7-1

[jjc2009]

Correction to the above and can't edit meant we shit the bed in the second quarter. We've been a good second half team, mostly out of necessity for our lousy second quarter play.

 

[Lillyliverd]

I am glad we are still in the hunt. But I am very skeptical of this team (coaching). I think we have the talent to win out, but I also think we could find away to lose any game remaining on our schedule. Last night was another in a long list of occasions where I was impressed by what the opposing coach had done with lesser players. More often than not, I covet thy other team's coach (other than recruiting).

 

[purguy12]

I will take the win. Not happy how we played but like someone said this was a good temple team and we won the the road. I will take it.

 

[ND_loyal son]

That red zone offense is concerning for sure. You'd think between BK, Denbrock and Sanford they'd be able to figure this out and have something more imaginative than the basic mess they seem to call. With that being said, 7-1 is great, and almost every year the national champs have a few games that they simply barely escape on their run to the title. At this point, I'm happy with any win.

Regardless, I've gotta say I'm becoming a big DeShone Kizer fan. He just seems unflappable. I know he made some mistakes, but he is a freshman (albeit redshirt), but if you told me at the start of the season that he'd take over in game 2 and we'd be 7-1 with a legitimate shot at the playoff, I don't think I'd have believed you. I think had the Clemson game not been played in a hurricane, we probably wouldn't have turned the ball over 4 times and we could be 8-0. In my opinion, QB is the most important position on the field and a good QB can make an average team look and perform better than they actually are. With Zaire, Kizer, and Wimbush in the fold, I've gotta think the future is bright at ND.

GO IRISH! ONWARD TO VICTORY!

 

[jjc2009]

That red zone offense is concerning for sure. You'd think between BK, Denbrock and Sanford they'd be able to figure this out and have something more imaginative than the basic mess they seem to call. With that being said, 7-1 is great, and almost every year the national champs have a few games that they simply barely escape on their run to the title. At this point, I'm happy with any win.

Regardless, I've gotta say I'm becoming a big DeShone Kizer fan. He just seems unflappable. I know he made some mistakes, but he is a freshman (albeit redshirt), but if you told me at the start of the season that he'd take over in game 2 and we'd be 7-1 with a legitimate shot at the playoff, I don't think I'd have believed you. I think had the Clemson game not been played in a hurricane, we probably wouldn't have turned the ball over 4 times and we could be 8-0. In my opinion, QB is the most important position on the field and a good QB can make an average team look and perform better than they actually are. With Zaire, Kizer, and Wimbush in the fold, I've gotta think the future is bright at ND.

GO IRISH! ONWARD TO VICTORY!

Well I disagree. Kizer mocking the Owls flapping his wings shows he is very flapable.

 

[podsox]

That red zone offense is concerning for sure. You'd think between BK, Denbrock and Sanford they'd be able to figure this out and have something more imaginative than the basic mess they seem to call. With that being said, 7-1 is great, and almost every year the national champs have a few games that they simply barely escape on their run to the title. At this point, I'm happy with any win.

Regardless, I've gotta say I'm becoming a big DeShone Kizer fan. He just seems unflappable. I know he made some mistakes, but he is a freshman (albeit redshirt), but if you told me at the start of the season that he'd take over in game 2 and we'd be 7-1 with a legitimate shot at the playoff, I don't think I'd have believed you. I think had the Clemson game not been played in a hurricane, we probably wouldn't have turned the ball over 4 times and we could be 8-0. In my opinion, QB is the most important position on the field and a good QB can make an average team look and perform better than they actually are. With Zaire, Kizer, and Wimbush in the fold, I've gotta think the future is bright at ND.

GO IRISH! ONWARD TO VICTORY!

the red zone offenses biggest problem is that every running play they try takes too damn long to develop. quick hitters with a strong o'line would help. this slow shit in the backfield clogs everything up

 

[KnuteRoc]

A win isn't just a win, outside of being a fan for that team anymore.

Others notice it too so it's not just me. Of course I'm happy with the win, a W is better than an L.

But what I can't be happy about, nor should I be, is how that win was obtained. This is a team we were favored to beat by 10. We didn't even do that. As a matter of fact, we needed a 4th quarter comeback to take the lead back. We blew at least 2 redzone opportunities, which would've put the game out of reach had we produced the minimum 6 points out of those, 14 in maximizing the 2. The running game is read-option left or right with the occasional keep and the occasional dive. I'm sorry but there's absolutely ZERO complexity to that play other than the Defense not playing their spot or assignment. If they play smart it's usually a win for the D as far as down and distance is concerned. We're not running enough to be able to impose our will in the 4th if we even can.

The simplistic passing game I get to a point. But because we can almost never take a snap under center, we rarely see a draw play taking advantage of those rushing linemen, our draw comes in the form of the QB taking off.

The Defense is blah. The blitz doesn't get home enough to justify the one play where you put them in long down and distance, when you give up 3rd and long, what was the point of blitzing on first or second again? It's silly.

