2 Reasons the Niners lost this game

[Crimsoncrew]

Should we break down the 2nd half play of the offense?
They had 7 drives in the 3rd and 4th quarter and OT.
How do you think they did?

I didn't see the second half. But now we're talking about the offense, not just Alex Smith. The blocking I saw in the first half doesn't deserve to be defended.

 

[CalamityX11]

I haven't seen the play, but could he have thrown it at his RB's feet?

This is tough through a message board...

------RB
-------W

-------LT
-------LG
----QB C
-------RG
-------RT

Tried my best, but after the snap, Gore ran a flat to the left side, Ware was coming in for blitz but maybe it was just a stunt? either case, he read the play flank towards Gore and literally lined up on him, any throw to Gore Ware would've had a hand on him(W = Ware for above)

keep in mind this was on 2nd & 3 on the left hashmark.

 

[Crimsoncrew]

We were missing only Edwards, thus we were missing only one of our top receivers. If you are referring to Crabtree, he is not one of our 'top two receivers'. I would place each of, Walker, Davis, Ginn, Williams and Morgan on a level equal to or above that of Crabtree.

Also, I'm not buying your gesture that Smith has shown a "dramatic improvement over last year". He looked like Alex in the Seattle game; he looked above average for Alex against Dallas.

Looking back over 2010, Alex Smith had games where he looked like Alex and he had games where he played better than his usual self; thus, by my QB calculator, after two games Alex Smith looks just about exactly as he did last year.

The only thing improved from last season is his ability to manufacturer a better passer rating; however, his QB'ing skills look about the same to me.

Good thing I said WRs, not receivers. And Crabtree is clearly the Niners' second-best receiver when healthy. If you're going to dispute that, there's no way you can claim Bryant is Romo's best receiver.

Re: Smith, his accuracy and mechanics have been much better. Against Seattle, he repeatedly escaped pressure he would not have in the past. This week there was nowhere to escape to in what I saw of the game. I don't think I have ever seen Smith make a throw like he did to Williams in the endzone this week. Feel free to disagree, but let me know what throw/s you're referring to that wasn't a seam pass to Davis.

This week we also saw Smith improvising with a shovel pass to Gore and a flip to Walker (which he dropped). Those are things I haven't seen much if at all from Smith, though again, feel free to cite examples to the contrary.

 

[Crimsoncrew]

We were missing only Edwards, thus we were missing only one of our top receivers. If you are referring to Crabtree, he is not one of our 'top two receivers'. I would place each of, Walker, Davis, Ginn, Williams and Morgan on a level equal to or above that of Crabtree.

Also, I'm not buying your gesture that Smith has shown a "dramatic improvement over last year". He looked like Alex in the Seattle game; he looked above average for Alex against Dallas.

Looking back over 2010, Alex Smith had games where he looked like Alex and he had games where he played better than his usual self; thus, by my QB calculator, after two games Alex Smith looks just about exactly as he did last year.

The only thing improved from last season is his ability to manufacturer a better passer rating; however, his QB'ing skills look about the same to me.

Correct. Alex Smith was his inconsistent self. He looked good in the first half, but horrible in the second. The same story we've seen the last few years.

That's entirely possible, even likely. I didn't see the second half. In the first half, Smith looked about as good as I've seen him look.

 

[Crimsoncrew]

Everything I've posted in this thread was directly from the game. No rants, just straight and honest observations. Feel free to join the discussion as soon your done with your weaseling accusations.

Except for, you know, mischaracterizing the timing of the INT.

 

[FourBeeDen]

This is tough through a message board...

------RB
-------W

-------LT
-------LG
----QB C
-------RG
-------RT

Tried my best, but after the snap, Gore ran a flat to the left side, Ware was coming in for blitz but maybe it was just a stunt? either case, he read the play flank towards Gore and literally lined up on him, any throw to Gore Ware would've had a hand on him(W = Ware for above)

keep in mind this was on 2nd & 3 on the left hashmark.

Nicely illustrated calamity.. Let me add that either the LT or LG was in between the QB and RB so the throw would have to be over the LT/LG. No throwing lane to throw the ball o the RB's foot.

 

[CalamityX11]

Nicely illustrated calamity.. Let me add that either the LT or LG was in between the QB and RB so the throw would have to be over the LT/LG. No throwing lane to throw the ball o the RB's foot.

thanks, and you are correct that Smith was more towards the left side on the unit...

