after going to tonights game

[TheRobotDevil]

i dont believe in +/- but when everyone on the team is a - its kinda stupid dont you think to keep pointing it out? i can see if everyone was a + and he was the only -?

as far as parise loyalty if/when he walks will you still be singing that tune?

i'm not bashing marty your right he is old....your saying kovy is a liability whenever hes on the ice though? when your out there the most ice time and your goalie has a .890 sv % your going to look bad

But by pointing it out as part of your argument you are in turn acknowledging it as a valid stat.mc is right and all anyone is trying to say is like him or not he has to take some responsibility for the teams play.when parise went down ilya should have stepped up a littlemore its what real stars do.parise does it on a regular basis you can't teach that kind of heart.and like mc said if we lose zack over ilya it would be tragic zack is the heart of this team

 

[nj_cup]

i posted a a week or two back a game where kovy was a -3 and he wasnt even responsible for the goals scored at all! he was just unfortunate to be on the ice (because he logs a ton of ice time) on the team with the worst defense in the nhl or do you think thats a cowinkiedink?

you can break down per game all you want all i know is his 10pp is 2nd on the team and should make him a -19 in my book


so your going to blame parise walking on lack of cap space because of kovalchuk i guess?

i dont get what your argument is? kovalchuk is playing bad on a horrible team bottom line...i can see your anger if hes putting up these stats with the team in first place

 

[nj_cup]

since i cant make you understand with just words i thought id throw the +/- back in your face and maybe then you will see how stupid it is sometimes you gotta dumb it down a notch.

 

[nj_cup]

Here's another stat:

Of all Devils players, guess which one, WHEN OFF THE ICE, has a team low GAA scored. Kovalchuk. When he's on the bench the Devils only allow 2.49 GAA/60

NOTE: I'm not trying to say in anyway that Greene, Tallinder, Marty, Hedberg, etc. etc. aren't have shitty seasons, but you'd think the "most talented" player on the team could make a better case for himself.

whats it when hes on the ice?

 

[TheRobotDevil]

But I never said I believed in plus minus .odor the record I believe it is very useful stat when used in the right context and that's also involving variables.in fact I don't per say have a problem with kovy I was happy when we acquired him.only real issue I have with kovy is his heart isn't always there .and the main argument I have had with you is you don't seem to hold him accountable.I'm just being honest and am not going to make excuses for players if I am trust me its in humor or sarcasm.I would love to see kovy pick it up but at the same time I can't discount the fact that allot of guys on the team are performing him right now.langenbrunner being gone is going to help this team he was a cancer jmac was killing us I don't think kovy was our biggest problem and I think he has it in him to be great again but he's going to have to work harder and get more of a grasp on team to do so.

 

[skrillex26]

Kovalchuk should be fine.

He just needs to realize New Jersey aren't Atlanta. Like Elias said the team doesn't need to be carried, when they play smart, and together they're good.

Kovy still thinks everyone is levels below him and it's their fault if he's not scoring points and if the teams losing. When really one guy can be detrimental to the entire team and his attitude has been in my opinion thus far.

I know confidence is good, but to me he had overconfidence, i know it's obvious that a $100m contract would go to a lot of peoples heads but it did in a huge way with him.

If we can win some games or maybe even 2-3 in a row which would be groundbreaking then maybe he'll regain his play in time, but i have to be completely honest, now that i have watched him play a number or games from last year and this one(as i must admit i hadn't watched a whole lot of him in his previous NHL years) if i were in charge or were to make that decision that Vanderbeek made i wouldn't of made it.

I know it was almost all about sales and money BUT from a hockey perspective i wouldn't of reccomended him. Purely because Defense IS the most important thing, i don't care if it's post lockout hockey and all that BS about teams scoring, it still is paramount for me. And Iyla Kovalchuk doesn't have a clue what it is to defend.

 

[devils30mb]

Kovalchuk should be fine.

He just needs to realize New Jersey aren't Atlanta. Like Elias said the team doesn't need to be carried, when they play smart, and together they're good.

Kovy still thinks everyone is levels below him and it's their fault if he's not scoring points and if the teams losing. When really one guy can be detrimental to the entire team and his attitude has been in my opinion thus far.

I know confidence is good, but to me he had overconfidence, i know it's obvious that a $100m contract would go to a lot of peoples heads but it did in a huge way with him.