We're supposed to be getting better as the season goes on. We struggle against a team we should beat and while the Defense is the best part of their team, our own D almost isn't enough to keep their very limited offense from putting us in a position to lose. That go ahead TD was more like a big damn sigh of relief coming out of Irish fans, not some wise-grin knowing we had it all along. I don't think player caliber was the issue, so then that to me leaves execution and/or coaching, both of which don't reflect well on the staff.

When you keep seeing the same mistakes over and over, something is inherently wrong. This isn't about youth or lack of experience.

Yay we won... barely. When we have to cherish wins like that, you know your team hasn't stepped up to the next level.

 

[ND_loyal son]

I understand where you're coming from. Every point is valid. The run game definitely needs some tweaking to say the least. We haven't improved enough on defense and we continue to make the same mistakes. However, in regards to this week's win, maybe Temple was better than we thought. I don't agree with everything Kirk Herbstreit says, but he did say that people don't realize what a good win this is for ND because they don't realize how good Temple really is. I know they're not a name brand, blueblood program, but they may still be a Top 15-20 team in the country.

In addition, everyone was down on U$C when we beat them, so it didn't really look like a super impressive win. However, it looked a little better when they went out and dominated Utah the following week. Maybe U$C is a better win than we got/gave credit for at the time.

Finally, I keep reminding myself that we've played most of this season without 6 starters who were injured for the year. Two of those 6 are our QB and RB (of their replacements, one had never played at all, the other had never played at his current position) and another off of the d-line. Those are important positions to try to fill. Take any team in the Top 10 right now and remove 6 starters (including their QB and RB) early on in the season and I don't know how many would still be in the Top 10. No seriously, do it. OSU, TCU, LSU, MSU, Baylor, Clemson, Stanford, Iowa, Alabama. They've all had close games against inferior teams with their teams intact for the most part. Just take out their QB and RB and imagine where each of those teams would be right now. The fact that we've lost as many players as we have and we're still in a position to make the playoff is impressive. With that much lost, I didn't think we'd be in the position at all. I'm just happy to be 7-1 with a shot at moving up next week.

I know it may sound crazy given the preseason expectations we all had, but you could argue that this team has actually over-delivered, given the circumstances. I know we all want big, sexy wins. However, with this particular team, I'll save "sexy" for my ladies, and take my wins any way I can get em'.

 

[whywork2]

Nd loyal Son,
Very well put. I completely concur. I don't agree with everything Kelly has done but no matter what I think he's done a commendable job. I am certain many others disagree but you did a splendid job pointing out just what he had to navigate his way through and I also agree our opponents and our schedule is looking better as time passes. Putting on a Notre Dame jersey don't make the players invincible, there's a lot of blood sweat and tear. I am happy with the position we find our team in .

 

[whywork2]

We're playing with a first year quarterback. Our running back is a converted wideout who really isn't meant to be given the rock and bang up the middle for a tough yard or two. Our two starting running backs are gone. We're missing six starters. We have no power running game because our featured back is really a wide receiver. We have to run our first year quarterback because if we don't we have no other running threat. This entire formula makes it hard to play call. It isn't like the guys we lost in Greg Bryant, Tarean Folston, Malik Zaire, the transfer of Everett Golson , Durham Smythe and Drue Tranquil were a bunch of duds. Our defensive co-ordinator is Dr. Demento, all or nothing.

 

[bbirish73]

my season outlook right now is 10-2 and making a new years 6 bowl.

 

[Lillyliverd]

Even missing 6 starters, I have to believe our talent level is much greater than Temple's, especially I think our defensive talent is much greater than Temple's offensive talent but it didn't look like it on the field. I think this team should be playing much better.

 

[KnuteRoc]

I understand where you're coming from. Every point is valid. The run game definitely needs some tweaking to say the least. We haven't improved enough on defense and we continue to make the same mistakes. However, in regards to this week's win, maybe Temple was better than we thought. I don't agree with everything Kirk Herbstreit says, but he did say that people don't realize what a good win this is for ND because they don't realize how good Temple really is. I know they're not a name brand, blueblood program, but they may still be a Top 15-20 team in the country.

In addition, everyone was down on U$C when we beat them, so it didn't really look like a super impressive win. However, it looked a little better when they went out and dominated Utah the following week. Maybe U$C is a better win than we got/gave credit for at the time.

Finally, I keep reminding myself that we've played most of this season without 6 starters who were injured for the year. Two of those 6 are our QB and RB (of their replacements, one had never played at all, the other had never played at his current position) and another off of the d-line. Those are important positions to try to fill. Take any team in the Top 10 right now and remove 6 starters (including their QB and RB) early on in the season and I don't know how many would still be in the Top 10. No seriously, do it. OSU, TCU, LSU, MSU, Baylor, Clemson, Stanford, Iowa, Alabama. They've all had close games against inferior teams with their teams intact for the most part. Just take out their QB and RB and imagine where each of those teams would be right now. The fact that we've lost as many players as we have and we're still in a position to make the playoff is impressive. With that much lost, I didn't think we'd be in the position at all. I'm just happy to be 7-1 with a shot at moving up next week.

I know it may sound crazy given the preseason expectations we all had, but you could argue that this team has actually over-delivered, given the circumstances. I know we all want big, sexy wins. However, with this particular team, I'll save "sexy" for my ladies, and take my wins any way I can get em'.