 

[SY8goat]

This is tough through a message board...

------RB
-------W

-------LT
-------LG
----QB C
-------RG
-------RT

Tried my best, but after the snap, Gore ran a flat to the left side, Ware was coming in for blitz but maybe it was just a stunt? either case, he read the play flank towards Gore and literally lined up on him, any throw to Gore Ware would've had a hand on him(W = Ware for above)

keep in mind this was on 2nd & 3 on the left hashmark.

Ted ginn and Josh Morgan were both open on the right side of the field. Smith made a bad decision there. Good play by Ware too. He fooled SMith!

 

[CalamityX11]

Ted ginn and Josh Morgan were both open on the right side of the field. Smith made a bad decision there. Good play by Ware too. He fooled SMith!

I think Gore was the primary read, if not, then Smith eyed him hard after the snap... I don't think he looked once to the right.

 

[SY8goat]

I think Gore was the primary read, if not, then Smith eyed him hard after the snap... I don't think he looked once to the right.

That does make sense, since they did motion Ginn to the right to clear it out for Gore.

 

[Crimsoncrew]

Ok, this is for Sick who was asking about specific examples of problems with the OL:

1st and 10 at the start of the 2nd:

NFL Videos: Cowboys defense, sack, 9-yd loss

This is the busted screen. Three guys come through and hit Smith before he's even finished dropping back. Hard to believe Smith didn't fumble. V. Davis and Goodwin blew their blocks.

2nd and 10 in the 2nd:

NFL Videos: Cowboys defense, sack, 9-yd loss

Blitz, Staley goes outside to take Ware. Hatcher comes untouched and basically hits Smith as he hits his back foot on the dropback.

3rd and 8 in the early 3rd quarter:

NFL Videos: Cowboys defense, sack, 6-yd loss

Strange formation; unclear who is to blame and perhaps Smith should have called TO. Smith drops back, blitz off the back side which Gore picks up; Ware just blows by Staley with an inside swim move. Smith sidesteps him, but is hit immediately by Hatcher who got around Iupati to the outside.

2nd and 8 in the late-4th:

NFL Videos: Cowboys defense, sack, 8-yd loss

Play action, Ware comes off the right side completely untouched. Looks like one of the RBs should have picked him up. No chance to throw.

1st and 10 in late-3rd quarter:

NFL Videos: Cowboys defense, sack, 7-yd loss

Smith drops back and hesitates. Ware gets around Staley for the sack. Smith could have gotten this ball off or possibly stepped to his left.

I can't find the sixth sack here. That's the OT one. However, of these five, I would say the blocking (not just the OL) failed completely on four of them. On three, Smith was hit literally as or before he planted. On a fourth, Ware beat Staley as cleanly with a swim move as I have ever seen, though Smith initially avoided the pressure. Now, maybe Smith should be recognizing the blitzes and audibling out of the called plays. But even when the other team blitzes, we've got to give our QB time to at least hit his backfoot on the called pass. That's just inexcusable. All too often it seems that if Smith doesn't throw as soon as he hits his back foot, the pocket just collapses.

I've seen a fair bit of the Pats' first two games, and Brady just sits in the pocket. He could knit a sweater back there, despite a rookie RT and facing some blue-chip pass rushers like Shaun Philips and Cameron Wake. Now, neither of those guys is Ware. Not by a long shot. But we've got to be able to give our QB - whoever it is, but especially if it's Smith - more time to throw.

 

[sayheykid1]

I do not think Alex Smith is a good QB but I would not lay this all on him. Harbaugh taking three instead of 15 yards, a chance of a TD and more time off the clock was ridiculous.
The O-Line sucks.
The secondary choked when it mattered most.

Smith was not spectacular but good enough...WTF happened to VD?

 

[FourBeeDen]

I do not think Alex Smith is a good QB but I would not lay this all on him. Harbaugh taking three instead of 15 yards, a chance of a TD and more time off the clock was ridiculous.
The O-Line sucks.
The secondary choked when it mattered most.

Smith was not spectacular but good enough...WTF happened to VD?

he was used in pass protection most of the game

 

[Yadahell]

he was used in pass protection most of the game

Harbaugh also claimed he was doubled quite a bit of the time which I can't substantiate, because I wasn't specifically concentrating on watching Davis all game.

