2 Reasons the Niners lost this game

[Crimsoncrew]

This whole team is the biggest problem. No direction from the FO (been this way for a decade), no originality or gamesmanship from the coaching staff (been this way for a decade), no execution from the players (been this way for a decade), no realistic expectations from the fans (been this way for a decade). Smith shouldn't be given credit as a positive by any stretch of the imagination. Long term. Short term. Whatever. If the game is on the line, I'd rather punt and trust Andy Lee, than watch Smith lose 18 yards, and have Lee punt anyway.

And you're right. Smith isn't the only or biggest problem. He is the biggest and easiest target, though.

Smith is not a positive. But as Imac mentions, as he is clearly not the future at his position, he's far from the biggest concern. The OL and pass defense are disasters right now, as they have been for at least as long as Smith has been on the team. Given the investment we have made in the OL, and the fact that we DO view those guys as the future (at least in theory), that's a major problem.

 

[sayheykid1]

Would a good QB have taken all those sacks this week? Absolutely yes. If the Cowboys brought the pressure they did, virtually any QB in the league would have been sacked on all five of the plays I posted. Now, if the Niners had a better QB, the Cowboys may not have brought so much pressure. But given the state of their secondary, I think they would have regardless of who was at QB.

I agree that Smith is not a long-term answer. But at present he is not the biggest problem. Not particularly close IMO.

He is as big as any problem the Niners have IMO because he is a deal breaker. The Niners can win with any other starter playing week after week but the Niners will never be a good team with Smith starting.

 

[ViperVisor]

FACTS say Smith has been a meh QB that past 3 seasons.

Has the environment around our QBs been greased with ass-loads of win juice and Smith is the banana peel or is the thing top to bottom been a mess? Truth is obvious.

 

[sayheykid1]

What do you mean by "meh"?

 

[CalamityX11]

Well he isn't throwing the ball continously into the DBs hands..... hasn't really came down with the turnover syndrome(yet) so cut him some slack....

OL needs to man up.

 

[Mozart'sGhost]

It just struck me that what we're seeing this year is very similar to what we saw last year: unimaginative offense, struggling run game, bad pass protection. The key difference is that Smith is not making the crushing mistakes. Now, granted he had the one INT this week, but one turnover in two weeks isn't bad.

Last season, people were blaming Smith and rightly so. This year, it's not so clear he's the cause of the problems.

Don't forget the defense falling apart in the 4th quarter.

 

[Mozart'sGhost]

Better question. Would a good quarterback take all of those sacks? The answer is no. Is Smith the only reason why the 9ers are disgraceful? No. But he absolutely is ONE of the reasons why they are. QB's in today's game are throwing between three and four hundred yards a game, and winning because of it. Smith has one three hundred yard passing game in his career.

Seriously, the Smith project is a failure and needs to end. This team is mired in mid 70's offensive philosophy while the rest of the league is throwing the ball all over the field. Look at the SB contenders. They throw the ball at will. They get after the QB. They actually defend the pass at the second level. We do none of those things. Not well. We do none of those things at all. It's no surprise why we haven't sniffed the playoffs in a decade.

:clock: <--What the fuck is this?

Disgraceful?.....really? How 'bout mediocre?

 

[CalamityX11]

The way I see it, is that the Niners as a whole lost this game. Plain and simple. They could not put it away in the end. Bottom line, they need to learn how to finish the game...

Now with that said, some people will not see it that way. Those are the fans on both extremes of the fandom spectrum... On one side there is the GREAT ALEX SMITH fans or as I would like to refer to them as the G.A.S. fans and then there are the ALEX SMITH SUCKS fans or the A.S.S. fans... Whichever side you of the extremes one belongs to, there is one thing that is certain... They are blowing GAS out of their ASS

well done....

 

[Crimsoncrew]

He is as big as any problem the Niners have IMO because he is a deal breaker. The Niners can win with any other starter playing week after week but the Niners will never be a good team with Smith starting.

Bullshit. What evidence do you have that would possibly back that statement up? Would they win with Tarvaris Jackson? Jason Campbell? Chad Henne? No chance. Of course they would win more with a top-10 QB, but that's not a reality for the Niners right now.

