here is alot of my reasoning right here

[Sharkinva]

i think sonny and the 67 skins have a say in history taylor , mitchell and smith 1 2 and 4 in rec s unmatched in history

i have gone out of my way to say it wasnt ALL his fault and that some of you people need to stop with CSI theories and let the guy develop

While I agree it was not all his fault, one could make a very logical argument that he was the primary instigator in the dysfunction.

 

[gkekoa]

When you said, "RG3 has had the world handed to him and has been in the best circumstances", then I knew you were clueless. My how soon we forget the circumstances that led to last season. Guys just don't play hard because they are out of the playoffs. They get paid millions to perform their best at all times. RG3 was just introduced into this style of system for the first time so yes, he is learning. No need to give Cousins a pass, he clearly is not very good or he would be the starter. He failed last year also. The team failed, the staff failed, the front office failed.

He has two pro bowl WRs, a pro bowl RB, a pro bowl LT...how many other QBs can say that?

I don't think there is one.

If you actually believe players continued to play hard last season...you are delusional.

KC wasn't given the chance to be the starter because he clearly outperformed RG3 in the preseason.

 

[KickSaveDave]

The difference between RG3s situation and Peyton's is Peyton had virtually no talent around him for those first few years.

Marshall Faulk, Edgerin James and Marvin Harrison were not talent?

 

[Sharkinva]

Marshall Faulk, Edgerin James and Marvin Harrison were not talent?

Peyton Manning is was and will always be a pocket passer.

RG3... an option QB trying to become a pocket passer. Now either he will develop and become a complete QB... or stay who he is and be an improved version of some of the other option QBs that every one though would be the next great thing.

And no Peyton did not have nearly the level of talent around him his third year that RG3 has right now going into this season.

 

[Sportster 72]

Post #23495748556984 defending Griffin and trashing Cousins. Maybe some folks are nervous about the backup and have to keep putting him down. Why do we call everyone that doesn't agree with us a hater? Sounds like Larry Michel on his TV show.

In a few days we will see how Robert looks in his new offense with his new coach. I have no idea how he will do. As a fan of the team I hope he plays well.

 

[Darrell Green Fan]

RGIII was one of the best QB prospects to come out in years. He blew the doors off with a rookie season that statistically was the best in NFL history. After searching since Theisman to find a QB to build around the team invests 4 top pics in the guy. And now in year 3 and in a new offense we are determining that this is his make or break year and we should go in another direction if he doesn't perform up to expectations.

Yeah we should definitely do that.

 

[j_y19]

RGIII was one of the best QB prospects to come out in years. He blew the doors off with a rookie season that statistically was the best in NFL history. After searching since Theisman to find a QB to build around the team invests 4 top pics in the guy. And now in year 3 and in a new offense we are determining that this is his make or break year and we should go in another direction if he doesn't perform up to expectations.

Yeah we should definitely do that.

Who said this was his make or break year? All that was said was that if we end up with a losing record, it will be because rg3 didn't play well. We have too much other talent around him to only win 6 games. I may have missed it, but i don't think anyone said to get rid of him if he struggles. it all depends on how and why he struggled.

 

[j_y19]

BTW, since I am on record for us finishing 9-7 and winning the division, I must think that RG3 will play OK. So am I still a hater?

 

[skinsdad62]

Post #23495748556984 defending Griffin and trashing Cousins. Maybe some folks are nervous about the backup and have to keep putting him down. Why do we call everyone that doesn't agree with us a hater? Sounds like Larry Michel on his TV show.

In a few days we will see how Robert looks in his new offense with his new coach. I have no idea how he will do. As a fan of the team I hope he plays well.

well spotster i said i wish they would ignore the 1st part of the link because my true goal was why i tought we would go 6-10

i wasnt interested in the kc debate

 

[Sportster 72]

well spotster i said i wish they would ignore the 1st part of the link because my true goal was why i tought we would go 6-10

i wasnt interested in the kc debate

That's cool dad, then why mention it? The story this week or for the foreseeable future is Robert and all his teammates are playing. I don't see a QB change anytime soon.

I honestly don't know what to expect from the offense. We'll get our first look Sunday.

 

[Sharkinva]

RGIII was one of the best QB prospects to come out in years. He blew the doors off with a rookie season that statistically was the best in NFL history. After searching since Theisman to find a QB to build around the team invests 4 top pics in the guy. And now in year 3 and in a new offense we are determining that this is his make or break year and we should go in another direction if he doesn't perform up to expectations.

Yeah we should definitely do that.

If he doesnt perform up to expectations, another direction should at least be considered. A smart man realizes when he has thrown good money (in this case draft picks) at a bad investment. A not so smart man will continue to sink more money into a failed experiment. You dont give up 4 high draft picks and then say well he needs another 3-4 years. Many who follow the NFL think that his rookie year was his best and he wont ever match it. If thats the case, the trade was a mistake. Especially if he and the team are intent on playing him exactly opposite to what his best skills are. It was dumb to trade that many picks for a running QB with a rebuilt knee.

