the BIGGEST problem from what I see this year. Yes, our OL is playing better than last year and our DL is playing way better than any of us could have hoped - I think a lot of that is a credit to good coaching. We have inexperienced safeties and are already playing a lot of what was supposed to be depth guys this year for a full 16 games. The players need to execute and when they don't, they make all of the coaching decisions look poor, when they do, they make the decisions look good. I think there is a little less coaching involved on game day than you seem to portray. Yes, I fully understand and am a big proponent of how important coaching is in the NFL and the play calling is huge and yes the adjustments are huge, but you've planned it out all week if you are doing your job. On game day it mostly comes down to running the game plan, adjusting where need be and EXECUTION. Do you trust our safeties one on one with most WRs? When Mo gives up all these receptions, what can the coaches do? Each big 3rd down completion is huge as far as changing the outcome of the game. Do you really want to see Webb in the game for him? This is a pretty simple defense, which was one of the biggest reasons for me liking it. If our guys don't know what to do in this D, there may be no hope for them, yet we still have seen some confusion in coverage this year. When the WRs drop all these balls, what can the coaches do? When the DL can't get pressure because Spencer and Crawford are out and Selvie and Ware are hurting, what should they do? Our coverage isn't that great so blitzing more guys (that may not get there) and creating more isolation doesn't seem smart as the "norm" does it?

In addition to the overall lack of committing to the run, our biggest play calling problems that I saw were the red zone calls against the Chiefs. At first it appeared to be Callahan and then it came out that Romo audibled some of those calls. Looking at a stat sheet, we don't know if Romo switched a run play to a pass play or vice versa. What I have noticed historically with Romo's audibles is he is too willing to change a run to a pass if there are 8 in the box and pass to a run when there aren't. It's like following HS cues 101. Sometimes you just need to run the friggin play that you want and not adjust to what the defense gives you. Impose your will. I do agree that we need to use a little more motion with our receivers. Let's make 2 or 3 guys follow Dez across the field or make every guy on the defense adjust when he does so. Other teams seem to stack receivers and confuse the heck out of us, but I don't see us do that too often. Motion also allows the QB to get a better read on what the defense is doing, but the only guys we seem to send in motion consistently are our TEs. If we want to put a RB out in motion and turn him up the field, let's use Dunbar. His quickness is going to get noticed even if he doesn't get the ball.

My biggest problem with the coaching is committing to the run and if Romo is audibling out of runs, then he needs to be told not to. I think we commit early to running the ball this week and if we stay in the game i think we will run it a lot on Sunday. Even if we fall behind, we can't panic into think we must throw hte ball every play. that seldom works for us, yet we seem to do it every time we get down by double digits.

 

[jarntt]

it is kinda hard to overthrow cruz.

You guys brought speed into the equation, not me. I was the one stating it wasn't necessary. Which brings us back to accurate deep balls as the problem.

 

[PDay8810]

First off, Romo isn't Brees, we don't have a Graham and Murray is nowhere near the talent of Sproles IN SPACE.

I do agree with most of what you say, but I can't agree that coaching is the BIGGEST problem from what I see this year. Yes, our OL is playing better than last year and our DL is playing way better than any of us could have hoped - I think a lot of that is a credit to good coaching. We have inexperienced safeties and are already playing a lot of what was supposed to be depth guys this year for a full 16 games. The players need to execute and when they don't, they make all of the coaching decisions look poor, when they do, they make the decisions look good. I think there is a little less coaching involved on game day than you seem to portray. Yes, I fully understand and am a big proponent of how important coaching is in the NFL and the play calling is huge and yes the adjustments are huge, but you've planned it out all week if you are doing your job. On game day it mostly comes down to running the game plan, adjusting where need be and EXECUTION. Do you trust our safeties one on one with most WRs? When Mo gives up all these receptions, what can the coaches do? Each big 3rd down completion is huge as far as changing the outcome of the game. Do you really want to see Webb in the game for him? This is a pretty simple defense, which was one of the biggest reasons for me liking it. If our guys don't know what to do in this D, there may be no hope for them, yet we still have seen some confusion in coverage this year. When the WRs drop all these balls, what can the coaches do? When the DL can't get pressure because Spencer and Crawford are out and Selvie and Ware are hurting, what should they do? Our coverage isn't that great so blitzing more guys (that may not get there) and creating more isolation doesn't seem smart as the "norm" does it?