 

[MW49ers5]

Good thing I said WRs, not receivers. And Crabtree is clearly the Niners' second-best receiver when healthy. If you're going to dispute that, there's no way you can claim Bryant is Romo's best receiver.

Re: Smith, his accuracy and mechanics have been much better. Against Seattle, he repeatedly escaped pressure he would not have in the past. This week there was nowhere to escape to in what I saw of the game. I don't think I have ever seen Smith make a throw like he did to Williams in the endzone this week. Feel free to disagree, but let me know what throw/s you're referring to that wasn't a seam pass to Davis.

This week we also saw Smith improvising with a shovel pass to Gore and a flip to Walker (which he dropped). Those are things I haven't seen much if at all from Smith, though again, feel free to cite examples to the contrary.

"Good thing I said WRs, not receivers. And Crabtree is clearly the Niners' second-best receiver when healthy."

Yes, I did catch that, which is why my response included all of our receivers (TE's & WR's) with the exception of Gore. IMO, Crabtree is clearly not our second-best WR; however, he is statistically the second worst WR taken in the 1st round of the 2009 draft.

Crabtree is not better than Morgan and that goes back to last year.
Ted Ginn has improved both his hands and his route running noticeably. Add to that his speed and right now I would play him before Crabtree.
Kyle Williams showed excellent hands and concentration throughout pre-season and did so again Sunday.

Right now, Williams (& even Bogan (IR)) intrigue me more than Crabtree. Based on my observations thus far, Crabtree has not even come close to 'clearly' separating himself from the other receivers on this team.

That said, however, I am certainly open to being wrong; so, perhaps you can provide some tangible evidence besides just your opinion demonstrating why Crabtree is clearly our second-best WR. Moreover, if he is clearly our #2 WR, what do you feel separates him from being our 'clear' #1 WR?


"Re: Smith, his accuracy and mechanics have been much better."

I understand that you are implying QB accuracy and not statistical accuracy; however, 74% of Smith's 31 completions (23) have an average reception point of 1.9 yards from the LOS. If it is all the same to you, I'll wait until he starts completing forward passes on a consistent basis before I anoint him a more accurate passer.

As for his mechanics, honestly, at this point in his career I could not care less about Alex Smith's mechanics. However, I am curious as to what you are seeing so can you perhaps offer some comparative examples?


"Against Seattle, he repeatedly escaped pressure he would not have in the past."

By my observation, Alex did absolutely nothing in the Seattle game that he has not done in the past - honestly nothing. What plays are you talking about?


" This week there was nowhere to escape to in what I saw of the game."

It would seem you are looking at the plays in much the same way Alex does. If Smith were a smarter, quicker, more capable QB, we would have made Dallas pay dearly on 2 of the 6 sacks and would have turned another 2 into gains instead of losses. While 'escaping' is a part of the blitz protection package, it is not the only option available to a QB to help him beat the blitz.


"I don't think I have ever seen Smith make a throw like he did to Williams in the endzone this week. Feel free to disagree, but let me know what throw/s you're referring to that wasn't a seam pass to Davis."

You don't think Smith has ever made a throw like the one he did to Williams; Okay, but I'm not sure I understand either the point you are trying to make or the point I'm supposed to disagree with.


"This week we also saw Smith improvising with a shovel pass to Gore and a flip to Walker (which he dropped). Those are things I haven't seen much if at all from Smith, though again, feel free to cite examples to the contrary."

Smith improvised and threw a shovel pass to Gore and flipped a pass to Walker and those are things you haven't seen much if at all from Smith; Okay, but once again, I do not understand the point you are trying to make or the point I'm supposed to disagree with.

 

[spacedoodoopistol]

"I don't think I have ever seen Smith make a throw like he did to Williams in the endzone this week. Feel free to disagree, but let me know what throw/s you're referring to that wasn't a seam pass to Davis."

The first one that comes to mind is the TD pass to Morgan last year, I believe it was vs. the Seahawks. Side of the endzone, a guy or two in coverage, ball put right into Morgan's hands in unstoppable place.

