Series Thread: 4 Atlanta Hawks (48-34) vs. 1 Cleveland Cavaliers (57-25)

[Mecca]

Nope, when they are hitting the outside shot like they have been...it's a great OFC.

The Hawks have been poor one the glass for a while...they never seemed to get the ball clean...always a tip here, a tap there, rarely a clean board and start a break, or just a OFC possession...idk how much credit to give CLE really...a better gauge will be the next round I think.

The Cavs did what they were supposed to do.

But, they deserve credit for ending both series early.

It's easy to have a letdown against a young, hungry team.

They didn't.

They stayed focused.

Despite all the injury crap, my Clippers choked.

The Blazers put the wood to their asses BEFORE Blake and Paul went down.

From a talent standpoint, The Clippers and the Raptors should have won in 5 or 6.

But, both Teams are mentally weak. We can't say that about the Cavs this post Season.

 

[Mecca]

yah.....

i just hope they go back to the ToJ next episode and dont make us wait multiple weeks for its conclusion...but i get a feeling that is where it is going unfortunately.

I knew JS would walk out....technically he has upheld his vow to the Nights Watch right? lol

Yes, he died.

End of watch.

 

[Mecca]

i just remmeber a multitude of individuals ACTUALLY saying it is more likely the Cavs lose in the East than win in the Finals...

that was laughable then as it is now.....mainly because the Cavs OWN THE EAST like it was their personal property- did last year-- have this year- and will for YEARS -- YEARSSSSS to come.


thats why i siad- fine- if you guys TRULY think its more likely the Cavs lose in the East than win in the Finals- ill bet ya on it---- you take the Cavs not making it out of the EAst--- ill take the Cavs winning in the Finals---- if someone ACUTALLY TRULY believed what they said (which i dont think they did- lol)- they would have JUMPED on that bet in a NY minute...

instead...a whole lotta nuthin

Yeah, I remember that too.

But, I don't think anyone believed they would actually lose in the ECF.

It was just that, public sentiment is that it is MORE LIKELY TO HAPPEN, than them beating the Warriors or Spurs in the Finals.

That's not the same as saying they will lose in the East.

 

[WiggyRuss]

Yeah, I remember that too.

But, I don't think anyone believed they would actually lose in the ECF.

It was just that, public sentiment is that it is MORE LIKELY TO HAPPEN, than them beating the Warriors or Spurs in the Finals.

That's not the same as saying they will lose in the East.

i know....i gave them the chance to do that....if they really think the Cavs have no chance to win in the Finals why not take it...

i mean forgive me if iam not understanding something here....


but -- when people say "Its more likely they lose in the East than win in the Finals"--- and I say---- COOL MAN- GREAT OPINION- CARE TO BACK IT UP...

and offer 2 bets

1. will they g et out of the east
2. they will win the Finals


i mean shit- if they were sure the Cavs would lose in the Finals- the worse they can do it break even right?

one would think- IF THEY ACUTALLY THOUGHT it was MORE LIKELY - the Cavs would lose in the East- than win in the Finals- people would take that bet without a second thought....

apparently not... i was fully willing to do it too...but - alas...no takers.

 

[Heatles84]

do you think thats untrue? I wouldnt say it if i didnt believe it 100%.

If the fact that I STRONGLY believe that a team with LeBron James--- an in-his-prime Kyrie Irving, an-in-his-prime Kevin Love, an in-his-prime TT...will continue dominating the East for the foreseeable future seems VERY VERY UNCONTRVERISAL to me...

what? LeBron is - God-willing- going to make his 6th straight Finals this year.....i mean....forgive me....but with the circumstances surrounding the Cavs- is there ANYONE that watches basketball that doubts the Cavs are the HEAVY HEAVY FAVORITES to represent the East for the forseeable future?

If LeBron was on the Heat i would say the same damn thing. But its the Cavs so its wrong. oh well.

It all centers around Lebron. As I've said before, Lebron is on the wrong side of 30 and has heavy miles on him. For now, you're the proverbial favorites out of the East. Kyrie's stepped up his game and he's a solid #2, and would be one helluva #1 on most other teams. Love's doing good and fitting into his role as well.

Problem that we've seen though, is that everything centers around Lebron. Father time catches up to everyone as it appears to be doing now to Tim Duncan. Last year he looked great, this year he's merely in for defense and does little to no scoring. And we've all seen what the Cavs look like without Lebron - it's not pretty.

