ALL THINGS SUH

[gvsulaker82]

That's one crazy way of looking at it. (KC, Tampa and Oakland haven't combined to win a WS since The Bash Brothers.). Somebody get Michael Lewis on the phone.

Exactly. The bottom feeders in the league continue to develop players to trade them to the sharks, teams like the tigers, red sox etc. Its a fragile ecosystem. We dont want the lions being managed like the royals anytime soon.

 

[jdwills126]

I like Suh and the fact teams consider him a monster. He has that reputation you love on your team and hate when you play him.

With that being said at what price? And do we stay in a cycle of signing and restructuring putting the bill off until it becomes crippling?

If the Lions had not got themselves into dead money hell it probably would not be a tough decision but I see Jay Z running prison sex on Mayhew and Lewand and getting a larger deal than Atkins got! Thus making a restructuring of Calvins 20+ million dollar deal next year and beyond a must! Then it's Stafford then back to Suh.

And if Suh plays hardball asking for huge money or going to New York? LA? or Chicago? I hope the Lions have a hard cap and finally stick to a plan and not just roll over for Suh and his entourage.

 

[themuzzer]

I'm getting on board with the trade big name guys.......Suh happens to be one of them.....He's great, the contract isn't.....It's that simple.....Would you take two #1 draft picks if you could dump the money and draft cheap? I think I would.

Now that would mean a step backward initially but two steps forward financially.

 

[Rollingthndr]

If that is the case -- trade Calvin Johnson, Suh and Stafford and the Lions will have more money than they know what to do with.

Aaaaaaaand the 1st overall pick in the draft lol

 

[Rollingthndr]

When did all the Lions fans on this board become Jewish accountants?

 

[Rollingthndr]

I'm getting on board with the trade big name guys.......Suh happens to be one of them.....He's great, the contract isn't.....It's that simple.....Would you take two #1 draft picks if you could dump the money and draft cheap? I think I would.

Now that would mean a step backward initially but two steps forward financially.

Come on Muzzer, Suh has played 4 seasons for us and had 3 all pro selections and is entering the prime of his career and you want to get rid of him now? The good times are just about to begin, namely ****ler's face being driven to the turf at ford field a few more times.

 

[broncosmitty]

When did all the Lions fans on this board become Jewish accountants?

No shit, right!?!

 

[themuzzer]

Come on Muzzer, Suh has played 4 seasons for us and had 3 all pro selections and is entering the prime of his career and you want to get rid of him now? The good times are just about to begin, namely ****ler's face being driven to the turf at ford field a few more times.

Make no mistake about it..... I don't want to get rid of Suh, I want to get rid of what's going to happen financially to us.

 

[themuzzer]

No shit, right!?!

Guess jews don't live in cardboard boxes?

 

[lionstop1]

First thing is; Suh and Jay Z will want something more than the first contract he recieved. That should be pretty obvious considering what Suh has done since. 3x Pro bowler and in his prime. Any guy here would want more.

Second thing is; this has a bad ending. How will the team be able to keep up and pay all the other guys, especially on the dline? These guys won't settle for weak contracts while 3 guys are eating all the money.

Third thing is; it makes it look as if the front office only cares about putting these three guys on the field instead of building a quality team overall.

 

[Gulf of Brazil]

Make no mistake about it..... I don't want to get rid of Suh, I want to get rid of what's going to happen financially to us.

this

 

[broncosmitty]

I don't care about anyone else on the DLine anymore than I care about Nate or Delmas. "Other" guys exist everywhere.(Our other guys happen to be better than most.) The Bears, Viks and Pack have plenty of other guys. They'll get other guys to replace the current ones. We're not going to replace Suh. Didn't replace Alex Karras for 40 years, it'll be the same when this great one leaves.

 

[Gulf of Brazil]

First thing is; Suh and Jay Z will want something more than the first contract he recieved. That should be pretty obvious considering what Suh has done since. 3x Pro bowler and in his prime. Any guy here would want more.

