Lionstop speaks: Off-season prediction pt 1

[Gulf of Brazil]

What's next for Detroit Lions at running back with Reggie Bush gone?

Now that Reggie Bush is gone, the Detroit Lions are in the market for his replacement. And while free agency opens in less than two weeks, the Lions are more likely to find help at running back in the draft.

Lions general manager Martin Mayhew said at the NFL combine last week that he thinks a running back will be taken in the first round this year for the first time since 2012.

"I think that's going to change this year," Mayhew said. "I think you're going to see at least one tailback go in the first round. I think what you have to see (to take one that early) is a game changer. And I think that there's some guys like that in this draft."

Two running backs stand out as potential first-round picks in a deep class, and both could fit a Lions team that owns the 23rd pick of the first round.

 

[Gulf of Brazil]

I sure as hell hope Mayhew doesn't draft a RB that is similar to what Bush's skill-set is/was. Mayhew did state in one article that Riddick had the same attributes as Reggie when it came to catching the out of the backfield.

JMO, players like Bush or this years rb's Abdullah and Duke Johnson are not worthy of selection in 1st two days of draft. They're change of pace or situational backs. That doesn't scream 1st-3rd round draft to me.

If Mayhew does draft a RB this year and early on, like 1st rd., it had better be someone who is that work-horse 3-down back.

TWENTYMAN: Lions release Reggie Bush
The emergence of Theo Riddick in his second season also made Bush’s release an easier call for Lions brass. Riddick is a terrific pass catcher out of the backfield and has a lot of the same skills as Bush. Riddick caught 34 passes for 316 yards and four touchdowns last season.

“When you have a guy like Theo Riddick, who can make a difference in the passing game, that brings value to your team,” Mayhew said.

 

[tpaulus_2]

Nice work with that speed score stuff, Big Blue.

Give more insight as to the actual speed and acceleration, vs. a 40 in shorts...

 

[Rollingthndr]

2015 Speed Scores
Player.......................School...................Weight........40 YD.........Speed
Karlos Williams............Florida State..............230............ 4.48............ 114.2
David Johnson.............Northern Iowa............224.............4.50.............109.3
Jeremy Langford..........Michigan State............208.............4.42............109.0
Javorius Allen..............USC...........................221.............4.53............105.0
Melvin Gordon.............Wisconsin...................215.............4.52............103.0
Matt Jones..................Florida........................231.............4.61............102.3
Jay Ajayi....................Boise State..................221.............4.57............101.3
Cameron Artis-Payne...Auburn.......................212..............4.53............100.7
T.J. Yeldon.................Alabama.....................226..............4.61............100.1
Michael Dyer...............Louisville....................218..............4.58.............99.1
Malcolm Brown............Texas........................224...............4.62............98.3
Duke Johnson..............Miami........................207..............4.54.............97.4
Mike Davis..................South Carolina............217..............4.61.............96.1
Trey Williams..............Texas A&M.................195...............4.49.............96.0
John Crockett..............North Dakota State......217..............4.62.............95.3
Thomas Rawls.............Central Michigan..........215..............4.65.............92.0
Ameer Abdullah...........Nebraska....................205..............4.60.............91.6
Josh Robinson.............Mississippi State..........217..............4.70..............88.9
Gus Johnson...............Stephen F. Austin.........215..............4.70..............88.1
Braylon Heard.............Kentucky....................198...............4.63..............86.2
Marcus Murphy............Missouri.....................193...............4.61..............85.5
B.J. Catalon................TCU...........................186...............4.57..............85.3
Kenny Hilliard.............LSU............................226..............4.83...............83.1
Jahwan Edwards.........Ball State....................220...............4.80..............82.9
Dee Hart....................Colorado State............199...............4.80..............75.0


Did not run 40: Dominique Brown, David Cobb, Tevin Coleman, Todd Gurley, Terrence Magee.

Yeah, it's amazing the size boner that guy has for Karlos Williams, comparing him to Bo Jackson. Even though it was rumored Bo ran a 4.28 40 yard dash. Still, if you look at a couple of the tapes in the Link, that jump cut was impressive as hell by Williams, being 230lbs.

 

[Gulf of Brazil]

some bad news here for you then if you like Karlos Williams

Florida State's Karlos Williams part of domestic battery investigation

if I remember correctly, he put a beat-down on his then pregnant girlfriend, who is also the mother of another child of his. The girlfriend posted pics on her twitter account. My best recollection is the case went away.

 

[tpaulus_2]

Yeah, it's amazing the size boner that guy has for Karlos Williams, comparing him to Bo Jackson. Even though it was rumored Bo ran a 4.28 40 yard dash. Still, if you look at a couple of the tapes in the Link, that jump cut was impressive as hell by Williams, being 230lbs.