Point being - you don't know what will happen 2-3 years from now. So stop saying you're going to own the East for years to come.

 

[Shanemansj13]

All I gotta say is on to the next series. Atlanta played good in 3 of the 4 games but the competition will only get tougher. The Cavs have to play better defensively. In the last 2 games they had too many turnovers they need to get back to taking care of the ball more. Also, Love needs to make some 2 pointers geesh...if he is making the 3 that is fine. If he is attempting to post up it still draws the defense, but make a 2 pointer every now and then

 

[WiggyRuss]

. So stop saying you're going to own the East for years to come.

I am only saying it because i believe it to be true.

I dont see how anyone is beating LeBron/Irving/Love and Gilberts wallet in the East....the fact the Cavs- with one series to go--- have lost 2 playoff games in the ENTIRE EAST PLAYOFFS for the last 2 seasons- seems to be a pretty decent fact in my corner.

I look around the conference and just dont see anyone thats gonna stop LeBron's streak anytime soon....

not only that- but I LOVE how you brought up 40 year old Tim Duncan.....9 more years until LeBron is 40.- and while it would be asking a lot for LeBron ot have the type of extended career Duncan has had--- the Cavs mgmt. has done a great job protecting him- and bringing in players to help him- a la Duncan with the Spurs....

it g ives me VERY VERY LITTLE reservation to predict 3, 4, and even longer out- the Cavs East dominance. Until something shows me else wise i dont know how anyone could argue.

 

[TurnUpTheHeat]

It all centers around Lebron. As I've said before, Lebron is on the wrong side of 30 and has heavy miles on him. For now, you're the proverbial favorites out of the East. Kyrie's stepped up his game and he's a solid #2, and would be one helluva #1 on most other teams. Love's doing good and fitting into his role as well.

Problem that we've seen though, is that everything centers around Lebron. Father time catches up to everyone as it appears to be doing now to Tim Duncan. Last year he looked great, this year he's merely in for defense and does little to no scoring. And we've all seen what the Cavs look like without Lebron - it's not pretty.

Point being - you don't know what will happen 2-3 years from now. So stop saying you're going to own the East for years to come.

He keeps excluding the fact that there a some key players hitting FA pretty soon, plus other teams will have plenty of cap space.
He might want the other 14 teams to concede the East to the Cavs, but my guess is that a few will be going full tilt to beat them.

 

[WiggyRuss]

He keeps excluding the fact that there a some key players hitting FA pretty soon, plus other teams will have plenty of cap space.
He might want the other 14 teams to concede the East to the Cavs, but my guess is that a few will be going full tilt to beat them.

they will try....and fail...

i just dont see anyone beating Lebron with an in-their primes Love and Irving and TT i nthe East....

not when teams cant even win a game or two against them.....if i saw someone that i thought could challenge them id perhaps think otherwise...

 

[TurnUpTheHeat]

i know....i gave them the chance to do that....if they really think the Cavs have no chance to win in the Finals why not take it...

i mean forgive me if iam not understanding something here....


but -- when people say "Its more likely they lose in the East than win in the Finals"--- and I say---- COOL MAN- GREAT OPINION- CARE TO BACK IT UP...

and offer 2 bets

1. will they g et out of the east
2. they will win the Finals


i mean shit- if they were sure the Cavs would lose in the Finals- the worse they can do it break even right?

one would think- IF THEY ACUTALLY THOUGHT it was MORE LIKELY - the Cavs would lose in the East- than win in the Finals- people would take that bet without a second thought....

apparently not... i was fully willing to do it too...but - alas...no takers.

Nobody is now saying there is a better chance.
It was a valid opinion back then so some, including me.

My opinion on beating the WC champ hasn't changed though, and apparently you agree with that?

 

[Heatles84]

I am only saying it because i believe it to be true.

I dont see how anyone is beating LeBron/Irving/Love and Gilberts wallet in the East....the fact the Cavs- with one series to go--- have lost 2 playoff games in the ENTIRE EAST PLAYOFFS for the last 2 seasons- seems to be a pretty decent fact in my corner.

I look around the conference and just dont see anyone thats gonna stop LeBron's streak anytime soon....

not only that- but I LOVE how you brought up 40 year old Tim Duncan.....9 more years until LeBron is 40.- and while it would be asking a lot for LeBron ot have the type of extended career Duncan has had--- the Cavs mgmt. has done a great job protecting him- and bringing in players to help him- a la Duncan with the Spurs....

it g ives me VERY VERY LITTLE reservation to predict 3, 4, and even longer out- the Cavs East dominance. Until something shows me else wise i dont know how anyone could argue.