Look, I know no one wants to come off too pro-Smith, and I'm not accusing you guys of being irrational.......but he has made PLENTY of very nice passes over the years. He's not Manning, but putting balls into tight spots has never been his problem.....practically better on those than the short passes. Its always strange to see people say "now THAT's what we've been waiting for", when he had a couple obviously good games last year, and the year before.....there's no consistency, but the flashes haven't been in short supply.

Smith's problem isn't that he's so much worse than other middle-of-the-road QBs in the NFL - he's not - but that some of his mistakes have been so ugly and glaring it makes him appear to be a worse QB than he really is.

 

[sayheykid1]

Bullshit. What evidence do you have that would possibly back that statement up? Would they win with Tarvaris Jackson? Jason Campbell? Chad Henne? No chance. Of course they would win more with a top-10 QB, but that's not a reality for the Niners right now.

I apologize for not being clear.
What I meant was that the 49ers could win any other current Niner starter remaining a starter in his position except for Alex Smith which means he is certainly holding the Niners back. Staley by himself won't prevent this team from being great, Gore won't prevent this team from being great but with Alex Smith at QB this team will never be very good.

 

[freaak]

I apologize for not being clear.
What I meant was that the 49ers could win any other current Niner starter remaining a starter in his position except for Alex Smith which means he is certainly holding the Niners back. Staley by himself won't prevent this team from being great, Gore won't prevent this team from being great but with Alex Smith at QB this team will never be very good.

Thanks for clearing that up.

 

[MW49ers5]

The first one that comes to mind is the TD pass to Morgan last year, I believe it was vs. the Seahawks. Side of the endzone, a guy or two in coverage, ball put right into Morgan's hands in unstoppable place.

Look, I know no one wants to come off too pro-Smith, and I'm not accusing you guys of being irrational.......but he has made PLENTY of very nice passes over the years. He's not Manning, but putting balls into tight spots has never been his problem.....practically better on those than the short passes. Its always strange to see people say "now THAT's what we've been waiting for", when he had a couple obviously good games last year, and the year before.....there's no consistency, but the flashes haven't been in short supply.

Smith's problem isn't that he's so much worse than other middle-of-the-road QBs in the NFL - he's not - but that some of his mistakes have been so ugly and glaring it makes him appear to be a worse QB than he really is.

Great post! That was a brilliant pass - much better than the one yesterday.

The only thought I might disagree with is the part in bold, but only because I believe many tight window passes are never thrown by Smith. It seems as if he needs nearly perfect conditions before he will even attempt a pass into tight coverage; which, inevitably leads to many passes never being thrown and thus another sack, another chased out of the pocket-throw away, or another swing pass to Gore is completed for three yards.

Alex has always had enough below the shoulders to make it in the NFL, he simply does not have enough (or anything) between the ears. He looks in 2011 like the same deer staring into the same headlights as he looked like in '05, '06, '09 & '10. You can change his mechanics all you want and make him look better on a stat sheet, but until you can change his confidence and his intelligence, the outcome will be the same - IMO.

 

[Mozart'sGhost]

Great post! That was a brilliant pass - much better than the one yesterday.

The only thought I might disagree with is the part in bold, but only because I believe many tight window passes are never thrown by Smith. It seems as if he needs nearly perfect conditions before he will even attempt a pass into tight coverage; which, inevitably leads to many passes never being thrown and thus another sack, another chased out of the pocket-throw away, or another swing pass to Gore is completed for three yards.

Alex has always had enough below the shoulders to make it in the NFL, he simply does not have enough (or anything) between the ears. He looks in 2011 like the same deer staring into the same headlights as he looked like in '05, '06, '09 & '10. You can change his mechanics all you want and make him look better on a stat sheet, but until you can change his confidence and his intelligence, the outcome will be the same - IMO.

The dude graduated from the University of Utah in two years. I don't think he lacks for intelligence. Football acumen, maybe; but not intelligence.

