Off Season Thread

[TDs3nOut]

I too am rooting for Garland to succeed at LG, but this piece intrigues me: Denver Broncos RUMORS: Evan Mathis A Potential Free Agent Fit After Ryan Clady Injury, Orlando Franklin Departure? : Sports : Headlines & Global News

Any thoughts on whether we should go after Evans? Can we afford to do so?

 

[randymon]

I too am rooting for Garland to succeed at LG, but this piece intrigues me: Denver Broncos RUMORS: Evan Mathis A Potential Free Agent Fit After Ryan Clady Injury, Orlando Franklin Departure? : Sports : Headlines & Global News

Any thoughts on whether we should go after Evans? Can we afford to do so?

Mark Schlerth on NFL Live ystrdy said he was really not that good for a guard let alone a tackle and not worth price tag he wanted and that`s why Philly let him go. They mentioned Miami,Indy and some team with a shitload of cap space as potential landing spots. I thought same thing TD as far as O-line help untill I saw video etc

 

[cdumler7]

I'm torn on this one TD. On one hand the Broncos are about to have the youngest OL (in games played) that the NFL has seen I think in the last 10 years. Other teams remotely close to what we are about to put on the field have not fared well. So getting a guy with the experience and ability of Mathis makes a lot of sense. Also Randymon not sure who Shlereth has been watching but Mathis has been one of the best if not the best OG in football for the past 4 years. The guy has just played lights out and fits our system perfectly actually.

Now having said all that I also like that we have a youth movement going for the OL. This will give us some time to built these guys up together for the next couple of years. Now yes this might hurt us especially early on in the season but later in the season when these guys have gotten used to playing next to each other it will mean some great things moving forward in my opinion. Also not a big fan of Garland not winning a starting spot. I have read that the kid has beat the coaches in most days as he wants this starting gig bad. Hate to ruin that kind of momentum to bring in an at best two year rental. Throw in then the Cap space that will need to be used could mean losing say a guy like Malik Jackson after this season.

The more I think about this the more I am fine if we pass on him. He would definitely be huge for this season but I hate the thought of getting a small boost this year at the sacrifice of the next few years getting a quality player like Malik.

 

[TDs3nOut]

I'm torn on this one TD. On one hand the Broncos are about to have the youngest OL (in games played) that the NFL has seen I think in the last 10 years. Other teams remotely close to what we are about to put on the field have not fared well. So getting a guy with the experience and ability of Mathis makes a lot of sense. Also Randymon not sure who Shlereth has been watching but Mathis has been one of the best if not the best OG in football for the past 4 years. The guy has just played lights out and fits our system perfectly actually.

Now having said all that I also like that we have a youth movement going for the OL. This will give us some time to built these guys up together for the next couple of years. Now yes this might hurt us especially early on in the season but later in the season when these guys have gotten used to playing next to each other it will mean some great things moving forward in my opinion. Also not a big fan of Garland not winning a starting spot. I have read that the kid has beat the coaches in most days as he wants this starting gig bad. Hate to ruin that kind of momentum to bring in an at best two year rental. Throw in then the Cap space that will need to be used could mean losing say a guy like Malik Jackson after this season.

The more I think about this the more I am fine if we pass on him. He would definitely be huge for this season but I hate the thought of getting a small boost this year at the sacrifice of the next few years getting a quality player like Malik.

Interesting points, CD. I have always felt since Elway landed Manning three years ago that it was a great opportunity to finally win another championship, so I get the "win now at all costs" view. At the same time, I am also enthused about the possibility that Garland can become a good LG, and I have absolutely loved how Jackson has played the past few years --really think that he could become a force in our new defense. Very tough call on whether to go after Mathis. Only hope that he is still available in training camp, when a better informed decision might be made.

 

[cdumler7]

Interesting points, CD. I have always felt since Elway landed Manning three years ago that it was a great opportunity to finally win another championship, so I get the "win now at all costs" view. At the same time, I am also enthused about the possibility that Garland can become a good LG, and I have absolutely loved how Jackson has played the past few years --really think that he could become a force in our new defense. Very tough call on whether to go after Mathis. Only hope that he is still available in training camp, when a better informed decision might be made.

