Coach Saban wasn't that great...

[Bandwagonbo2]

Well Nick Saban wasn't a name back then either. So he wouldn't be able to just recruit top tier talent as easily as he could with a name behind it like Alabama. But saying he is only good because of the SEC is dumb.

This has been my point all along. Saban is a name commodity now and would instantly add excitement to any location he moved to. Back then he was starting out and still finding his flow, he has that well established now and knows how to win consistently. This clown thinks the SEC made Saban great, and while he has been in the SEC during this run, his process has grown with each year. Anyone with more than half a brain can see he has evolved as the game has, even moving the last few years to a higher octane offense at the expense of his defense first mentality.

 

[7Samurai13]

This has been my point all along. Saban is a name commodity now and would instantly add excitement to any location he moved to. Back then he was starting out and still finding his flow, he has that well established now and knows how to win consistently. This clown thinks the SEC made Saban great, and while he has been in the SEC during this run, his process has grown with each year. Anyone with more than half a brain can see he has evolved as the game has, even moving the last few years to a higher octane offense at the expense of his defense first mentality.

I said that if Saban went to Rutgers, they would have a top 10 recruiting class year one. His name would change any program instantly.

 

[TrustMeIamRight]

He also will be on the team next year, right? He's ranked 5th for Pro style QB's. Wisconsin and Alabama both started true freshmen last year. So he is another QB that Harbaugh recruited that you are conveniently leaving off your list.

What list? He isn't even in school yet? If he were an early enrollee, I'd say he would have a shot to compete. But IMO, he will need to add at least 15-20 lbs before taking the field or he will get broke in half.

Brandon Peters is the guy I'd like to see. But also, I said already, I personally thought Speight played well last year until he was injured, after that he was terrible.

And this year, I'm not overly concerned with the QB position. We will either have a QB with a full year's experience or we will have a highly rated freshman RS who beat out the returning starter.

It is CB, WR and LB that I want to see. Right now we could be starting 2 true freshman at WR. 2 sophomores at CB and 2 sophomores or 1 sophomore and 1 true freshman at LB.

 

[TrustMeIamRight]

I said that if Saban went to Rutgers, they would have a top 10 recruiting class year one. His name would change any program instantly.

Rutgers I could see, it is a state that has produced Jabrill Peppers, Rashan Gary, Minkah Fitzpatrick, etc over the last few years. They have a ton of talent in NJ and a terrible program.

Put him at schools like Minnesota, Indiana, Purdue, Illinois, etc. It isnt happening -- if he starts turning the programs into national powers, then yes a top 10 class would happen down the road. There is a reason why the best coaches bounce from job to job until they get to a blue blood programs.

The top recruits want to go to the schools where they get the best perks, the most national attention, the games being televised every week, the best facilities, etc.

 

[TrustMeIamRight]

This has been my point all along. Saban is a name commodity now and would instantly add excitement to any location he moved to. Back then he was starting out and still finding his flow, he has that well established now and knows how to win consistently. This clown thinks the SEC made Saban great, and while he has been in the SEC during this run, his process has grown with each year. Anyone with more than half a brain can see he has evolved as the game has, even moving the last few years to a higher octane offense at the expense of his defense first mentality.

I have no doubt if you put Saban at a Blue Blood school -- he'd be very successful. You seem to think Saban invented the wheel in CFB and he is transforming unknown recruits into superstars. What makes Saban great is his recruiting. He has, by far, the most talent of any school, every year.

What makes his recruiting possible?
1. You have to be at a school who will basically give you a blank check for what you need
2. You need to have a home state with elite talent
3. Your conference footprint needs to be loaded with talent

Reason for #1 -- you will be traveling all over the country and showing up with a private jet or a recruits practice in a helicopter helps sell a school. It impresses young kids. Those type of things aren't cheap.

Reason for #2 -- the home state kids grow up fans of the school. They grow up watching the team, wearing the jerseys and imitating the players. They are the easiest guys to sell and get to commit. They are also the main base for the class, who can sell other elite recruits on the school, the state they will be moving for 4 years, etc.

Reason for #3 -- the footprint is important because these kids grow up watching the conference in their area. If you are in the Midwest, you grow up watching the B1G. If you are from the South, you grow up watching the SEC/ACC. If you are from the West, you grow up watching the PAC and I guess you call the Big 12 footprint the Southwest (?)

CFB isnt difficult to figure out. Whoever collects the most talent wins. It is why coaches bounce around until they hit one of the few schools where you can bring in the top recruits.
What makes Saban so successful at Bama and in the SEC, in general -- he is great at recruiting and he is in, by far, the richest talent pool of recruits in that conference.