A nice counter-balance to my thoughts. It is good to get perspective pointed your way. With that said though... I don't agree that in every single case of "next man in" that they can't play yet. You know that first run that Adams had that went for a TD? Why can't that play be ran, with he or Prosise? Why is our running game reduced to read-option left/right? I just don't buy that a team can't learn to block and run an off-tackle run or have a guard pull while the TE picks up his man for a 1/2 second (the play is going to the other side).

This is college football. If your offense and defense are so complex that it takes a 2-3 year starter to be able to decipher or understand and then go execute there's something wrong. As a coach I wouldn't be expecting much more than a 1-2 year starter ever, in any position. You may have the luxury of having things that complicated in the Pros, but not college. So while I can totally agree with you in a lot of ways on your points, there's some I just can't. But you have given me some perspective to chew on... I shall try to be less critical.

 

[poewelch84]

I do agree that they need to simplify the defense and probably the offense to some extent. Also I would like to see more powering running with Prosise and Adams but teams have been loading the box to stop Prosise so making teams stay honest by throwing the ball should open things up for the running game.

 

[purguy12]

I feel different. I love this team. I love their chances. Good teams finds ways to win and they do that. Again its not like we play a easy schedule. every week we are play a rank team or a team that hasn't lost yet. This week we play Pitt who was just ranked but lost. They will be pissed coming into this game. Pitt is a good team. a team that can shock us if we don't come to play.

My negative about this team is they know they are still good even with our MZ and Folston. So they don't turn it on until they need to. They can't do this to a playoff type team. We need a complete game against one of the top teams. Im also disappointed in this Oline. They were suppose to be the best Oline in the country and I don't see that. I don't know if its scheme or they aren't gelling.

 

[idseer]

Finally, I keep reminding myself that we've played most of this season without 6 starters who were injured for the year. Two of those 6 are our QB and RB (of their replacements, one had never played at all, the other had never played at his current position) ...

initially i felt the same way. however, the fact is those two were probably not missed much at all. i find it hard to believe they would have done better or even as well as kizer and prosise. i think those injuries are cancelled out.

i would also add .... you threw a lot of maybes out there.

 

[whywork2]

initially i felt the same way. however, the fact is those two were probably not missed much at all. i find it hard to believe they would have done better or even as well as kizer and prosise. i think those injuries are cancelled out.

i would also add .... you threw a lot of maybes out there.

Folston was a better all around back than Procise. I love Procise but Folston was strong enough to run up the middle and Greg Bryant was to. Procise just doesn't have the build to run up the gut. They need to find ways to get him on the edge. I love both those guys but to be honest Procise just isn't the guy you want to get a tough yard or two. He doesn't have that body type. I think both the other running backs fit that bill better. Procise is just great in the open field and has tremendous skills cutting to the open hole but he's simply not a banger. I agree with your assessment of Kizer. he appears to me to have all the skills needed. He and Zaire have different skill sets but I'm not so sure Kizer isn't the better qb. Both of the qbs have a lot of natural talent. I all honesty I was blown away by the way Kizer ran away from defenders on that long run vs. Temple. The kid has talent and athletic ability, same goes for that final td pass, that was a tough throw.

 

[purguy12]

We also lost our starting TE and DT/DE in Jones. The D could of used him.

 

[whywork2]

We also lost our starting TE and DT/DE in Jones. The D could of used him.

Don't know how I forgot to mention him. No doubt losing him was a big blow to the defense. I did mention Durham Smythe in my earlier post.

 

[Irish7478]

Folston was a better all around back than Procise. I love Procise but Folston was strong enough to run up the middle and Greg Bryant was to. Procise just doesn't have the build to run up the gut. They need to find ways to get him on the edge. I love both those guys but to be honest Procise just isn't the guy you want to get a tough yard or two. He doesn't have that body type. I think both the other running backs fit that bill better. Procise is just great in the open field and has tremendous skills cutting to the open hole but he's simply not a banger. I agree with your assessment of Kizer. he appears to me to have all the skills needed. He and Zaire have different skill sets but I'm not so sure Kizer isn't the better qb. Both of the qbs have a lot of natural talent. I all honesty I was blown away by the way Kizer ran away from defenders on that long run vs. Temple. The kid has talent and athletic ability, same goes for that final td pass, that was a tough throw.

I agree that Procise and Kizer have performed better than I would have expected. But there was a reason that Kizer was third string behind Zaire and Golson. Zaire was a better runner than Kizer, and maybe (probably) a better passer. Remember he was 19 of 22 for 313 yards vs Texas in his second start ever. (Kizer has already played 3 times as much as Zaire) I think Zaire was a natural for Kelly's offense.

I disagree with your comments on Procise. I think he was moved to RB because he was much bigger than Bryant or Folston. At 220 pounds they thought that he would be better in short yardage situations. But as an every down RB, I think Folson was the best. (I was always disappointed that Bryant never showed the talent that I thought he had).

The bottom line is that I don't think you can minimize the affect that these injuries have had on our performance. This is a shame, because I think that in addition to the seniors we lose Stanley, Smith, and Fuller this year.