Yeah this is the hard part in they have yet to slap on the pads. There are plenty of players that can look good in shorts but once the pads come on is when we actually get to see what type of team we have. Unfortunately I think he will be signed by the time Training Camp gets under way so it is either sign him now and stunt the growth of some of our younger guys for the better chance at a Super Bowl this year or trust that the young guys will step up. Like I said I could see the team go either way and I can be happy.

So far though I have liked what I have read about the OL players and how hard they are pushing to be great. They know they are going to be the most watched and talked about group on the team so they should be very focused. I also like the fact that we have a coaching staff that has been known to take even young guys and make them into stars in this league. Heck I think by the time the playoffs rolled around they had 2 rookies starting on the OL and they did very well.

 

[TDs3nOut]

Some pretty good stuff from Andrew Mason here: Mason's Mailbag: Wade Phillips and attacking defense

His answer to a question about whether we ought to be looking veteran FA OL reminded of the discussion above from a couple of days ago about the desirability of going after Mathis. Here is Mason's answer:

"
First, Blalock and Barksdale aren't smooth fits for a zone-blocking-intensive scheme. Second, helpful veterans might still be there at the end of the preseason if you need them -- or even into the regular season, as Dan Koppen was after the cut to 53 in 2012.

Besides, the Broncos already have an experienced option at every position on the line. At two of the positions, those experienced choices are on the top line right now: center Gino Gradkowski and right guard Louis Vasquez, the pillar around which the 2015 O-line will be built. At left tackle, the experienced insurance policy is Chris Clark; at left guard it's Shelley Smith; at right tackle it's Ryan Harris (and Clark started the first five games there last season).

So they're covered just in case. Someone at each position has done it before.

But as for it's June. Three weeks into OTAs is a poor time to pull the rug out from under the young players who the team would like to represent a future foundation for the line. Give them a chance. Let them get some practices now, and in training camp, to see what they can do. And if they're still in the lineup, yes, there will be some bumps, but young players can learn and improve.

The Ravens and Steelers didn't become perennial contenders whose "bad" years are still 8-8 or 9-7 by ditching their young players for veterans without giving them an opportunity. This is what draft-and-develop teams are supposed to do.

It takes patience, and the right thing to do in the long term is to let it play out.

Specifically for Garland, the Broncos have five years of investment on him dating back to his 2010 training-camp work before his Air Force service, and nearly two years of work with him on the offensive line. It's crucial to find out what he has, especially when his attributes are spot-on matches for the Broncos' current line scheme.

Don't mistake this for the Broncos' personnel department considering and evaluating every available player on the market. They do. But it's not just about performance in the moment; it's about growth potential, short- and long-term cost relative to the salary cap and the belief that with repetitions, untested players with the requisite talent can -- and often do -- improve."

 

[cdumler7]

Some pretty good stuff from Andrew Mason here: Mason's Mailbag: Wade Phillips and attacking defense

His answer to a question about whether we ought to be looking veteran FA OL reminded of the discussion above from a couple of days ago about the desirability of going after Mathis. Here is Mason's answer:

"
First, Blalock and Barksdale aren't smooth fits for a zone-blocking-intensive scheme. Second, helpful veterans might still be there at the end of the preseason if you need them -- or even into the regular season, as Dan Koppen was after the cut to 53 in 2012.

Besides, the Broncos already have an experienced option at every position on the line. At two of the positions, those experienced choices are on the top line right now: center Gino Gradkowski and right guard Louis Vasquez, the pillar around which the 2015 O-line will be built. At left tackle, the experienced insurance policy is Chris Clark; at left guard it's Shelley Smith; at right tackle it's Ryan Harris (and Clark started the first five games there last season).

So they're covered just in case. Someone at each position has done it before.

But as for it's June. Three weeks into OTAs is a poor time to pull the rug out from under the young players who the team would like to represent a future foundation for the line. Give them a chance. Let them get some practices now, and in training camp, to see what they can do. And if they're still in the lineup, yes, there will be some bumps, but young players can learn and improve.