 

[skinsdad62]

That's cool dad, then why mention it? The story this week or for the foreseeable future is Robert and all his teammates are playing. I don't see a QB change anytime soon.

I honestly don't know what to expect from the offense. We'll get our first look Sunday.

it was tom boswell's article not my words . i got it from the B and G site i think and it has tom boswell on the front of the article . he mentioned it

what i wanted to talk about was the last part about 6-10 and why as i said in my next post in this thread

but that gets ignored and they go right to the other

 

[Sportster 72]

it was tom boswell's article not my words . i got it from the B and G site i think and it has tom boswell on the front of the article . he mentioned it

what i wanted to talk about was the last part about 6-10 and why as i said in my next post in this thread

but that gets ignored and they go right to the other

I think it gets ignored because it has been an oft repeated thread here. Many of Griffin's biggest supporters tell us to be patient or call us haters if we critique him but then tell us we know Cousins stinks because he started four games and the stats say so. I have doubt about Griffin, I don't hate him and I don't support making Kirk the starter at this time. If Griffin has another bad year then you have to start entertaining other ideas. No matter.

I don't fancy myself as much of a forecaster but this year I am really at a loss. We have so many weapons on offense it seems we would have to be good on that side of the ball. I think a new OLB coach has helped Kerrigan and Orakpo and they added Murphy. Hatcher and Baker should be upgrades on the DL. Robinson adds speed to the D that was missing in that spot last year. STs should be way better than last year. So why do most of us feel that we are a 6-8 wins team?

 

[j_y19]

I think it gets ignored because it has been an oft repeated thread here. Many of Griffin's biggest supporters tell us to be patient or call us haters if we critique him but then tell us we know Cousins stinks because he started four games and the stats say so. I have doubt about Griffin, I don't hate him and I don't support making Kirk the starter at this time. If Griffin has another bad year then you have to start entertaining other ideas. No matter.

I don't fancy myself as much of a forecaster but this year I am really at a loss. We have so many weapons on offense it seems we would have to be good on that side of the ball. I think a new OLB coach has helped Kerrigan and Orakpo and they added Murphy. Hatcher and Baker should be upgrades on the DL. Robinson adds speed to the D that was missing in that spot last year. STs should be way better than last year. So why do most of us feel that we are a 6-8 wins team?

Most that are predicting 6 wins are just shell shocked from the last decade. They are afraid to actually say we might have a good team. I'm with you, I critically look at this team and we have more talent on this team than we have had in 15 years. Our offense should be potent. Our defense is markedly improved. ST has to be better. Add all that up and the fact that we play in the weakest division and I can see 9 or 10 wins. The unknowns are the HC and the QB play. I personally think both will be fine, but will probably start off roughly. Fortunately our first 2 games are against weaker opponents so we can afford some time with Griffin and Gruden get their sea legs.

 

[Darrell Green Fan]

If he doesnt perform up to expectations, another direction should at least be considered. A smart man realizes when he has thrown good money (in this case draft picks) at a bad investment. A not so smart man will continue to sink more money into a failed experiment. You dont give up 4 high draft picks and then say well he needs another 3-4 years. Many who follow the NFL think that his rookie year was his best and he wont ever match it. If thats the case, the trade was a mistake. Especially if he and the team are intent on playing him exactly opposite to what his best skills are. It was dumb to trade that many picks for a running QB with a rebuilt knee.

This provided the answer to the question posed to me about who says it's a make or break year for Griff. This is a very common opinion, there is no doubt in my mind that many (most?) Redskins fans feel this is the make or break year. If Griff does not play great we should open it up to a competition with Kirk Cousins, a player who had worse numbers in every possible passing stat than Griff did last year, a year that was supposed to be a disaster for RGIII.

Look I get the concern. My point is if you bail on Griff what exactly is Plan B? I do not believe Cousins has provided any evidence what so ever to believe that he will ever be a top QB. So you draft a QB? Odds are much more in the favor of ending up with a Ponder or a Gabbert than the next Aaron Rodgers.

So why in the world would you not ride out the Robert Griffin train for the remaining 2 years of his deal before panicking and going with a QB that the odds strongly say will be worse?

 

[j_y19]

This provided the answer to the question posed to me about who says it's a make or break year for Griff. This is a very common opinion, there is no doubt in my mind that many (most?) Redskins fans feel this is the make or break year. If Griff does not play great we should open it up to a competition with Kirk Cousins, a player who had worse numbers in every possible passing stat than Griff did last year, a year that was supposed to be a disaster for RGIII.

Look I get the concern. My point is if you bail on Griff what exactly is Plan B? I do not believe Cousins has provided any evidence what so ever to believe that he will ever be a top QB. So you draft a QB? Odds are much more in the favor of ending up with a Ponder or a Gabbert than the next Aaron Rodgers.

So why in the world would you not ride out the Robert Griffin train for the remaining 2 years of his deal before panicking and going with a QB that the odds strongly say will be worse?

