Alex Tanny

[Sharkinva]

Buy the way twist, the only way this settlement affect current players is, it will likely make the league force them to pay into a bigger pool for their after football care. Your proposal is ridiculous. Here is why, say a QB who has already had two concussions over his career, some how manages to get three in a single season. Lets also say this QB is on a $100 million Dollar contract with say $50 million guaranteed and he is only in the second year of that new deal. His dead cap money would be upwards of $40 million Dollars. No way in hell ANY owner would sign off on a deal that could possibly FORCE a guy to retire and cause a $40 million dollar cap hit. No owner is going to sign off on a deal that could single handedly allow ONE player getting hurt to gut the entire team. Not going to happen.

 

[Manster7588]

Again... strictly from a football standpoint here. Romo is 33. Im not saying Dallas should burn a first round pick on a QB. Im damn sure not saying they should trade up in the 1st to get a guy like Manziel (although it would make me chuckle I admit). But a SMART team would realize that Romo is in fact 33, MOST QBs retire by 36 or so. Romo will be 34 next year. So it would be smart for the Cowboys to look at say a 2nd round pick on a QB, where you likely could find a Kaepernick, Foles, Ponder type. NOT over draft him and NOT force a young guy in to start from day one ala Tannehill in Miami. Worst case, they get a guy they can groom for four years that likely makes a decent backup to Romo, costs less than Orton does right now, and if Romo is still there in 2017 you have the option of resigning your backup that Knows your system and might not be in high demand because no one has seen him outside your organization for the past four years, or you draft another one in 2016.

geno Smith is on a 4 year $5 million dollar deal.

Orton is on a 3 year $10 million dollar deal.

At the end of both deals... which player is better for the team long term??

Problem with using a 2nd or lower on a QB is if he is worth a damn we lose him to FA before Romo is gone unless there is an injury. If he is not worth some other team stealing via FA, he not worth holding onto long enough for Romo's deal to be at the point where we can afford to release him. Like a said if a Rogers type QB falls far enough then we need to consider him, if not we need to wait for 2015 or 16. Look at Geno as your example. He's on a four year deal, Romo is virtually guaranteed to be here baring injury another 5 years. Taking a 2nd rd QB in 14 give him and Romo 4 years and both come do at the same point. If the young QB shows he is a NFL ready QB we will have to fight other teams for his services, thus driving up his price on us. If we wait until 1015 we are guaranteed to have the QB as our #1 for a season under his rookie deal, giving us a better chance to see if he really is a NFL QB. Taking a QB too soon make little sense unless somebody falls and becomes too much of a value to pass on. I'm more than happy to have Romo locked up for 5 years, and I prefer to find a QB from another team with 4 years and a few NFL wins under his belt to be the next BU.

 

[Manster7588]

With our 2nd 3rd round pick, I thought having Matt Barkley fall that far made for an ideal situation to take a chance on a young QB. After 2-3 years of sitting behind Romo, who knows? I know it might have cost us Wilcox, but there were a couple of other nice safety prospects who slid, Phillip Thomas for one

The Matt Barkley type to fall is exactly the type of QB I'm talking about as a guy to take a chance on. When he made it to the 4th I was ready for Dallas to call his name. As soon as the Eagles took him I was on their board saying I thought is was a great pick for them. Don't be surprised when he wrest that job away soon.

 

[tw1st3d]

Buy the way twist, the only way this settlement affect current players is, it will likely make the league force them to pay into a bigger pool for their after football care. Your proposal is ridiculous. Here is why, say a QB who has already had two concussions over his career, some how manages to get three in a single season. Lets also say this QB is on a $100 million Dollar contract with say $50 million guaranteed and he is only in the second year of that new deal. His dead cap money would be upwards of $40 million Dollars. No way in hell ANY owner would sign off on a deal that could possibly FORCE a guy to retire and cause a $40 million dollar cap hit. No owner is going to sign off on a deal that could single handedly allow ONE player getting hurt to gut the entire team. Not going to happen.

If you believe that .........

I got some prime property to sell you .... real cheap too

only the money amount has been released and agreed on ...

conditions are still being debated..... Make no mistake when a lawsuit jumps on the first offer.... they are going to jump on the conditions as well

trust me when I say you will never again see a QB take 7 concussions ... and at the age of 50 demand millions from the league

League is always going to protect itself.... the game itself is bigger than ANY player ..... Watch when the conditions are agreed on .... they were just talking about this .....