Tim Duncan has never been overly athletic - there's a reason he's considered the "Big Fundamental". This is why Miami fans were defending the Bosh contract when he signed it as he's an essential stretch 4, and in some ways his game mimicked Duncan's. Lebron's completely different in that regards. What makes Lebron so gifted is his athleticism as well as his size. You don't find many guys that are 6'8 250 that can move like a gazelle, but Lebron does that. At some point, that athleticism will start to fade (we're already seeing it with his subpar shooting compared to the last few seasons).

But I'm fine with you having your own little fantasy world. No team has ever RULED an entire conference for years, and it's not going to change anytime soon. You mention Gilbert's wallet, which is asinine. Gilbert's restricted to the confines of the CBA. He's able to have the roster he has at such a high value because of the bird rights that he has on all of his players that he collected while the Cavs sucked for the 4 years Lebron was gone (funny that you screwed two of those picks up with Bennett and Waiters). Gilbert's not going to be able to go out and sign more high-priced players. Also, the league is full of billionaires, so stop acting like Gilbert has some sort of advantage there.

 

[TurnUpTheHeat]

they will try....and fail...

Like James in the Finals the last soon to be 3 seasons?

 

[Heatles84]

Also, if Durant somehow goes to the Spurs, then the Cavs can rule the East all they want. They're not doing shit to the West.

 

[TurnUpTheHeat]

Also, if Durant somehow goes to the Spurs, then the Cavs can rule the East all they want. They're not doing shit to the West.

I've seen nothing to make me think they can beat the WC champ, and especially without HCA.

 

[WiggyRuss]

Tim Duncan has never been overly athletic - there's a reason he's considered the "Big Fundamental". This is why Miami fans were defending the Bosh contract when he signed it as he's an essential stretch 4, and in some ways his game mimicked Duncan's. Lebron's completely different in that regards. What makes Lebron so gifted is his athleticism as well as his size. You don't find many guys that are 6'8 250 that can move like a gazelle, but Lebron does that. At some point, that athleticism will start to fade (we're already seeing it with his subpar shooting compared to the last few seasons).

But I'm fine with you having your own little fantasy world. No team has ever RULED an entire conference for years, and it's not going to change anytime soon. You mention Gilbert's wallet, which is asinine. Gilbert's restricted to the confines of the CBA. He's able to have the roster he has at such a high value because of the bird rights that he has on all of his players that he collected while the Cavs sucked for the 4 years Lebron was gone (funny that you screwed two of those picks up with Bennett and Waiters). Gilbert's not going to be able to go out and sign more high-priced players. Also, the league is full of billionaires, so stop acting like Gilbert has some sort of advantage there.

sure...Gilbert is restricted by the CBA...but thats a relative term...

when Turnup told me that Arison didnt use the mid-level LeBrons last year because their was no one worth it--- fine...

Gilbert doesnt think that way...he will spend extra tens of millions to add a guy like Channing Frye---a guy who was barely getting minutes on the shitty Magic.....

but as we all saw....sometimes those guys who are your 7th or 8th or 9th player can come up HUGEEEE

i watched PJ Brown be a HUGE difference maker in a game 7 against the Cavs the first time around. Gilbert has the wallet and motivation to do EVERYTHING HE CAN to try and win...while other owners let their midlevel exception go unused to save $....

big difference there.....the CBA does allow for flexibility in spending--- and as we all are seeing- the Cavs payroll is WELL ABOVE everyone else's DESPITE the CBA...you think thats changing anytime soon? no- didnt think so.

 

[TurnUpTheHeat]

they will try....and fail...

i just dont see anyone beating Lebron with an in-their primes Love and Irving and TT i nthe East....

not when teams cant even win a game or two against them.....if i saw someone that i thought could challenge them id perhaps think otherwise...

So basically you're trying to convince us of something that nobody here currently disagrees with.
The issue is with you planning years ahead, especially when James and losing Finals mix like oil and vinegar.

 

[WiggyRuss]

So basically you're trying to convince us of something that nobody here currently disagrees with.
The issue is with you planning years ahead, especially when James and losing Finals mix like oil and vinegar.

your certainly welcome to your opinion....and- after watching LeBron for 4 years in Miami i understand where it comes from--- but thats not the std you should use..lebron was NEVER staying in Miami long term- and jumped when the pastures were greener...NEO means something a lot different to LeBron than Miami did.