Williams is a real wildcard. He's got lots of skill and ability, but is very unpolished.

If he's still there in the 6th, I'd be happy to add him to the mix and keep developing his game. Sooner than that is too much of a risk, imo.

 

[Gulf of Brazil]

Lionstop1, you might want to read this article even though it's from Bleacher Report

Mike Freeman's 10-Point Stance: Is This Draft Prospect NFL's Next 'Beast Mode'? | Bleacher Report

some tidbits from the article for those who don't want to read all of it;

No running back has been taken in the first round in two years. Before those two years, a back was taken in the first round every year since the 1970 merger.

This year, we will see backs taken high, because other teams want to try and duplicate the Seahawks' success on the ground.

1. "Marshawn Gordon"

If there was one thing I heard repeatedly from scouts I trust while covering the NFL Scouting Combine, it was this: The player who isn't a quarterback who can transform an offense, almost overnight, is Wisconsin running back Melvin Gordon.

I know. Weird, right?

A running back in a throwing league may be the key to this draft? Sounds crazy, but that's what I was told over and over.

It sounded like a smokescreen to me—more combine B.S. But the reasoning I was hearing makes total sense, and it comes down to a simple truism about the NFL: It's a copycat league.

Two teams recently have been making the rest take notice: Dallas and Seattle. Especially Seattle. What I can tell you is teams that don't necessarily need to rebuild are looking for the next Marshawn Lynch.

Teams are also looking for the next DeMarco Murray. You get the point.

Again, it's a copycat league. The NFL also noticed how Murray made Tony Romo better.

(I also spoke to teams about how Gordon isn't necessarily the best pass blocker, and one general manager literally laughed when I asked the question. Meaning, teams can live with that if Gordon gives them 125 yards a game and a score—which he is fully capable of doing on the next level.)

This is not to say that Gordon will have a Lynch running style. Few people do. I'm saying teams view Gordon as a guy who can give depth to an offense like Lynch. Or Murray. Or Justin Forsett.

Scouts who I spoke to at the combine believe that Gordon can be a clone of Lynch. One scout jokingly called Gordon "Marshawn Gordon."

If Todd Gurley hadn't shred his ACL, he'd be ranked ahead of Gordon. And to some teams, he still is, but I'm being told by scouts that the ACL tear is scaring people more than is generally known.

Now, some of this is surely misdirection. Some of it, however, is not. Torn ACLs scare the hell out of teams, and torn ACLs on running backs absolutely terrify them. No matter how common they are now, no matter how easily they get cleaned up, no matter how often backs come back from them, I can tell you that Gurley's injury scares some teams.

 

[Gulf of Brazil]

another good read but it pertains to ACL injuries and the rehab

Are NFL Athletes Playing a Dangerous Game with Too-Fast ACL Returns? | Bleacher Report

"The process of turning any tendon graft into a ligament takes a minimum of 18 months," Dr. Chao wrote. Though Peterson was running wild through NFL defenses in 2012, his reconstructed ACL was nowhere near healed. In fact, even as he was bursting through linebackers and racing past safeties, his recovering knee still wasn't performing at pre-injury levels.

A 2015 study in the Journal of Orthopaedic & Sports Physical Therapy tested athletes one year removed from ACL reconstruction against their teammates in NFL combine drills: the broad jump, vertical jump, modified long shuttle, modified pro shuttle, modified agility T-test, timed hop, triple hop, single hop and crossover hop.

Researchers found no difference in performance between healthy and rehabbing athletes in two-legged tasks such as running and jumping but found significant deficits in reconstructed knees in one-legged tests. Despite an apparent return to full performance, the ligament still isn't fully healed—and isn't out of the danger zone for re-injury.

That's exactly what happened to St. Louis Rams quarterback Sam Bradford.

Unfortunately, per Dr. Chao, chances for full-performance recovery drop "significantly" after a repeat ACL rupture. One of the primary reasons: The patellar tendon has already been used as a graft donor, so his surgeon will likely have to use a different tendon or source a cadaver gift.http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/monday-morning-md-3766/

 

[tpaulus_2]

So we draft Gurley and red shirt him for the season? I wouldn't necessarily be upset with that. Definitely would be a move with an eye on the future, though...

 

[Gulf of Brazil]

TP, would you still draft Gurley should the Lions not be able to sign 1 of Suh or Knighton or Fairley with the assumption that CJ Mosley comes back and some other 2nd/3rd tier DT is signed ?

 

[tpaulus_2]

TP, would you still draft Gurley should the Lions not be able to sign 1 of Suh or Knighton or Fairley with the assumption that CJ Mosley comes back and some other 2nd/3rd tier DT is signed ?