Your boy is going to be the poster child for not trading picks to get an always injured player

 

[Sharkinva]

Manster.. agreed. But you notice i did say dallas needs to make a move within the next two to three drafts. You only grab some one next year if one of two things happen.

1. Dallas has a horrid season that can be blamed on Romo.
2. A really good prospect falls to you in the late second/early 3rd round

This also assumes Orton is still around next year as well. If not... its much cheaper to draft a second round QB for four years than it is to sign a veteran backup to a 3-4 year $10 million dollar deal as has been the case in Dallas recently.

 

[UK Cowboy]

The Matt Barkley type to fall is exactly the type of QB I'm talking about as a guy to take a chance on. When he made it to the 4th I was ready for Dallas to call his name. As soon as the Eagles took him I was on their board saying I thought is was a great pick for them. Don't be surprised when he wrest that job away soon.

Yep, regardless of whether he pans out or not, for the Eagles to get a guy who was at one time considered a possible number 1 overall pick in the 4th round was an excellent job by them IMO.

 

[cezero]

I keep seeing this thread pop up in the popular threads at the top of the sportshoopla page.

I always think it says Alex Tranny.

k bye.

 

[Sharkinva]

If you believe that .........

I got some prime property to sell you .... real cheap too

only the money amount has been released and agreed on ...

conditions are still being debated..... Make no mistake when a lawsuit jumps on the first offer.... they are going to jump on the conditions as well

trust me when I say you will never again see a QB take 7 concussions ... and at the age of 50 demand millions from the league

League is always going to protect itself.... the game itself is bigger than ANY player ..... Watch when the conditions are agreed on .... they were just talking about this .....

Your boy is going to be the poster child for not trading picks to get an always injured player

Twist.. right now with your proposal, if Peyton Manning has another neck injury and is forced to retire, the Broncos take an immediate $40 million dollar cap hit. thus putting them over the cap NOW. League would not be protecting itself in that case because it would force them to change the cap rules to take that kind of proposal into account. This would also require a sign off by the NFLPA. they cant even agree on an approved HGH test. You think the NFLPA is going to sign off on forced retirement packages??

 

[tw1st3d]

Twist.. right now with your proposal, if Peyton Manning has another neck injury and is forced to retire, the Broncos take an immediate $40 million dollar cap hit. thus putting them over the cap NOW. League would not be protecting itself in that case because it would force them to change the cap rules to take that kind of proposal into account. This would also require a sign off by the NFLPA. they cant even agree on an approved HGH test. You think the NFLPA is going to sign off on forced retirement packages??

No you are talking about protecting Denver... Not the NFL

Already similar rules in effect ... Draft a trouble maker early ... and he gets in trouble ... they strip draft picks ..

NFL as a league ... is going to make it so hard to keep injury prone players on your roster ... they will be treated WORSE than trouble makes .... If your team takes a chance on them

you can talk out your ass all you want .... the chess pieces are already in play

 

[Sharkinva]

Buy the way twist.. the league currently spends just under $4 BILLION a year on Player salaries. this settlement which is spread over five years is a drop in the bucket to a $10 billion dollar a year industry. That $10 billion is what they clear AFTER paying the players, coaches, water boys and stadium parking lot attendants. Smart money says the league agrees to allocate 2-5% yearly to the retired players medical care fund going forward, the players are forced to match and the concept of forced retirements goes out the window.

But you keep hoping RG3 gets his knee blown out and forced to retire.. I'll tag that hundred for you if you would like to take me up on it.

 

[tw1st3d]

Buy the way twist.. the league currently spends just under $4 BILLION a year on Player salaries. this settlement which is spread over five years is a drop in the bucket to a $10 billion dollar a year industry. That $10 billion is what they clear AFTER paying the players, coaches, water boys and stadium parking lot attendants. Smart money says the league agrees to allocate 2-5% yearly to the retired players medical care fund going forward, the players are forced to match and the concept of forced retirements goes out the window.

But you keep hoping RG3 gets his knee blown out and forced to retire.. I'll tag that hundred for you if you would like to take me up on it.