The Ravens and Steelers didn't become perennial contenders whose "bad" years are still 8-8 or 9-7 by ditching their young players for veterans without giving them an opportunity. This is what draft-and-develop teams are supposed to do.

It takes patience, and the right thing to do in the long term is to let it play out.

Specifically for Garland, the Broncos have five years of investment on him dating back to his 2010 training-camp work before his Air Force service, and nearly two years of work with him on the offensive line. It's crucial to find out what he has, especially when his attributes are spot-on matches for the Broncos' current line scheme.

Don't mistake this for the Broncos' personnel department considering and evaluating every available player on the market. They do. But it's not just about performance in the moment; it's about growth potential, short- and long-term cost relative to the salary cap and the belief that with repetitions, untested players with the requisite talent can -- and often do -- improve."

Thanks for posting this TD. The more I read things like this the more I do think staying away from Mathis is in the best interest of the team. It keeps our young guys motivated for the next month before training camp knowing they can still win a starting position on the OL, helps us Cap wise so that maybe this year and next year we can sign some of our big name guys, and gives us a chance to finally build a young OL that maybe can be together for the next 3-4 years. We haven't had that since our Super Bowl days.

I honestly cannot wait for training camp to start and getting to see how the OL guys respond with pads on. They are an unknown group but they should all be competing as hard as they can knowing they all actually stand a chance of winning a starting job.

Also was reading today on Sambrailo and they said that he has shown some huge improvement and is even holding his own now against Ware. We shall see if that translates with the pads on but it doesn't seem like the moment is too big for him.


Other news I have been reading has said that Manning is actually looking the best he has ever looked at this point in the off season program. His passes have been sharp and he has been fitting it into some pretty tight windows. I think I have only read of him even throwing maybe 1 interception so far in all of the OTA's/Mini-Camp. He seems to be taking well to the new offense.

I've also been hearing good things about Montee Ball these last few practices of it looks like he is hitting the hole just a bit quicker and making the right reads. That RB competition is going to be intense come training camp.

 

[cdumler7]

Well rumors were flying yesterday that the Broncos tried hard to trade Peyton Manning before he signed his reduced contract. Both the Texans and Broncos have very loudly denied that this happened and even Peyton's agent has said he has never talked to the Broncos about a trade involving Peyton Manning. Looks like we are truly to the worst part of the football off season where nothing football related is talked about for a month. Training Camp please hurry up!

 

[WalkerBoh]

Well rumors were flying yesterday that the Broncos tried hard to trade Peyton Manning before he signed his reduced contract. Both the Texans and Broncos have very loudly denied that this happened and even Peyton's agent has said he has never talked to the Broncos about a trade involving Peyton Manning. Looks like we are truly to the worst part of the football off season where nothing football related is talked about for a month. Training Camp please hurry up!

I'd say it's more like some radio personality over playing his hand in a desperate attempt to make a name for himself. I doubt Houston was even contacted.

 

[iknowftbll]

Generally I've believed there to be a little truth to ever rumor but with one exception: Sports media. At this time of year there isn't a lot to talk about. The NBA season has ended, NHL season has ended, baseball at this time of year can't keep an audience being in the middle of a very long regular season, so sports media often has to fabricate a story. This is a pretty egregious example, but I still find that more likely than two NFL teams, Elway AND Manning's agent all "getting their stories straight" before denying the trade rumors.

 

[randymon]

Well lets say it was true and maybe it was used as leverage to get Peyton to take pay cut, etc. It would bode well for OZ and Bronco fans that they feel confident in life after/without Peyton. I don`t discount anything anymore in the NFL rumor mill but in reality,and the way Peyton finished season......who could blame them. I seriously doubt it was anything more than casual conversation between a couple GMs over a nice ice cold beer.

 

[MileHigh64]

Well rumors were flying yesterday that the Broncos tried hard to trade Peyton Manning before he signed his reduced contract. Both the Texans and Broncos have very loudly denied that this happened and even Peyton's agent has said he has never talked to the Broncos about a trade involving Peyton Manning. Looks like we are truly to the worst part of the football off season where nothing football related is talked about for a month. Training Camp please hurry up!