If he struggles again this year, you only pull the plug if his struggles are due to the fact that he doesn't break his natural habit of running under pressure without looking to throw. IF his struggles are related to learning to read defenses, this is something that all QBs go through. That you have to ride out. If, however, he can't overcome his natural instinct to take off and try and do it all himself, then this is cause for alarm. He may never break that habit. Vick didn't. He will not last in this league the way he runs and the contact he takes. This offense is set up to get the ball in the hands of the playmakers. Robert needs to understand that is his job, not to make the plays himself. Of course there will be times where he should run. But he needs to terminate those runs well before contact. He needs to learn to throw the ball away when nothing is there.

I disagree with your assessment of Cousins. Cousins is a natural pocket passer who is young and will only get better at reading NFL defenses with experience. Will he ever be Aaron rogers? No. But he can be a very serviceable QB in this offense with these weapons.

 

[Darrell Green Fan]

If he struggles again this year, you only pull the plug if his struggles are due to the fact that he doesn't break his natural habit of running under pressure without looking to throw. IF his struggles are related to learning to read defenses, this is something that all QBs go through. That you have to ride out. If, however, he can't overcome his natural instinct to take off and try and do it all himself, then this is cause for alarm. He may never break that habit. Vick didn't. He will not last in this league the way he runs and the contact he takes. This offense is set up to get the ball in the hands of the playmakers. Robert needs to understand that is his job, not to make the plays himself. Of course there will be times where he should run. But he needs to terminate those runs well before contact. He needs to learn to throw the ball away when nothing is there.

I disagree with your assessment of Cousins. Cousins is a natural pocket passer who is young and will only get better at reading NFL defenses with experience. Will he ever be Aaron rogers? No. But he can be a very serviceable QB in this offense with these weapons.

Cousins looks good in the pocket. So did Gus Frerotte. Sounds like this has been beaten to death here so I'll just say IMO Kirk Cousins will probably have a similar career path of Gus Frerotte. You don't contend year after year with serviceable QBs. You gotta go big to have a chance and Cousins will never be that guy.

But again I hear you on Griff. I never would have said this a year ago. but he does appear to lack the instincts of a great QB. The fact that he still has not learned to throw the ball away rather than step out of bounds with a 3 yard loss is frustrating. But what separates him from Vick and Vince Young is his ability to throw the ball. He is much more accurate than those guys ever were, that's what gives me hope.

 

[j_y19]

Cousins looks good in the pocket. So did Gus Frerotte. Sounds like this has been beaten to death here so I'll just say IMO Kirk Cousins will probably have a similar career path of Gus Frerotte. You don't contend year after year with serviceable QBs. You gotta go big to have a chance and Cousins will never be that guy.

But again I hear you on Griff. I never would have said this a year ago. but he does appear to lack the instincts of a great QB. The fact that he still has not learned to throw the ball away rather than step out of bounds with a 3 yard loss is frustrating. But what separates him from Vick and Vince Young is his ability to throw the ball. He is much more accurate than those guys ever were, that's what gives me hope.

Cousins could be the next Gus or he could be the next Flacco. Flacco is just a serviceable QB and the Ravens have done very well with him. Hell, for that matter, Wilson is a serviceable QB that does a great job of managing that offense. The knock on Cousins is that he throws too many picks. But as he gains experience, he should become better at reading defenses and these should drop. Cousins will probably never be the one to win games for you by himself, but that's not what this offense needs.

I still have hope for Griff, but not like I did his rookie year. We've just seen too many flaws (mostly mental) to guarantee his greatness. He has all the physical tools and he has the work ethic. My questions revolve around will he be willing to work on the right things and will he be willing to be a game manager instead of the highlight reel star?

 

[Darrell Green Fan]

Flacco is the exception to the rule and it more a result of playing for probably the best organization in the league than anything else. Look at the SB winning QBs,. I did this exercise once and found about 6-7 serviceable QBs, the other 42 were much more than that. And every serviceable QB was one and done, they never went back let alone won it again. And we are now in an era that has made the NFL a passing game, it's more important now more than ever to have a top QB.

Wilson on the other hand is clearly something special.

 

[skinsdad62]

Cousins looks good in the pocket. So did Gus Frerotte. Sounds like this has been beaten to death here so I'll just say IMO Kirk Cousins will probably have a similar career path of Gus Frerotte. You don't contend year after year with serviceable QBs. You gotta go big to have a chance and Cousins will never be that guy.

But again I hear you on Griff. I never would have said this a year ago. but he does appear to lack the instincts of a great QB. The fact that he still has not learned to throw the ball away rather than step out of bounds with a 3 yard loss is frustrating. But what separates him from Vick and Vince Young is his ability to throw the ball. He is much more accurate than those guys ever were, that's what gives me hope.

this has much more to do with not liking the trade to get him then anything else . the guy is entering year 3 and they expect him to walk on water and buy into stupid CSI theories claiming Rg3 is a secret anti christ