See this is where your football IQ drops off.....
For every starting tackle you have .... there are 3-4 hurt in camp

Give you an example ... if you watch Hard Knocks ... When they followed Jacksonville. They had a lineman with a knee injury ... ( never healed) ended up staff infection.... no knee left when all was said and done ...
Now that's a no name player ... that never started..... 1 million a year .. ( pay check plus medical)
Now there are 100 guys a year with similar situations .. broke kneck .. never play again ... knee gone never play again ... players you never hear about .... ALL EQUAL when it comes to player compensation ....
If you say it isnt ... then say people that live in the country should pay $5 a month ... while anyone in a crime ridden city should pay $60,000 a month ... cause that who the insurance companies spend the most on .... Can't do it ... it's illegal

But any job can refuse you employment ... if they find it a health hazard .... and that is going to be the loophole.... you live in your fantasy world .... I'll live in reality

 

[Sharkinva]

No you are talking about protecting Denver... Not the NFL

Already similar rules in effect ... Draft a trouble maker early ... and he gets in trouble ... they strip draft picks ..

NFL as a league ... is going to make it so hard to keep injury prone players on your roster ... they will be treated WORSE than trouble makes .... If your team takes a chance on them

you can talk out your ass all you want .... the chess pieces are already in play

IM talking about owners protecting EVERY team. How many teams right now have QBs worth $40 million or more in dead money?? How many teams would stand the risk of being crippled by a rule like this??

Denver, Dallas, New Orleans, Atlanta, The Rams, Ravens, Patriots, and Steelers. All of these teams would be crippled if their Qbs were forced to retire due to cumulative injuries. NO way in hell ANY of those owners sign off on a deal that would cost them to possible have to gut the team or lose draft picks due to an injury mid season. And no way the league risks something like that based on a settlement that amounted to 3% a year of over all revenues.

 

[tw1st3d]

No one has signed off on anything ...

They came up with a set amount .... of money

now it comes down to ... the rules of how to collect... I'm telling you I just watched a 2 hour debate on this

The LEAGUE NOT THE TEAM (what part of that you dont get I cant figure out) IS NOT GOING TO BE HELD RESPONSIBLE

teams arent going to be allowed to make the decisions ... and IF they are ... They will be stuck footing the bill for any player they carry beyond the guidelines ....


Just like the player conduct policy .... teams shy the fuck away

 

[Sharkinva]

See this is where your football IQ drops off.....
For every starting tackle you have .... there are 3-4 hurt in camp

Give you an example ... if you watch Hard Knocks ... When they followed Jacksonville. They had a lineman with a knee injury ... ( never healed) ended up staff infection.... no knee left when all was said and done ...
Now that's a no name player ... that never started..... 1 million a year .. ( pay check plus medical)
Now there are 100 guys a year with similar situations .. broke kneck .. never play again ... knee gone never play again ... players you never hear about .... ALL EQUAL when it comes to player compensation ....
If you say it isnt ... then say people that live in the country should pay $5 a month ... while anyone in a crime ridden city should pay $60,000 a month ... cause that who the insurance companies spend the most on .... Can't do it ... it's illegal

But any job can refuse you employment ... if they find it a health hazard .... and that is going to be the loophole.... you live in your fantasy world .... I'll live in reality

Actually thats where you are wrong. Sure the team can refuse to employee any one it wants. But the league as a whole cant force retirement on any player. Especially if that forced retirement would actually HARM one of its member teams. The deal you propose would require an amendment to the CBA. Which would require the players union to sign off on it. Which in turn would require the team to have some way to offset the cap hit taken for a forced retirement.


But lets agree to disagree until the real outcome of this settlement is revealed.

As for the troll comment.. Something tells me you got a little miffed with one Redskins poster or another and decided to take it out me. Its cool though.

 

[Sharkinva]

By the way, the settlement as it stands will be paid out over the next 17 years... or basically $45 million a year. At that rate, the league could simply TRIPLE that into an ongoing player health fund WITHOUT any input form the players, and it still wouldnt even equal a three percent of annual profits and thus would likely take force retirements off the table all together. Hell they burn that much in dead money collectively yearly.

 

[tw1st3d]

Actually thats where you are wrong. Sure the team can refuse to employee any one it wants. But the league as a whole cant force retirement on any player. Especially if that forced retirement would actually HARM one of its member teams. The deal you propose would require an amendment to the CBA. Which would require the players union to sign off on it. Which in turn would require the team to have some way to offset the cap hit taken for a forced retirement.


But lets agree to disagree until the real outcome of this settlement is revealed.

