Preparing for the Bruce and Dan Draft

[Sportster 72]

I was inferring nothing and knew the well you are comparing eras and can't do that. Based on the fact that I spoke about simple formations I can. I was talking about football and stand by what I said. It is well known by anyone that understands the game that Reed is a liability in the run game. It is simple math. I explained earlier 5 vs. 7 rarely works.

How the hell do you read some inference into a discussion of line play and positions??? Fucking amazes me when you say there aren't a lot of 3 down backs anywhere and used the Gibbs era (one of the brightest, besides that of Larry Brown to help illustrate.) How does that turn into "if you are inferring McCaffrey?" You could have used Chris Thompson or any other 3rd down back in the Redskins past. Too many soap opera's guys.

Dropping LBers happens on passing downs Sty. They don't just drop. They read keys so that they either attack the LOS of scrimmage or drop. This is the most basic of football. If you have read anything I have said you would have seen me say 9794573495353535 times that you have to run effectively enough to make play action work. That is where you suck LBers in. Again basic football.

I stand by what I said earlier. You want a better blocking TE if you want to run better. I am fine with Reed, He is a matchup nightmare in the pass game. One in which the Redskins/Cousins had the 3rd most yards in the NFL last year. Only beat out by Green Bay and New Orleans.

 

[Stymietee]

I'll start by saying I love JReed. He presents mismatch problems whenever we are passing.

I'll finish by saying this. If you want to be a dominant run team you can't have JReed in the game. Blocking TEs are essential in the run game. If you are old enough to remember Donny Warren he was like a third Tackle. Think back to the Steelers years ago. Same thing.

I keep hearing this title "3 down back" that is fine, better get a "3 down blocking dedicated TE" and it is good if your 2nd TE can compliment. Otherwise it is 5 against 7 and the 7 is going to win most often. Basic football 101 men.

I was inferring nothing and knew the well you are comparing eras and can't do that. Based on the fact that I spoke about simple formations I can. I was talking about football and stand by what I said. It is well known by anyone that understands the game that Reed is a liability in the run game. It is simple math. I explained earlier 5 vs. 7 rarely works.

How the hell do you read some inference into a discussion of line play and positions??? Fucking amazes me when you say there aren't a lot of 3 down backs anywhere and used the Gibbs era (one of the brightest, besides that of Larry Brown to help illustrate.) How does that turn into "if you are inferring McCaffrey?" You could have used Chris Thompson or any other 3rd down back in the Redskins past. Too many soap opera's guys.

Dropping LBers happens on passing downs Sty. They don't just drop. They read keys so that they either attack the LOS of scrimmage or drop. This is the most basic of football. If you have read anything I have said you would have seen me say 9794573495353535 times that you have to run effectively enough to make play action work. That is where you suck LBers in. Again basic football.

I stand by what I said earlier. You want a better blocking TE if you want to run better. I am fine with Reed, He is a matchup nightmare in the pass game. One in which the Redskins/Cousins had the 3rd most yards in the NFL last year. Only beat out by Green Bay and New Orleans.

First and foremost this was not a discussion of line play. It was you who made the singular claim that we could not have an effective run game with JReed on the field, I disagreed!

Secondarily, where exactly did I say or infer in this discussion that there were not a lot of 3 down backs? It should fucking amaze you that the Gibbs era was used, because you introduced it!! (Remember the Don Warren reference?) Further, I agreed with you that a better blocking TE or more use from Vernon Davis was needed, that doesn't mean that we can't use a two tight end run set that takes advantage of the JReed mismatch. In fact the most famous running play in the team's history saw Clint Didier in motion, and Otis Wonsley leading the way to spring Riggins. (Doc Walker was the other TE)

How does this turn into " if you are inferring McCaffrey?" because what this thread started out as was a discussion of the Bruce and Dan Draft which turned into talk about generic player "A" vs "B" then YOU introduced this: (Remember?)