In addition to the overall lack of committing to the run, our biggest play calling problems that I saw were the red zone calls against the Chiefs. At first it appeared to be Callahan and then it came out that Romo audibled some of those calls. Looking at a stat sheet, we don't know if Romo switched a run play to a pass play or vice versa. What I have noticed historically with Romo's audibles is he is too willing to change a run to a pass if there are 8 in the box and pass to a run when there aren't. It's like following HS cues 101. Sometimes you just need to run the friggin play that you want and not adjust to what the defense gives you. Impose your will. I do agree that we need to use a little more motion with our receivers. Let's make 2 or 3 guys follow Dez across the field or make every guy on the defense adjust when he does so. Other teams seem to stack receivers and confuse the heck out of us, but I don't see us do that too often. Motion also allows the QB to get a better read on what the defense is doing, but the only guys we seem to send in motion consistently are our TEs. If we want to put a RB out in motion and turn him up the field, let's use Dunbar. His quickness is going to get noticed even if he doesn't get the ball.

My biggest problem with the coaching is committing to the run and if Romo is audibling out of runs, then he needs to be told not to. I think we commit early to running the ball this week and if we stay in the game i think we will run it a lot on Sunday. Even if we fall behind, we can't panic into think we must throw hte ball every play. that seldom works for us, yet we seem to do it every time we get down by double digits.

team game, group effort
as the Rangers baseball coach says...."Do what the game asked you to do"

 

[PDay8810]

You guys brought speed into the equation, not me. I was the one stating it wasn't necessary. Which brings us back to accurate deep balls as the problem.

I think it started with the term stretch the field and some how went to speed and formations.

wonder how many played sandlot football as a kid.

 

[Schmoopy1000]

You guys brought speed into the equation, not me. I was the one stating it wasn't necessary. Which brings us back to accurate deep balls as the problem.

well I answered that part of your question to me about Cruz. But I agree with you that speed isn't the deciding factor on the long ball. What I do point out though is the quality of the WR makes a difference for long balls not just an accurate passer. Which is why I was talking about Eli getting help from his WRs. I was agreeing with Manster that Eli wasn't a good example. I wasn't defending Romo at all.

 

[NetsGotBanned21]

First off, Romo isn't Brees, we don't have a Graham and Murray is nowhere near the talent of Sproles IN SPACE.

I do agree with most of what you say, but I can't agree that coaching is the BIGGEST problem from what I see this year. Yes, our OL is playing better than last year and our DL is playing way better than any of us could have hoped - I think a lot of that is a credit to good coaching. We have inexperienced safeties and are already playing a lot of what was supposed to be depth guys this year for a full 16 games. The players need to execute and when they don't, they make all of the coaching decisions look poor, when they do, they make the decisions look good. I think there is a little less coaching involved on game day than you seem to portray. Yes, I fully understand and am a big proponent of how important coaching is in the NFL and the play calling is huge and yes the adjustments are huge, but you've planned it out all week if you are doing your job. On game day it mostly comes down to running the game plan, adjusting where need be and EXECUTION. Do you trust our safeties one on one with most WRs? When Mo gives up all these receptions, what can the coaches do? Each big 3rd down completion is huge as far as changing the outcome of the game. Do you really want to see Webb in the game for him? This is a pretty simple defense, which was one of the biggest reasons for me liking it. If our guys don't know what to do in this D, there may be no hope for them, yet we still have seen some confusion in coverage this year. When the WRs drop all these balls, what can the coaches do? When the DL can't get pressure because Spencer and Crawford are out and Selvie and Ware are hurting, what should they do? Our coverage isn't that great so blitzing more guys (that may not get there) and creating more isolation doesn't seem smart as the "norm" does it?

In addition to the overall lack of committing to the run, our biggest play calling problems that I saw were the red zone calls against the Chiefs. At first it appeared to be Callahan and then it came out that Romo audibled some of those calls. Looking at a stat sheet, we don't know if Romo switched a run play to a pass play or vice versa. What I have noticed historically with Romo's audibles is he is too willing to change a run to a pass if there are 8 in the box and pass to a run when there aren't. It's like following HS cues 101. Sometimes you just need to run the friggin play that you want and not adjust to what the defense gives you. Impose your will. I do agree that we need to use a little more motion with our receivers. Let's make 2 or 3 guys follow Dez across the field or make every guy on the defense adjust when he does so. Other teams seem to stack receivers and confuse the heck out of us, but I don't see us do that too often. Motion also allows the QB to get a better read on what the defense is doing, but the only guys we seem to send in motion consistently are our TEs. If we want to put a RB out in motion and turn him up the field, let's use Dunbar. His quickness is going to get noticed even if he doesn't get the ball.