In theory, absolutely. It would all depend on who is on the board, but if we start drafting to fill holes then we're passing on better talent at other positions (potentially) to reach for the best remaining player at the position we need. Let's say Gurley is graded at an 89 on our board, but we want to fill that hole at DT, but the next DT o n the board is several players down the list at an 86? The flip side, imo, is that if Gurley (or whomever, doesn't have to be Gurley, can be any play who is on top of the board when we pick) is there for the taking at an 89, but a DT is right there at an 88, then I probably fill the need since a player who fills a need also rates so close to the top remaining player on the big board.

Overall, though, targeting a particular position in the 1st round is a really bad idea, imo. If we absolutely need to fill a spot via the draft I'd look at rounds 2 and 3 where starting-level players can still be had, but the talent gap between remaining players has shrank down enough that "reaching" for a guy isn't nearly as dangerous.

And for what it's worth if we miss out on Suh and then can't sign Fairley or Knighton I'm going to drive to Allen Park and have a chat-ski with Mayhew about going from two top-10/15 DTs to having zero top-10/15 DT, and why that's going to be really fucking bad for our defense...

 

[Gulf of Brazil]

I can see where you're coming from when you're talking about a single graded point in difference between two players. I just have a different viewpoint on that 89 player, in this instance doesn't actually fill a need, yet that graded 86 player is deemed a starting caliber LG/OC or DT. 3 points less, JMO, isn't that big of a deal to me.

 

[Gulf of Brazil]

just to give 1 example from last years draft, off of Scout's Inc. grading's
1 Jadeveon Clowney DE Texans 98
2 Greg Robinson OT Rams 97
3 Blake Bortles QB Jaguars 91 (was a reach but may be worth it)
4 Sammy Watkins WR Bills 96
5 Khalil Mack OLB Raiders 96
6 Jake Matthews OT Falcons 95
7 Mike Evans WR Buccaneers 94
8 Justin Gilbert DB Browns 91 (could have used Donald or Lewan over Gilbert and would have more impact)
9 Anthony Barr OLB Vikings 90
10 Eric Ebron TE Lions 92
11 Taylor Lewan OT Titans 94
12 Odell Beckham Jr. WR Giants 93
13 Aaron Donald DT Rams 94
14 Kyle Fuller DB Bears 92
15 Ryan Shazier OLB Steelers 92
16 Zack Martin OT Cowboys 93
17 C.J. Mosley ILB Ravens 92
18 Calvin Pryor S Jets 91
19 Ja'Wuan James OT Dolphins 80 (that major reach didn't pan out last year, maybe changes this year)
20 Brandin Cooks WR Saints 91
21 Ha Ha Clinton-Dix S Packers 92
22 Johnny Manziel QB Browns 90
23 Dee Ford DE Chiefs 89
24 Darqueze Dennard DB Bengals 92
25 Jason Verrett DB Chargers 90
26 Marcus Smith DE Eagles 70 (injuries beset this pick but should work for them)
27 Deone Bucannon S Cardinals 86
28 Kelvin Benjamin WR Panthers 75 (seemed to work pretty good there)
29 Dominique Easley DT Patriots 77
30 Jimmie Ward S 49ers 84
31 Bradley Roby DB Broncos 89
32 Teddy Bridgewater QB Vikings 89

 

[tpaulus_2]

Perfect example, imo. Ebron was a 92, we passed on Lewan (94), Donald (94), Martin (93), and Odell Beckham Jr. (93). Basically those were the guys left on the board whom scout's inc. rated higher than Ebron, and all four would have been drastically better picks, as they immediately established themselves as some of the best at their respective positions in the league.

Now our board must have looked a bit different, but in this particular case scouts inc. says we reached for Ebron a little bit over more talented players, and the way the season played out they would seem to be right...

 

[Gulf of Brazil]

fucker !!!!! I knew you would go there with the Ebron crap....

 

[gandydancer]

Just a internet rumor from Scouts Inc. can't believe it all can ya?

 

[Rollingthndr]

Just checked scouts inc....

Vic Beasley at 19? They are insane. Dude is a blue chipper and I would take him in the top 5

 

[Gulf of Brazil]

Just a internet rumor from Scouts Inc. can't believe it all can ya?

I can (having capabilities to do such)believe all but don't believe all.

 

[Rollingthndr]

I can (having capabilities to do such)believe all but don't believe all.

What's down is up and up is down.

 

[Gulf of Brazil]

Just checked scouts inc....

Vic Beasley at 19? They are insane. Dude is a blue chipper and I would take him in the top 5

I think he ends up in the "ATL" with HC Quinn there now. I agree with your thinking, Thunder, and long before his monster combine #'s output. But, I could say the very same thing when it comes to Walter having Gurley rated #4 right now. That's insane with him coming off an ACL and he won't be working out at Georgia's pro day either, as it has been recently reported.

I could track down 10-12 others fairly easily when it comes to current rankings of players coming into this draft