From Keim today:
Both Cook and McCaffrey would give the Redskins something they lack: a dynamic every-down back (more in the Brian Westbrook mold). Cook, though, has more red flags and that could cause him to slide.

I support the opinion that McCaffrey can be an every down back.

Of course there's more to linebacker play than the singular action of dropping back into coverage, turns out, I made a reference to that as well in this thread. ("...effective running game to keep them honest."). You know as I do that this is also a game of matchups mismatches and numbers. if you find yourself in a 5 on 7 situation you're likely passing against a team that has little or no respect for your ability to run the ball against their front line (7).

I have no issue with your opinion that McCaffrey is an every down back, beyond the fact that I completely and totally disagree with it.

 

[Sportster 72]

I did introduce Warren. I apologize for not making it clear you brought Didier into the conversation and told me I could not compare eras or styles of play. The comparison of Didier as a pass catching TE to Reed is inaccurate as I illustrated.

See this comment:
From Keim today:
Both Cook and McCaffrey would give the Redskins something they lack: a dynamic every-down back (more in the Brian Westbrook mold). Cook, though, has more red flags and that could cause him to slide.

I support the opinion that McCaffrey can be an every down back.

See where it says Keim. I think my name says Sportster not Keim. That is why I included his name.

All that I stand by what I said. We have a TE who is a poor blocker and therefore hurts the running game. I have also said I would live with that fact because of all that Reed gives.

7 vs. 5 has not changed and has nothing to do with 30 years ago against today's game. If the defense reads run you are at best 7 versus 5 if you have a poor blocking TE. You are not actually 7 vs. 5 but effectively. If and the Redskins do you use this lineup at times VD is in the game then you are 7 vs. 7 but all that said my original point is Reed is a very poor blocker. If you want to run more effectively you would rather he wasn't on the field but knowing how Gruden likes to play I don't see that happening.

Whether you agree or not does not matter to me. I am secure in my knowledge of the game and stand by what I said. I also have said throughout I would not draft a RB No. 1. Not Cook, McCaffrey or anyone else. But at best I am an amateur GM so I will leave it up to Scott Campbell and your boy Bruce. Who will surely draft D Watson No. 1. HEY shark, how are you??? I really have no clue who they will draft first. Should be interesting.

 

[skinsdad62]

Cm might be an everydown back. I don't see him as a 20 carry back . 20 touches ? Yes 20 carries ? No. There is a difference . I also question whether he will break many tackles or has the acceleration to out run NFL defenders . I tend to think we need a 20 carry guy that moves that safety into the box and allows KC to play to his best strength play action passes . It also helps a colt McCoy or a young qb in the near future if we move on from KC if we have that type f back. This doesn't mean I think CM is trash . I just don't think he is the best fit for us . If I am pushed into a rb. I think mixon is the best fit for us .

Right now Allen or Foster or reddick could fall to us and that could be interesting

 

[Buffalo_Nickel_1]

Kiem thinks skins will draft charles harris

 

[Sportster 72]

Cm might be an everydown back. I don't see him as a 20 carry back . 20 touches ? Yes 20 carries ? No. There is a difference . I also question whether he will break many tackles or has the acceleration to out run NFL defenders . I tend to think we need a 20 carry guy that moves that safety into the box and allows KC to play to his best strength play action passes . It also helps a colt McCoy or a young qb in the near future if we move on from KC if we have that type f back. This doesn't mean I think CM is trash . I just don't think he is the best fit for us . If I am pushed into a rb. I think mixon is the best fit for us .

Right now Allen or Foster or reddick could fall to us and that could be interesting

dad I don't know if McCaffrey is a 20 carry back either. Time will tell. As far as speed he has more than many of the backs that were at the combine including Cook. Mixon's is 4.43 but McCaffrey was 4.48. So both have speed.

As I have said before he is a multi threat player. Something I would work well in Gruden's offense. All this said I don't see him being available to the Redskins if projections are right. Of course we all know about projections.

My arguments have been about labels put on him. Most unsubstantiated. I know shark liked Cook and Sty liked Mixon. I am good with all that. We all play GM to some extent.