Second thing is; this has a bad ending. How will the team be able to keep up and pay all the other guys, especially on the dline? These guys won't settle for weak contracts while 3 guys are eating all the money.

Third thing is; it makes it look as if the front office only cares about putting these three guys on the field instead of building a quality team overall.

_____________________________________________________________________________________
DAMN LIONSTOP1..SPOT ON.. and it wasn't about Sammy Watkins either that you were talkin bout

do not misinterpret my comment as being smartass.. I'm agreeing with your statement. I gotta agree with the trading Suh part that Dr. evil and others stated. Strictly from a financial standpoint. I love me some Suh but not for 13-15 mil per yr or whatever ridiculous contract he ends up pulling out of Mayhew's ass

 

[Gulf of Brazil]

as much as I love Suh for how he plays but still keeping in mind of the money situation, if I were Mayhew I'd be on the phone with the Raider's FO seeking out feelers if they would be willing to trade for him. The Raider's have nearly 60 mil free in cap space, need a DT, have the #5 overall draft pick this year (which I'd gladly accept because you'd almost be assured of getting S. Watkins or Khalil Mack) not to mention asking for next years 2nd round pick of there's and possibly a conditional 3rd-4th round pick.

Assume Suh Demands 14-15 mil per year over 5 years and Mayhew isn't willing to do that but the Raider's are. He's from the Portland area so Oakland puts him closer to home.

As Muzz stated, we may take a step or two backwards but how does a #2 WR chosen in this draft assure us of improving this year. A lot of assumptions have to be questioned and answered with all the needs we still have. It's not as if we can't find another DT. He won't be Suh but maybe that draft pick flashes just like Suh did his 1st year. There are good DT's to choose from in the 1st 3 rounds (granted we've gotta hit on the pick). We could then trade down from our #10 slot (assuming Watkins or Mack aren't still alive for that slot) into the 20's acquiring a couple 4th's and a couple 3rd's. Acquiring more picks through trade-downs doesn't assure us of starters or impact players but the culmination of not having to shell out 15 mil in 2015 for Suh plus all these extra draft picks is something that shouldn't be frowned upon. One player does not make a whole team. How many really good DT's came from the same Draft that Suh did. Three, Suh, Atkins (a 4th round pick) and McCoy...so it's not impossible to find another good or even a really good DT.


#5
#10 Traded
#22
#45
#76
3rd round
3rd round
#107
4th round
4th round
4th round comp pick
#173
#205

 

[da55bums]

Lions DT Ndamukong Suh has hired Jay-Z and Roc Nation as his new representation.
Suh fired agent Roosevelt Barnes last month and was fully expected to hire Jay-Z. The Lions and Suh can now get to hammering out a long-term extension in an effort to reduce his $22.4 million 2014 cap hit. Suh earned $51.8 million in his first four seasons and may become the highest-paid defensive player.

Good. Suh is the real face of this team.

didn't Jay-Z and Roc Nation just fail with not getting Cano the 30 mil a year for 10 yr deal but also fail by him ending up in Seattle?

Didn't get the money or the high end team they were going for...not sure thats a smart move by Suh by going with a name over experience. At least he gets to hang in a suit with Beonce though.

 

[jdwills126]

What I think is funny is how these agents have become celebrities and a celebrity has became a sports agent! It was hard enough to negotiate deals with Boras and some others but now Jay Z has his Roc Nation and will be trying to make a splash.

Honestly, Suh has had great contracts, made huge money, and is in line for a big pay day! Suh has earned his contract but I don't get firing your agents…Rooselvelt and Barnes to hire Jay Z. I don't think this move is going to benefit the Lions ability to get a deal done.

If it resembles the Cano contract fiasco Jay Z was apart of the Lions management is in trouble. Cano demanded huge money from New York, would not budge from his demand and when the Yankees walked away…THE FUCKING YANKEES WALKED AWAY from a contract demand….Cano was left with only the Mariners deal on the table. Cano left a marketing capital, a consistent playoff team, and the place he really wanted to sign a long term deal to go to baseball purgatory! Great job Jay Z! I sure hope you have learned a few things before you walk into Allen Park.