LeBron even admitted- Miami was like college.....NEO is home..

based on your experience if you think thats gonna happen again- hey--- more power to ya....

personally- i dont think he goes anywhere- for a whole BUNCH of reasons...again--- time will vindicate one of us- and i feel MORE than comfortable with my position.

 

[TurnUpTheHeat]

sure...Gilbert is restricted by the CBA...but thats a relative term...

when Turnup told me that Arison didnt use the mid-level LeBrons last year because their was no one worth it--- fine...

Gilbert doesnt think that way...he will spend extra tens of millions to add a guy like Channing Frye---a guy who was barely getting minutes on the shitty Magic.....

but as we all saw....sometimes those guys who are your 7th or 8th or 9th player can come up HUGEEEE

i watched PJ Brown be a HUGE difference maker in a game 7 against the Cavs the first time around. Gilbert has the wallet and motivation to do EVERYTHING HE CAN to try and win...while other owners let their midlevel exception go unused to save $....

big difference there.....the CBA does allow for flexibility in spending--- and as we all are seeing- the Cavs payroll is WELL ABOVE everyone else's DESPITE the CBA...you think thats changing anytime soon? no- didnt think so.

Isn't it true that Gilbert made moves this season to where he is now going to have to pay less luxury tax then he would have at the beginning of it?

I just found this.
Am I missing something?

ATLANTA -- At February's trade deadline, Dan Gilbert mulled a $32 million decision as his general manager waited for an answer.

The night before, the Cavs had agreed to trade Anderson Varejao to thePortland Trail Blazers, a move that had been under discussion for weeks. It was a costly deal from an asset standpoint, requiring the Cavs to give away a popular player plus a first-round draft pick.

It was a straight money deal, it was going to save the Cavs' owner around $50 million this season alone because his Cleveland Cavaliers are so deep into the luxury tax that every dollar they were spending was costing them $4 in tax. Varejao was an extremely popular player but there was a push to get off the contract, which became a problem after Varejao tore his Achilles in 2014.

The Cavs could've stopped right there, deal Varejao and call it a deadline. It was an option on the table. An option that made major sense. They were in first place. They were deep at every position. They were still facing paying $27 million in luxury tax, still far and away the most in the league.

 

[WiggyRuss]

Isn't it true that Gilbert made moves this season to where he is now going to have to pay less luxury tax then he would have at the beginning of it?

I just found this.
Am I missing something?

ATLANTA -- At February's trade deadline, Dan Gilbert mulled a $32 million decision as his general manager waited for an answer.

The night before, the Cavs had agreed to trade Anderson Varejao to thePortland Trail Blazers, a move that had been under discussion for weeks. It was a costly deal from an asset standpoint, requiring the Cavs to give away a popular player plus a first-round draft pick.

It was a straight money deal, it was going to save the Cavs' owner around $50 million this season alone because his Cleveland Cavaliers are so deep into the luxury tax that every dollar they were spending was costing them $4 in tax. Varejao was an extremely popular player but there was a push to get off the contract, which became a problem after Varejao tore his Achilles in 2014.

The Cavs could've stopped right there, deal Varejao and call it a deadline. It was an option on the table. An option that made major sense. They were in first place. They were deep at every position. They were still facing paying $27 million in luxury tax, still far and away the most in the league.

cmon...paste the rest of the article ya cherry picking nancy, LOL

instead of taking that HUGE LUXURY TAX SAVINGS- and stopping at just getting rid of Varejao----- the Cavs added an 8th man for MILLIONS UPON MILLIONS...

thats the difference man

Arison lets his MLE go unused...

while Gilbert spends tens of millions on the back end of his bench...its why The Cavs bench is deep- while the Heats bench is trash.

 

[TurnUpTheHeat]

your certainly welcome to your opinion....and- after watching LeBron for 4 years in Miami i understand where it comes from--- but thats not the std you should use..lebron was NEVER staying in Miami long term- and jumped when the pastures were greener...NEO means something a lot different to LeBron than Miami did.

LeBron even admitted- Miami was like college.....NEO is home..

based on your experience if you think thats gonna happen again- hey--- more power to ya....

personally- i dont think he goes anywhere- for a whole BUNCH of reasons...again--- time will vindicate one of us- and i feel MORE than comfortable with my position.

He's not going West if his goal is to win rings.
Much harder path.
So I agree, for now, is best path is right where he is.
I just don't see him attempting to win with the same group if they stay healthy, and cant win now.