Aye, we've now entered the dark weeks of the NFL season. Training camp, pre-season and real football are the eventual reward. See you all on the other side!

 

[cdumler7]

It used to be as a kid I loved summer but now as an adult other than getting to play golf (which right now can't because I tore my achilles playing Soccer a couple of months ago) I usually can't wait for fall to get here and football to resume. I honestly dread checking Bronco headlines during this month in expecting that some player on vacation is going to go do something stupid. I hope our team is smart this off season. The last couple of years with Von, Prater, a couple of Execs, and a few others being idiots during this time has been plenty at least for the next decade.

 

[cdumler7]

Anybody planning on going to Training Camp at all this year? Just was thinking if we could figure out a day maybe some of us could meet up. right now I think I am planning on being there on the 12th of August. One of my wife's friends is flying in for a convention so she wanted to go up and said if I came I could just go to Training Camp while she went and hung out with her friend. So if any of you are going to be around let me know. Would love to meet up and maybe grab lunch and a beer after.

 

[cdumler7]

So some rumors are circulating that Denver could be interested in LT Isaiah Battle in the upcoming Supplemental Draft. He was the starting LT for Clemson this past year and by some scouts was figuring to work his way into the top-5 Tackles of this next draft. IF that is the case then that would be a 1st round type talent. Others have said he is a late day 2 type pick.

Anyway for those that don't know the Supplemental Draft is a bit different than the regular draft in a team will just put a value on the player and team that values him the most wins kind of thing but it will cost the team a pick in the next draft. Such as if the Broncos value him with a 3rd round type pick then it cost them their 3rd round pick next year to get him. His pay would also be that of our 3rd round pick this past draft so whatever Heuerman is making. That is just an example.

The good...

This is a possible 1st round talent that actually has very good foot work for a man of his size (about 330 lbs.) He looks like he could fit our system pretty well. He has played both RT and LT for Clemson. Leaving Clemson because he wants to provide for his family. Most others in the Supplemental Draft are there because they got kicked off their team. He has a good first punch.

The bad...

Probably top of the list is he got suspended for punching an opposing team's player during a game. He also got in trouble for getting pulled over for speeding and was caught with marijuana in his vehicle. He was not high at the time though. He also lacks some of the functional strength you would want in the player. So he is a developmental project in most likely rides the bench for a year while he builds on his strength.

Anyway just wondering your thoughts on us doing anything in the Supplemental Draft? We haven't really done much in the past and this guy wouldn't really be competing for a starting spot this year. This would be more of an investment in next season.

My guess is the Broncos after using a 2nd and 3rd round pick in the last 2 drafts on OT's will probably pass on this guy. He will have missed the entire off season program so he would be that much more delayed. They would almost have to try and sneak him onto the Practice Squad or hope he gets some minor injury that they can then store him on IR for the year.

 

[TDs3nOut]

So some rumors are circulating that Denver could be interested in LT Isaiah Battle in the upcoming Supplemental Draft. He was the starting LT for Clemson this past year and by some scouts was figuring to work his way into the top-5 Tackles of this next draft. IF that is the case then that would be a 1st round type talent. Others have said he is a late day 2 type pick.

Anyway for those that don't know the Supplemental Draft is a bit different than the regular draft in a team will just put a value on the player and team that values him the most wins kind of thing but it will cost the team a pick in the next draft. Such as if the Broncos value him with a 3rd round type pick then it cost them their 3rd round pick next year to get him. His pay would also be that of our 3rd round pick this past draft so whatever Heuerman is making. That is just an example.

The good...

This is a possible 1st round talent that actually has very good foot work for a man of his size (about 330 lbs.) He looks like he could fit our system pretty well. He has played both RT and LT for Clemson. Leaving Clemson because he wants to provide for his family. Most others in the Supplemental Draft are there because they got kicked off their team. He has a good first punch.

The bad...