My other point was about how devoted are we to the run. I wouldn't want to take Reed out of the offense but he is a liability in the run game because of his blocking. Again I am not picking on Reed, he is who he is and I will take the 70+ catches and 8+ TDs and live with the blocking issues.

Everything has to be in context with who the coach is and how he plays. How do you think AP is going to affect the Saints offense? He is an I back. He is a generational back but don't you think they have to make some adjustments for him to be effective. How will that affect Brees? So my point is Gruden is going to throw the ball. He will never be Vince Lombardi or George Allen. Why match a RB to him that does not fit his scheme. Please note - I am not associating ANY RB (insert name here) but am talking about scheme and offense.

I like your guys for our 1st round pick. I like that edge rusher from Tenn. too.

 

[Ruzious]

Kiem thinks skins will draft charles harris

Keim also said that Reddick is among a group that they're considering at 17. I like John, but by the time they make the 17th pick, there will be a dozen players that he could say - "I told you the Skins were considering him."

Picking Harris (particularly without trading down) would be a mistake, imo. He just does not seem like a coach's player, and that alone makes him a bad fit here - as I have very little faith in our defensive coaches to figure out how best to use him and get him motivated.

 

[Sportster 72]

LOL, I have seen so many different people mocked to the Redskins it is crazy. I think I have three people down on this forum dad = Reddick, shark = Cook, Sty = Mixon. As for me ..... I would like a football player (to quote SM)

 

[Sharkinva]

LOL, I have seen so many different people mocked to the Redskins it is crazy. I think I have three people down on this forum dad = Reddick, shark = Cook, Sty = Mixon. As for me ..... I would like a football player (to quote SM)

I think the only thing we can all agree on is that there are only a few ways they can really screw this up. There are guys we like, and dont like at 17, and even MOST of the guys we dont like are not because of football issues. More Character, Draft value, or team/scheme fit.

Long as we dont trade up to take a QB, or end up taking one at 17, I think by Saturday most of us will be asking how does (Insert player name) really help the team. Or if its a QB we will all likely ask... WTF are we actually doing.

 

[Sportster 72]

Yep I am not locked into a guy. Hell I don't even have a guy. Like you I do not want to see a QB drafted in round 1. I'll also eliminate drafting a kickers in the 1st round. I would love to see a defensive player drafted @ 17 but wouldn't be upset if it is an offensive player. I would also like to stay away from players with character issues in the 1st round or two.

Depending on how the picks before them play out there could be a lot of different directions they could go in. I will be watching the Caps and watching the crawl on computer.

 

[skinsdad62]

dad I don't know if McCaffrey is a 20 carry back either. Time will tell. As far as speed he has more than many of the backs that were at the combine including Cook. Mixon's is 4.43 but McCaffrey was 4.48. So both have speed.

As I have said before he is a multi threat player. Something I would work well in Gruden's offense. All this said I don't see him being available to the Redskins if projections are right. Of course we all know about projections.

My arguments have been about labels put on him. Most unsubstantiated. I know shark liked Cook and Sty liked Mixon. I am good with all that. We all play GM to some extent.

My other point was about how devoted are we to the run. I wouldn't want to take Reed out of the offense but he is a liability in the run game because of his blocking. Again I am not picking on Reed, he is who he is and I will take the 70+ catches and 8+ TDs and live with the blocking issues.

Everything has to be in context with who the coach is and how he plays. How do you think AP is going to affect the Saints offense? He is an I back. He is a generational back but don't you think they have to make some adjustments for him to be effective. How will that affect Brees? So my point is Gruden is going to throw the ball. He will never be Vince Lombardi or George Allen. Why match a RB to him that does not fit his scheme. Please note - I am not associating ANY RB (insert name here) but am talking about scheme and offense.

I like your guys for our 1st round pick. I like that edge rusher from Tenn. too.

look your viewpoint in my opinion has merrit , i cant argue too hard against it