As for the troll comment.. Something tells me you got a little miffed with one Redskins poster or another and decided to take it out me. Its cool though.

actually not miffed ... hahah I had a decent joke lined up in the build up though ( even you woulda laughed)

but really look at it like this ... ok a guy like Brady gets hurt ... ok he's a future HOFer ... league dont mind paying for him

Joe blow that no one knows on 3rd string ... blows his knee out ... compensation is going to be the same ... iunless they set standards..... Illegal to set them by you started or played in X amount of games NFLPA would never agree to that
You cant say one player deserves more than another .. If that was true .... 85% of the people on welfare and food stamps would starve .... cause they didnt pay "that much in"
Illegal to base it on that ... unless you want to impeach 99% of the government .....

will be set limitations ... only way the league can do it without going bankrupt ... set amount of injuries (granted some more vital than others... head injuries being in front) ... the rule changes over the years have all been leading up to this

 

[Sharkinva]

actually not miffed ... hahah I had a decent joke lined up in the build up though ( even you woulda laughed)

but really look at it like this ... ok a guy like Brady gets hurt ... ok he's a future HOFer ... league dont mind paying for him

Joe blow that no one knows on 3rd string ... blows his knee out ... compensation is going to be the same ... iunless they set standards..... Illegal to set them by you started or played in X amount of games NFLPA would never agree to that
You cant say one player deserves more than another .. If that was true .... 85% of the people on welfare and food stamps would starve .... cause they didnt pay "that much in"
Illegal to base it on that ... unless you want to impeach 99% of the government .....

will be set limitations ... only way the league can do it without going bankrupt ... set amount of injuries (granted some more vital than others... head injuries being in front) ... the rule changes over the years have all been leading up to this

Actually they have already set standards. Max payout is $5 million per player period. Thats if you have Alheimers. $4 million ito your family if you died due to brain injuries suffered while playing. $3 million for dementia. And you cant apply government rules to a private company with contracted immunity . Its the sole reason why the NFL could not be sued for collusion based on the cap sanctions. The CBA will protect the league from further issues in this matter. Any forced retirement proposal would have to go by the players association. And you can bet the players would make that MORE painful than this settlement.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/leeigel/2013/08/30/whats-unsettled-about-the-nfl-concussions-settlement/

I tend to trust Forbes on this one by the way.

 

[tw1st3d]

Actually they have already set standards. Max payout is $5 million per player period. Thats if you have Alheimers. $4 million ito your family if you died due to brain injuries suffered while playing. $3 million for dementia. And you cant apply government rules to a private company with contracted immunity . Its the sole reason why the NFL could not be sued for collusion based on the cap sanctions. The CBA will protect the league from further issues in this matter. Any forced retirement proposal would have to go by the players association. And you can bet the players would make that MORE painful than this settlement.

What's Unsettled About The NFL Concussions Settlement - Forbes

I tend to trust Forbes on this one by the way.

So Forbes said what NFL Network said this morning at 5 am ......

Still depends ON " meeting conditions" Those are MAX payouts for a player meeting the conditions ( which havent even been set yet)

 

[Sharkinva]

So Forbes said what NFL Network said this morning at 5 am ......

Still depends ON " meeting conditions" Those are MAX payouts for a player meeting the conditions ( which havent even been set yet)

Dude, thing is $765 million over 17 years is a drop in the bucket to a $10 billion dollar a year profit operation. Its like saying you gotto pay me $45 a year for every INT Kyle Orton throws in the Super Bowl. The easiest way the NFL protects future growth is to NOT try and implement any kind of forced retirement program. Because if players even think they can be forced to retire, you dont think contracts will actually go up?? take a kid like Sean Lee who had injuries in college, and has now had two seasons ended by injury. What would make him even consider signing a team friendly contract knowing that one or two freak injuries could have him banned from the league at 27?? Much easier for the league to build in a future health care fund, split the cost with the players and be done with this long term.

 

[UK Cowboy]

Dude, thing is $765 million over 17 years is a drop in the bucket to a $10 billion dollar a year profit operation. Its like saying you gotto pay me $45 a year for every INT Kyle Orton throws in the Super Bowl. The easiest way the NFL protects future growth is to NOT try and implement any kind of forced retirement program. Because if players even think they can be forced to retire, you dont think contracts will actually go up?? take a kid like Sean Lee who had injuries in college, and has now had two seasons ended by injury. What would make him even consider signing a team friendly contract knowing that one or two freak injuries could have him banned from the league at 27?? Much easier for the league to build in a future health care fund, split the cost with the players and be done with this long term.

That would be the wise thing to do, if they can get out of their on way