 

[spacedoodoopistol]

The only thought I might disagree with is the part in bold, but only because I believe many tight window passes are never thrown by Smith. It seems as if he needs nearly perfect conditions before he will even attempt a pass into tight coverage

Yeah, no doubt. I guess I was only talking about the times he actually throws it. No doubt he's too tentative downfield, and because its happened through a series of coaches and systems we can only assume its him and not the coaches.

And what you guys are talking about....I don't know if "intelligence" can be the word you use, its more like "recognition".....any way you put it, the qualities that make a great QB are very difficult to put into words. For instance, there is a very important skill that he seems to be missing, where you a QB can rapidly widen/shrink his focus - he has to be able to see and process EVERYTHING in his whole field of vision, while simulataneously being able to focus on individual places and matchups happening within that vision. What is the word for that, who knows, its like QB and soldier the only occupations in the world that require skills like this.

 

[Crimsoncrew]

"Good thing I said WRs, not receivers. And Crabtree is clearly the Niners' second-best receiver when healthy."

Yes, I did catch that, which is why my response included all of our receivers (TE's & WR's) with the exception of Gore. IMO, Crabtree is clearly not our second-best WR; however, he is statistically the second worst WR taken in the 1st round of the 2009 draft.

Crabtree is not better than Morgan and that goes back to last year.
Ted Ginn has improved both his hands and his route running noticeably. Add to that his speed and right now I would play him before Crabtree.
Kyle Williams showed excellent hands and concentration throughout pre-season and did so again Sunday.

Right now, Williams (& even Bogan (IR)) intrigue me more than Crabtree. Based on my observations thus far, Crabtree has not even come close to 'clearly' separating himself from the other receivers on this team.

That said, however, I am certainly open to being wrong; so, perhaps you can provide some tangible evidence besides just your opinion demonstrating why Crabtree is clearly our second-best WR. Moreover, if he is clearly our #2 WR, what do you feel separates him from being our 'clear' #1 WR?


"Re: Smith, his accuracy and mechanics have been much better."

I understand that you are implying QB accuracy and not statistical accuracy; however, 74% of Smith's 31 completions (23) have an average reception point of 1.9 yards from the LOS. If it is all the same to you, I'll wait until he starts completing forward passes on a consistent basis before I anoint him a more accurate passer.

As for his mechanics, honestly, at this point in his career I could not care less about Alex Smith's mechanics. However, I am curious as to what you are seeing so can you perhaps offer some comparative examples?


"Against Seattle, he repeatedly escaped pressure he would not have in the past."

By my observation, Alex did absolutely nothing in the Seattle game that he has not done in the past - honestly nothing. What plays are you talking about?


" This week there was nowhere to escape to in what I saw of the game."

It would seem you are looking at the plays in much the same way Alex does. If Smith were a smarter, quicker, more capable QB, we would have made Dallas pay dearly on 2 of the 6 sacks and would have turned another 2 into gains instead of losses. While 'escaping' is a part of the blitz protection package, it is not the only option available to a QB to help him beat the blitz.


"I don't think I have ever seen Smith make a throw like he did to Williams in the endzone this week. Feel free to disagree, but let me know what throw/s you're referring to that wasn't a seam pass to Davis."

You don't think Smith has ever made a throw like the one he did to Williams; Okay, but I'm not sure I understand either the point you are trying to make or the point I'm supposed to disagree with.


"This week we also saw Smith improvising with a shovel pass to Gore and a flip to Walker (which he dropped). Those are things I haven't seen much if at all from Smith, though again, feel free to cite examples to the contrary."

Smith improvised and threw a shovel pass to Gore and flipped a pass to Walker and those are things you haven't seen much if at all from Smith; Okay, but once again, I do not understand the point you are trying to make or the point I'm supposed to disagree with.

A healthy Crabtree is pretty easily our second-best receiver. If you disagree, that's fine, but I think you're dreaming. Morgan is extremely inconsistent. Ginn has been fairly promising to date this season, but I don't buy it just yet given his career. Williams has two career receptions. He had a great catch this week, but he's far from proven at all. You may not like Crabtree, but objectively speaking it's not a contest.