If we can win some games or maybe even 2-3 in a row which would be groundbreaking then maybe he'll regain his play in time, but i have to be completely honest, now that i have watched him play a number or games from last year and this one(as i must admit i hadn't watched a whole lot of him in his previous NHL years) if i were in charge or were to make that decision that Vanderbeek made i wouldn't of made it.

I know it was almost all about sales and money BUT from a hockey perspective i wouldn't of reccomended him. Purely because Defense IS the most important thing, i don't care if it's post lockout hockey and all that BS about teams scoring, it still is paramount for me. And Iyla Kovalchuk doesn't have a clue what it is to defend.

Well said.

Defense is the most important thing. Chicago won last year with great d because Niemi was just an average goalie around great d. Look at him now with San Jose, not doing to well and that stems to the fact that San Jose need some d since they lack in that position.

 

[TiLoBrown]

Great stats MCD, almost felt like it was a baseball conversation . I'm going to go back to my bread and butter at this point when it comes to Marty and "his" bad year. The guy may only have 6 wins, but 3 are from a shutout and he was working on a 4th shutout and 7th win when he had to leave the game against the Blackhawks via injury. If half of your wins are from a shutout, that normally means the team in front of him have to play tighter D and clear the puck better.

 

[nj_cup]

Great stats MCD, almost felt like it was a baseball conversation . I'm going to go back to my bread and butter at this point when it comes to Marty and "his" bad year. The guy may only have 6 wins, but 3 are from a shutout and he was working on a 4th shutout and 7th win when he had to leave the game against the Blackhawks via injury. If half of your wins are from a shutout, that normally means the team in front of him have to play tighter D and clear the puck better.

good point so marty is only as good as the team in front of him?

 

[Nasty_Magician]

good point so marty is only as good as the team in front of him?

At this point yes. The days of Marty bailing this team out on a nightly basis are over. Marty can still be a very dependable goalie, but not if he's the only one of the ice.

There really isn't one player or area of the game that we can put the blame on. Inconsistency was/is the problem with this team and that goes to coaching. The team has been noticably better under Lemaire though.

 

[MCDevils]

whats it when hes on the ice?

3.78 GAA while Kovalchuk's on the ice. Highest on the team except for PL3.

 

[MadCaptain]

Why are people defending players?

The only veterans worth defending are White, Volchenkov, and Elias.

The rookies have all been bad but they can still fall back on the 'rookie' excuse.


Guess what...
Kovalchuk sucks
Brodeur sucks
Zajac sucks
Langenbrunner sucked
Zubrus sucks
Clarkson sucks
Greene sucks
Tallinder sucks
Langenbrunner sucked some more
Arnott sucks...

The whole team is awful

 

[MCDevils]

Why are people defending players?

The only veterans worth defending are White, Volchenkov, and Elias.

The rookies have all been bad but they can still fall back on the 'rookie' excuse.


Guess what...
Kovalchuk sucks
Brodeur sucks
Zajac sucks
Langenbrunner sucked
Zubrus sucks
Clarkson sucks
Greene sucks
Tallinder sucks
Langenbrunner sucked some more
Arnott sucks...

The whole team is awful

Suck is too strong of a word to describe Zajac and Arnott this season. Struggling is better.

 

[SJ20]

Langenbrunner still sucks, he's just brought his suck to another team!

 

[TiLoBrown]

The same could be said for Clarkson. And even then since hes not really counted on to score much I dont think I can say hes struggling.

 

[MadCaptain]

Its an argument trying to prove someone is worse than the other while overall they both are bad

struggling or suck is the same. they are all playing bad or below expectations which is why the team is on pace to be the worst scoring team in 70-80 years

 

[TiLoBrown]

No No...struggling is -8, sucking is -29. Struggling are the Caps, sucking are the Devils.

 

[nj_cup]

No No...struggling is -8, sucking is -29. Struggling are the Caps, sucking are the Devils.

hahahah tb your a new puck fan arent you?

 

[skrillex26]

No No...struggling is -8, sucking is -29. Struggling are the Caps, sucking are the Devils.

 

[devs30rko]

eh i dunno if he believes its everyone else fault, in fact several times this season he's publicly shouldered the blame.


not to mention please tell me i'm not the only one whose noticed, he's played FAR better since a certain someone was fired....

just saying