Probably top of the list is he got suspended for punching an opposing team's player during a game. He also got in trouble for getting pulled over for speeding and was caught with marijuana in his vehicle. He was not high at the time though. He also lacks some of the functional strength you would want in the player. So he is a developmental project in most likely rides the bench for a year while he builds on his strength.

Anyway just wondering your thoughts on us doing anything in the Supplemental Draft? We haven't really done much in the past and this guy wouldn't really be competing for a starting spot this year. This would be more of an investment in next season.

My guess is the Broncos after using a 2nd and 3rd round pick in the last 2 drafts on OT's will probably pass on this guy. He will have missed the entire off season program so he would be that much more delayed. They would almost have to try and sneak him onto the Practice Squad or hope he gets some minor injury that they can then store him on IR for the year.

Not really sure. I know that Clemosn has had very good offense for several years, so it's reasonable to suspect that they've had pretty good LT play. Given the uncertainty at our LT position this year, I'd be more enthusiastic about getting Battle if there was reason to think that he might be capable of immediately starting. That's not to say, of course, that he isn't worth acquiring for the future.

 

[cdumler7]

Not really sure. I know that Clemosn has had very good offense for several years, so it's reasonable to suspect that they've had pretty good LT play. Given the uncertainty at our LT position this year, I'd be more enthusiastic about getting Battle if there was reason to think that he might be capable of immediately starting. That's not to say, of course, that he isn't worth acquiring for the future.

Yeah my thoughts on this are we are building for the now and for the future. A lot of times draft picks are the type that you are drafting not for the here and now but for their 2nd and 3rd seasons when they are expected to actually contribute. The issue though is using one of the spots on our OL on a guy that most likely doesn't play a single down this year unless injuries hit like crazy. With how shaky our OL is right now this could mean that we are cutting one of the veterans who could actually play decent this year if called upon. I don't think he could make it on the Practice Squad as it does seem a decent number of teams are interested in him.

At the same time getting a guy that maybe is a 1st round talent next year for maybe a 5th round pick this year seems like a gamble maybe worth it. Plus then the next year instead of being a rookie he has been in our system for a year so he can step in a little quicker. Really on this one I could see them go either way and be fine with it.

 

[TDs3nOut]

Yeah my thoughts on this are we are building for the now and for the future. A lot of times draft picks are the type that you are drafting not for the here and now but for their 2nd and 3rd seasons when they are expected to actually contribute. The issue though is using one of the spots on our OL on a guy that most likely doesn't play a single down this year unless injuries hit like crazy. With how shaky our OL is right now this could mean that we are cutting one of the veterans who could actually play decent this year if called upon. I don't think he could make it on the Practice Squad as it does seem a decent number of teams are interested in him.

At the same time getting a guy that maybe is a 1st round talent next year for maybe a 5th round pick this year seems like a gamble maybe worth it. Plus then the next year instead of being a rookie he has been in our system for a year so he can step in a little quicker. Really on this one I could see them go either way and be fine with it.

Have to think that Sambrailo, Clark, Harris, and Schofield are sure to earn roster spots. Do we normally carry a fifth tackle on the 53-man roster?

 

[cdumler7]

Have to think that Sambrailo, Clark, Harris, and Schofield are sure to earn roster spots. Do we normally carry a fifth tackle on the 53-man roster?

Usually teams like to carry 8-9 OL players. You have the 5 starters, a swing tackle, and then usually two guys that can play all the inside positions if needed.

At this point we know that Sambrailo, Gradkowski, Vasquez, Schofield, and Garcia for sure make the team. They are either draft picks or guys we have invested a decent amount in. Beyond them good chance Clark and Garland make the team. So that to me leaves one spot for Harris, Smith, and the others. At this point since Schofield can play the Guard positions as well I think I would rather see us keep Harris as he has shown to be able to play well in this system. It also gives us the ability say Sambrailo isn't living up to potential or gets hurt that we can move Clark over to LT and have Harris step in at RT and probably be just fine.

 

[cdumler7]

Oh one more thought. I could see us deciding to carry 9 OL players with only carrying 2 QB's. I don't see Dysert making the team and I think our new draft pick stands a very good chance of clearing waivers and making the practice squad for this next year.