If you think Saban went to Rutgers and he'd be pulling 5 star recruits from California, Florida, Texas, etc. I disagree. They have one of the worst stadiums in the B1G and rank at or near the bottom for their team facilities. The name recognition could sell local kids who grew up watching Rutgers, you aren't selling a rebuilding to guys traveling across country and have every top school coming after them.

 

[Bandwagonbo2]

I have no doubt if you put Saban at a Blue Blood school -- he'd be very successful. You seem to think Saban invented the wheel in CFB and he is transforming unknown recruits into superstars. What makes Saban great is his recruiting. He has, by far, the most talent of any school, every year.

What makes his recruiting possible?
1. You have to be at a school who will basically give you a blank check for what you need
2. You need to have a home state with elite talent
3. Your conference footprint needs to be loaded with talent

Reason for #1 -- you will be traveling all over the country and showing up with a private jet or a recruits practice in a helicopter helps sell a school. It impresses young kids. Those type of things aren't cheap.

Reason for #2 -- the home state kids grow up fans of the school. They grow up watching the team, wearing the jerseys and imitating the players. They are the easiest guys to sell and get to commit. They are also the main base for the class, who can sell other elite recruits on the school, the state they will be moving for 4 years, etc.

Reason for #3 -- the footprint is important because these kids grow up watching the conference in their area. If you are in the Midwest, you grow up watching the B1G. If you are from the South, you grow up watching the SEC/ACC. If you are from the West, you grow up watching the PAC and I guess you call the Big 12 footprint the Southwest (?)

CFB isnt difficult to figure out. Whoever collects the most talent wins. It is why coaches bounce around until they hit one of the few schools where you can bring in the top recruits.
What makes Saban so successful at Bama and in the SEC, in general -- he is great at recruiting and he is in, by far, the richest talent pool of recruits in that conference.

If you think Saban went to Rutgers and he'd be pulling 5 star recruits from California, Florida, Texas, etc. I disagree. They have one of the worst stadiums in the B1G and rank at or near the bottom for their team facilities. The name recognition could sell local kids who grew up watching Rutgers, you aren't selling a rebuilding to guys traveling across country and have every top school coming after them.

Hogwash and bullshit.
FACT, Bama had 6 players commit that were not in its traditional footprint. Nearly 1/4 of its recruits, that pretty damn good. One from Hawaii. Saban is a nationwide recruiter and yes Bama has a big budget for that, but the football team is the budget provider for the entire athletic department at that University. So they can dictate where money is spent to a degree. There is a surplus every year after they take the states minimum, that is used for the University and repaid to the state. That team is actually a money maker for the state of Alabama and its budget, even with Saban's high salary.

As for Rutgers, I didnt say anything about Rutgers, but I did agree with someone. MSU is not Rutgers and that is who I mentioned he could take over today and build a winner in a few years time. we will never get to test this as he will retire at Bama, but his ability to recruit and develop players would make him a winner virtually anywhere. Bama didnt have world class facilities when he got there, but we do now due to his drive to make them so, this include academic facilities he is also key in developing. He pushes education and his players graduate at a high rate, one of the highest in the Nation and tops in the SEC.

SO your issuemwith Saban are really an obsession you have and nothing more. you will find few who agree with you, maybe you can start a club of batshit crazies like yourself and tour the country speaking on the evils of Saban. I am sure you will draw an audienxe someplace. Might I suggest a local mental ward at a hospital.

 

[4down20]

Dunning–Kruger effect - Wikipedia

 

[7Samurai13]

 

[B_dub]

Dunning–Kruger effect - Wikipedia

That book title should be directly under Trustme's screen name: "unskilled and unaware of it"

 

[Bamabino]

Dunning–Kruger effect - Wikipedia

Winner of the 2016 Offseason Rainbow Stakes and front-runner in 2017. There's no sophomore slump with ThrustMe.

 

[TrustMeIamRight]

Hogwash and bullshit.
FACT, Bama had 6 players commit that were not in its traditional footprint. Nearly 1/4 of its recruits, that pretty damn good. One from Hawaii. Saban is a nationwide recruiter and yes Bama has a big budget for that, but the football team is the budget provider for the entire athletic department at that University. So they can dictate where money is spent to a degree. There is a surplus every year after they take the states minimum, that is used for the University and repaid to the state. That team is actually a money maker for the state of Alabama and its budget, even with Saban's high salary.