My biggest problem with the coaching is committing to the run and if Romo is audibling out of runs, then he needs to be told not to. I think we commit early to running the ball this week and if we stay in the game i think we will run it a lot on Sunday. Even if we fall behind, we can't panic into think we must throw hte ball every play. that seldom works for us, yet we seem to do it every time we get down by double digits.

To me coaching plays a far greater role into winning than player talent does; as well as a great coach can make an average player look great, and a horrible coach can make a great player look horrible.

Two examples of former Cowboys:

Marty B his time spent in Dallas was laughable at best. Since then he is one of the better TE's in the NFL.

TNew was getting worked his last few years in Dallas, goes to Cincy and looks like a very solid player.

Two examples of non Cowboys:

Matt Flynn in GB looks like a starting QB in the NFL when he played for GB those few games.

Matt Cassell looked great in NE when he was there.

Coaching plays a major role in how players play and agree or disagree that is my opinion. Do I believe it is all coaching? No way, not at all; but I do believe that JG would be a better GM than HC. I also believe that our OC needs to go back to just the OL coach. Get a guy like Dungy and Moore in here and I bet anything we'd go from 8 wins a year to 10-11 a year with this crew easy.

 

[NetsGotBanned21]

team game, group effort
as the Rangers baseball coach says...."Do what the game asked you to do"

Baseball and Football are two different sports bro. That is why they call baseball coaches Managers and not Coaches. Baseball is more of a managed sport where as Football is more of a Coaching and Developing sport.

 

[PDay8810]

Baseball and Football are two different sports bro. That is why they call baseball coaches Managers and not Coaches. Baseball is more of a managed sport where as Football is more of a Coaching and Developing sport.

Thanks for the clarification.
Pretty sure you got that cap stuff down....not all that sure on all other aspects of sports

 

[PDay8810]

To me coaching plays a far greater role into winning than player talent does; as well as a great coach can make an average player look great, and a horrible coach can make a great player look horrible.

Two examples of former Cowboys:

Marty B his time spent in Dallas was laughable at best. Since then he is one of the better TE's in the NFL.

TNew was getting worked his last few years in Dallas, goes to Cincy and looks like a very solid player.

Two examples of non Cowboys:

Matt Flynn in GB looks like a starting QB in the NFL when he played for GB those few games.

Matt Cassell looked great in NE when he was there.

Coaching plays a major role in how players play and agree or disagree that is my opinion. Do I believe it is all coaching? No way, not at all; but I do believe that JG would be a better GM than HC. I also believe that our OC needs to go back to just the OL coach. Get a guy like Dungy and Moore in here and I bet anything we'd go from 8 wins a year to 10-11 a year with this crew easy.

Examples?

Lol....many more showing talent wins at this level.

 

[ROMOTOOWENS]

I definitely see Nets point. Jarntt comes out and talks about the Saints - which to me have 2 mismatches everytime thay step on the field. We dont have a Jimmy Graham, but we do have something similar to Sproles in space with Dunbar. Whether its fumbling issues or something else, he isnt on the field enough IMO. But then Jarntt began by saying Romo is no Brees. Brees was just a pretty good QB in SD. He didnt start putting up video game numbers until he got to Payton- now he is Hall of Fame worthy. My question is did Payton make Brees or Brees make Payton.

 

[Schmoopy1000]

I definitely see Nets point. Jarntt comes out and talks about the Saints - which to me have 2 mismatches everytime thay step on the field. We dont have a Jimmy Graham, but we do have something similar to Sproles in space with Dunbar. Whether its fumbling issues or something else, he isnt on the field enough IMO. But then Jarntt began by saying Romo is no Brees. Brees was just a pretty good QB in SD. He didnt start putting up video game numbers until he got to Payton- now he is Hall of Fame worthy. My question is did Payton make Brees or Brees make Payton.

I don't think you should ever compare our offense to the Saints. they beat us in all categories concerned with passing. Also they can do numerous things out of the same formation. BTW Brees was no sloutch in SD. SD had to trade him to get Rivers in the starting lineup because Rivers couldn't beat out Brees. It took a shoulder injury to even get Rivers in. Brees was a good QB before becoming a Saint Stat machine.

 

[ROMOTOOWENS]

Wasnt comparing our offenses at all. Im saying Brees turned into Hall of Fame after he was with the Saints. He wasnt a slouch with SD - no, but he wasnt a top 5 QB either. He had one really good season .