This week Smith made great throws throughout the first half, many of them in the 10-20 yard range. We've called a fairly conservative offense, but he has been very proficient in the throws that he has made other than the INT to Davis. I suppose that Smith has always made good throws on occasion. The difference is that he is now consistently placing the ball accurately. I have seen practically no sign of the high balls that plagued him last season, or inaccurate short passes. As far as mechanics, it's mostly that he's not straightening the right leg and thus is not overthrowing the way he did a lot last year.

If you think the four of those sacks should have been positive plays, PLEASE break those down for me. I'll grant you the OT sack that I still haven't seen, but the others were almost instantaneous, including four in which he was hit before or right as he was completing his dropback. Do you mean that a better QB would have executed the called plays in those situations? Or a better QB would have recognized the pressure beforehand and gotten out of that situation? I'd possibly buy the latter. If the former, you're going to have to convince me.

Just a note here, not directed at MW in particular: I have repeatedly asked the critics to break down the sacks and tell me what Smith should have done differently. No one has done it. If you can't or won't cite specifics, stop criticizing Smith for "taking" sacks.

The last two thoughts pertain to Smith's improvement. I still haven't seen the second half. IN the first half, he was a completely different guy. He was consistently accurate. He made several legitimately great throws. He showed poise in the pocket and repeatedly made the D pay for sending five or six. He was improvising in a way that we have very rarely seen. He's still far from a great QB, but I am very encouraged by the improvement he has shown. It is, to date, far more than I expected to see. If we can get the protections down and Smith can play like he did in the first half on Sunday (of course, consistency has always been the problem), we will win some tough games this season. JMHO.

 

[threelittleturds]

I apologize for not being clear.
What I meant was that the 49ers could win any other current Niner starter remaining a starter in his position except for Alex Smith which means he is certainly holding the Niners back. Staley by himself won't prevent this team from being great, Gore won't prevent this team from being great but with Alex Smith at QB this team will never be very good.

How did you clear things up? You still said the same retarded thing, but in another way. You're still saying that the 49ers could win with ANY QB besides Alex Smith.

How about you answer the question, instead of re-wording the stupid statement. How are the 49ers a better team with Jackson, Campbell, or Henne?

Maybe you're trying to say the 49ers could win more with a top 10 QB? No shit, thanks for stating the obvious.

 

[threelittleturds]

The dude graduated from the University of Utah in two years. I don't think he lacks for intelligence. Football acumen, maybe; but not intelligence.

He's a smart guy no doubt, but I read that he graduated from college so quickly because he took a ton of AP classes in High School. Not saying that is bad thing, but he certainly didn't knock out his 4 year degree in 2 years like they reported it back in 2005 before the draft.

 

[MW49ers5]

Would a good QB have taken all those sacks this week? Absolutely yes. If the Cowboys brought the pressure they did, virtually any QB in the league would have been sacked on all five of the plays I posted. Now, if the Niners had a better QB, the Cowboys may not have brought so much pressure. But given the state of their secondary, I think they would have regardless of who was at QB.

I agree that Smith is not a long-term answer. But at present he is not the biggest problem. Not particularly close IMO.

"Would a good QB have taken all those sacks this week? Absolutely yes. If the Cowboys brought the pressure they did, virtually any QB in the league would have been sacked on all five of the plays I posted."

This is actually 100% incorrect and you seem to contradict your own statement as well. Most top and second tier QB's would salivate profusely at how Dallas telegraphed their first two blitzes and would have made Dallas pay dearly by changing the play at the LOS.

By my estimation, 4 of the 6 blitzes were beatable, two for potential big plays. I did not once see Smith change the play when it was obvious Dallas was bringing the house and the one time he changed the protection was a disaster.

Here I think you are contradicting yourself is when you say the following:

"Now, if the Niners had a better QB, the Cowboys may not have brought so much pressure."

If virtually any QB in the league would have been sacked on all five plays then what difference would it have made how good the QB was?

"...But at present he is not the biggest problem. Not particularly close IMO."

IMO, much of our offensive strategy right now is designed around protecting Alex Smith from Alex Smith and that is a huge problem.