 

[Mozart'sGhost]

Ok, this is for Sick who was asking about specific examples of problems with the OL:

1st and 10 at the start of the 2nd:

NFL Videos: Cowboys defense, sack, 9-yd loss

This is the busted screen. Three guys come through and hit Smith before he's even finished dropping back. Hard to believe Smith didn't fumble. V. Davis and Goodwin blew their blocks.

2nd and 10 in the 2nd:

NFL Videos: Cowboys defense, sack, 9-yd loss

Blitz, Staley goes outside to take Ware. Hatcher comes untouched and basically hits Smith as he hits his back foot on the dropback.

3rd and 8 in the early 3rd quarter:

NFL Videos: Cowboys defense, sack, 6-yd loss

Strange formation; unclear who is to blame and perhaps Smith should have called TO. Smith drops back, blitz off the back side which Gore picks up; Ware just blows by Staley with an inside swim move. Smith sidesteps him, but is hit immediately by Hatcher who got around Iupati to the outside.

2nd and 8 in the late-4th:

NFL Videos: Cowboys defense, sack, 8-yd loss

Play action, Ware comes off the right side completely untouched. Looks like one of the RBs should have picked him up. No chance to throw.

1st and 10 in late-3rd quarter:

NFL Videos: Cowboys defense, sack, 7-yd loss

Smith drops back and hesitates. Ware gets around Staley for the sack. Smith could have gotten this ball off or possibly stepped to his left.

I can't find the sixth sack here. That's the OT one. However, of these five, I would say the blocking (not just the OL) failed completely on four of them. On three, Smith was hit literally as or before he planted. On a fourth, Ware beat Staley as cleanly with a swim move as I have ever seen, though Smith initially avoided the pressure. Now, maybe Smith should be recognizing the blitzes and audibling out of the called plays. But even when the other team blitzes, we've got to give our QB time to at least hit his backfoot on the called pass. That's just inexcusable. All too often it seems that if Smith doesn't throw as soon as he hits his back foot, the pocket just collapses.

I've seen a fair bit of the Pats' first two games, and Brady just sits in the pocket. He could knit a sweater back there, despite a rookie RT and facing some blue-chip pass rushers like Shaun Philips and Cameron Wake. Now, neither of those guys is Ware. Not by a long shot. But we've got to be able to give our QB - whoever it is, but especially if it's Smith - more time to throw.

Thanks a lot. After watching those, now I feel even worse.

 

[sayheykid1]

We don't have a team that can compete passing the ball. This is a passing league, and this team used to be the premier passing team. What the fuck happened?

The Yorks happened. I don't think they could have done worse than what they have done.

 

[clyde_carbon]

So calling me drunk while your facts were way off is an honnest game observation?

I said you were drunk because you were insinuating that we had a 10 pt. lead more than once in the game. 7-0, 14-0, 14-7, 14-14, 21-14, 24-14, 24-21, 24-24, 24-27.

We only had a ten pt. lead once.

 

[clyde_carbon]

I'm Smith's knight in shining armor? I got in an argument with MW several months ago when I said that Smith has been a major disappointment. I don't think he's gotten a fair shake, but I have also said for three years now that we need to move on. From what I saw of the game - and as said, that was far from all of it - Smith was definitely not the problem. I have not been able to pull up the sacks on NFL's video, so I can't speak to them, but the first half sacks were primarily due to the protection.

Regardless of who brought up the 10-point lead, you laid blame at Smith's feet for the comeback because of the INT. That's a pretty crucial misrepresentation.

Smith's INT led to Dallas evening the score at 14 all in the third quarter. Different circumstances, but the result and more importantly my point still stand.

 

[sayheykid1]

Signed, Cazic Carbon. Are you trying to become the new head troll?

At a bare minimum, you don't complete 70% of passes over two NFL games without some semblance of ability.

He is 27th in the NFL for passing yards

 

[FourBeeDen]

I said you were drunk because you were insinuating that we had a 10 pt. lead more than once in the game. 7-0, 14-0, 14-7, 14-14, 21-14, 24-14, 24-21, 24-24, 24-27.

We only had a ten pt. lead once.

Maybe you should go back to your original post. You said the Niners had a10 point lead and then Smith threw an interception that led to an Austin TD. I corrected you by saying the 10 pt lead came when Akers kicked a FG. Then you called me drunk by saying the Niners had only led 10 pts on one occassion. Then I posted abox score illustrating that the only 10 point lead the Niners had was after the Aker's lone FG which supported my initial post.

The point being, the Smith interception could not have happened when the Niners was leading by 10.