 

[jarntt]

I definitely see Nets point. Jarntt comes out and talks about the Saints - which to me have 2 mismatches everytime thay step on the field. We dont have a Jimmy Graham, but we do have something similar to Sproles in space with Dunbar. Whether its fumbling issues or something else, he isnt on the field enough IMO. But then Jarntt began by saying Romo is no Brees. Brees was just a pretty good QB in SD. He didnt start putting up video game numbers until he got to Payton- now he is Hall of Fame worthy. My question is did Payton make Brees or Brees make Payton.

he brought up the Saints, not me.

 

[NetsGotBanned21]

I don't think you should ever compare our offense to the Saints. they beat us in all categories concerned with passing. Also they can do numerous things out of the same formation. BTW Brees was no sloutch in SD. SD had to trade him to get Rivers in the starting lineup because Rivers couldn't beat out Brees. It took a shoulder injury to even get Rivers in. Brees was a good QB before becoming a Saint Stat machine.

Ask Rivers what's the difference in his numbers this year and the past 2-3 seasons and he says coaching. RomotoOwens is not saying that we are as good as the Saints are, but I will go on record and say that we have as much talent if not more on the O as the Saints do. Only difference is coaching.

RomotoOwens, Brees was very good in SD reason the Chargers did not resign him is due to the shoulder injury that they thought was a career ending one. However to your point, Brees was not the same QB he is in NO as he was in SD. Credit that to maturity or coaching, either way he is far better. I will say it has a little bit of both, and that Coaching plays a major factor into it. Just my opinion though as always.

 

[jarntt]

To me coaching plays a far greater role into winning than player talent does; as well as a great coach can make an average player look great, and a horrible coach can make a great player look horrible.

Two examples of former Cowboys:

Marty B his time spent in Dallas was laughable at best. Since then he is one of the better TE's in the NFL.

TNew was getting worked his last few years in Dallas, goes to Cincy and looks like a very solid player.

Two examples of non Cowboys:

Matt Flynn in GB looks like a starting QB in the NFL when he played for GB those few games.

Matt Cassell looked great in NE when he was there.

Coaching plays a major role in how players play and agree or disagree that is my opinion. Do I believe it is all coaching? No way, not at all; but I do believe that JG would be a better GM than HC. I also believe that our OC needs to go back to just the OL coach. Get a guy like Dungy and Moore in here and I bet anything we'd go from 8 wins a year to 10-11 a year with this crew easy.

I can cherry pick a bunch of examples going both ways (Laurent Robinson). To me Bennett moslty just received an opportunity for once. His stats got better in part because he became the #1 guy. If Witten didn't play any games I would have expected similar stats if he stayed here. But he only caught 55/90 targets last year. Doesn't that kind of suck?

 

[Schmoopy1000]

I can cherry pick a bunch of examples going both ways (Laurent Robinson). To me Bennett moslty just received an opportunity for once. His stats got better in part because he became the #1 guy. If Witten didn't play any games I would have expected similar stats if he stayed here. But he only caught 55/90 targets last year. Doesn't that kind of suck?

& he didn't get to stick around. he now plays on another team this year. I think Marty B was a bad example.

 

[jarntt]

Ask Rivers what's the difference in his numbers this year and the past 2-3 seasons and he says coaching. RomotoOwens is not saying that we are as good as the Saints are, but I will go on record and say that we have as much talent if not more on the O as the Saints do. Only difference is coaching.

RomotoOwens, Brees was very good in SD reason the Chargers did not resign him is due to the shoulder injury that they thought was a career ending one. However to your point, Brees was not the same QB he is in NO as he was in SD. Credit that to maturity or coaching, either way he is far better. I will say it has a little bit of both, and that Coaching plays a major factor into it. Just my opinion though as always.

That crappy coaching Rivers had last year played a big role in getting Aikman in the HOF...
I'm not saying our coaches are Sean Payton by any means and I'm not saying they don't also need to get better, because they do.. I'm just not blaming them over the players. We've been through a bunch of coaches lately with the same results. They can't all suck.

 

[NetsGotBanned21]

Thanks for the clarification.
Pretty sure you got that cap stuff down....not all that sure on all other aspects of sports

Examples?

Lol....many more showing talent wins at this level.

Chicken vs Egg

Also I'd say that I have a fairly good understanding of numerous other aspects of sports; however would I be a better GM or HC, and I'll be the first to tell you I'd be a better GM. I'm not saying any of what I had wrote about talent vs coaching to be fact as with the cap numbers, as cap numbers can be proven by numbers and stats, and coaching vs talent can't always be; this is why I have stated it to be opinion based only. As I respect your opinion, consider to do the same for me as well. Thanks in advance bro.