 

[Dr. Evil-er]

What qualifications does Jay Z have to be an agent? Is it anything more than Suh himself? Seriously, what does this jackass know more about NFL contracts than half the guys on this board?

Suh could simply walk into Allen Park representing himself and say I expect to be the highest paid DT in the league and will not accept a pay cut. How much does an agent take of the contract? I would guess its 15%. Well guess what Suh, if you wiped out that commission and the Lions agree to keeping you at your $12.5m average thats the same amount as if your agent got you an average of $14.375m/yr.

This isnt rocket science for crying out loud. You want a contract that works for everyone, here's one for free........

6 yr, $75m, with $30m guaranteed. That crushes the Atkins contract and keep you at the same average you get now. If you want that big amount then you need to work with the Lions in a way that benefits them as well since they are paying you such a continued premium over your position pay scale. That's why you didnt get a signing bonus immediately, but you will be more than taken care of. Here's how......

Year 1 Salary $3.6m + plus $9.8m carry forward dead from Millenhew's restructuring incompetance = cap hit $13.4m (the Lions free up $9m in space this year)
Year 2 Salary $4.4m + $9.7m carry forward dead (thanks again Millenhew you fucking loser) = cap hit $14.1m
Year 3 Salary $5m + a $20m Option Bonus (like a signing bonus its paid all at once but can be spread over the remaining length of the contract, so it counts as a $5m per year hit). The cap hit = $10m
Year 4 Salary $9m + another Option Bonus of $6m (counts as a $2m annual hit) + $5m from the first option bonus = Cap hit = $16m
Year 5 Salary $12m + the annualized hits from the option bonuses of $7m = Cap hit $19m
Year 6 Salary $15m + option bonuses of $7m = Cap hit $22m

All contracts escalate quite a bit in the last few years, just look at CJ's and Stafford's. The cap should be quite a bit higher by the time you reach the 5th and 6th years of that deal. But if by that time the situation with his play was such that it warrented cutting him then despite the dead money that cut would still actually free up $5m in cap space the 5th year and $15m if cut before the 6th year.

If you want to know how that compares to what Suh would actually be paid over the first few years of the contract compared to Atkins here it is. First off Suh would get double the amount of guaranteed money, which is the most important part of the contract. Atkins gets paid a total of $27.4m in the first 3 years of his deal and $33.7m over the first 4. Suh would be paid $33m over the first 3 years and $48m over the first 4 years. I would think he should be happy as shit with that and it still keeps his cap number never once exceeding a workable $16m for the Lions.

On the other hand if he goes in there demanding $16m+ a year then good luck with that. If the Lions pay it then not only are they stupid but watch how much that hurts. You try and figure out a way to work into those numbers an additional amount of $21m ($3.5m more than what I put up times 6 years). It's a clown show in Allen Park.

 

[LPinSLC]

Does a signing bonus count against the cap?

 

[LPinSLC]

You want to keep him? Give him a signing bonus so big that he'll sign for pennies. Going to have to pay the piper eventually. Might as well bite the bullet now and get some cap relief for the future.

 

[gvsulaker82]

I don't care about anyone else on the DLine anymore than I care about Nate or Delmas. "Other" guys exist everywhere.(Our other guys happen to be better than most.) The Bears, Viks and Pack have plenty of other guys. They'll get other guys to replace the current ones. We're not going to replace Suh. Didn't replace Alex Karras for 40 years, it'll be the same when this great one leaves.

Yeah people dont seem to get that though. Their thought process is lets trade him for draft picks because those picks will pan out and somehow they will be better. But thats not how the draft works and the lions will not find another suh or anyone close to it. Like I said earlier for those so worried about the lions spending money thats not yours you should be wanting to renege the stafford contract not worried about suh signing. Suh has already proven himself to be one of the best at his position and hes only going to get better. Stafford has not.