As for Rutgers, I didnt say anything about Rutgers, but I did agree with someone. MSU is not Rutgers and that is who I mentioned he could take over today and build a winner in a few years time. we will never get to test this as he will retire at Bama, but his ability to recruit and develop players would make him a winner virtually anywhere. Bama didnt have world class facilities when he got there, but we do now due to his drive to make them so, this include academic facilities he is also key in developing. He pushes education and his players graduate at a high rate, one of the highest in the Nation and tops in the SEC.

SO your issuemwith Saban are really an obsession you have and nothing more. you will find few who agree with you, maybe you can start a club of batshit crazies like yourself and tour the country speaking on the evils of Saban. I am sure you will draw an audienxe someplace. Might I suggest a local mental ward at a hospital.

Newsflash. When Saban came to Alabama as national title winning CFB coach and former NFL coach -- you want to know how many guys in the first two years he signed JUST from the state of Alabama. 33!!!!

The top player they signed out of the conference footprint was a guy ranked 313th overall in 2007. His next season (2008) they signed exactly two guys out of 31 from outside the conference footprint (the top was ranked 220th overall)

What that 2008 class did for Bama was load up on in state talent -- the top 6 recruits Bama signed were from the state and all ranked in the top 100.

2009 -- much of the same. All from the conference footprint with the majority coming from Bama (10 in this class). Best player from out of the conference footprint -- they only had 2 in the whole class -- they were ranked 440th and 689th.

So thru his 1st 3 years at Bama here are the recruiting numbers:

He had one class #3 overall, another class #2 overall.

Out of the 3 classes -- 43 players were signed from Alabama, 6 of those were 5 star recruits and 12 of them were top 100 recruits.

In those 3 classes -- Bama signed 91 recruits. 7 were from out of the conference footprint and the highest ranked was 220th overall. They did have a few JUCO transfers, but I'm not looking up where they grew up, it only lists the community college or prep school.

The top recruits nationally didn't start coming to Bama until the program was already built. Saban didn't step on campus and start recruiting nationally. Almost 90% of his recruits his first 3 years were from the SEC footprint and almost 50% of those players were from Alabama.

So those who think Saban could go to any school and pull in top 5 recruiting classes immediately -- you are out of your mind.

 

[Wamu]

So those who think Saban could go to any school and pull in top 5 recruiting classes immediately -- you are out of your mind.

The only person out of their mind is you. And you've proven it repeatedly. Now by immediately you mean his 1st year @ a big time program? If so no coach in the country (including JH) could do that. If you mean by year 2 or 3. There's no question that he could. How long you gonna keep this asinine crusade of yours up? Seemingly everyone in this thread disagrees w/ your nonsense. Get a clue.

 

[7Samurai13]

The only person out of their mind is you. And you've proven it repeatedly. Now by immediately you mean his 1st year @ a big time program? If so no coach in the country (including JH) could do that. If you mean by year 2 or 3. There's no question that he could. How long you gonna keep this asinine crusade of yours up? Seemingly everyone in this thread disagrees w/ your nonsense. Get a clue.

He's quoting my hyperbole that Saban would pull a top ten class at Rutgers yearone.

 

[Bamabino]

Newsflash. When Saban came to Alabama as national title winning CFB coach and former NFL coach -- you want to know how many guys in the first two years he signed JUST from the state of Alabama. 33!!!!

The top player they signed out of the conference footprint was a guy ranked 313th overall in 2007. His next season (2008) they signed exactly two guys out of 31 from outside the conference footprint (the top was ranked 220th overall)

What that 2008 class did for Bama was load up on in state talent -- the top 6 recruits Bama signed were from the state and all ranked in the top 100.

2009 -- much of the same. All from the conference footprint with the majority coming from Bama (10 in this class). Best player from out of the conference footprint -- they only had 2 in the whole class -- they were ranked 440th and 689th.

So thru his 1st 3 years at Bama here are the recruiting numbers:

He had one class #3 overall, another class #2 overall.

Out of the 3 classes -- 43 players were signed from Alabama, 6 of those were 5 star recruits and 12 of them were top 100 recruits.

In those 3 classes -- Bama signed 91 recruits. 7 were from out of the conference footprint and the highest ranked was 220th overall. They did have a few JUCO transfers, but I'm not looking up where they grew up, it only lists the community college or prep school.

The top recruits nationally didn't start coming to Bama until the program was already built. Saban didn't step on campus and start recruiting nationally. Almost 90% of his recruits his first 3 years were from the SEC footprint and almost 50% of those players were from Alabama.

So those who think Saban could go to any school and pull in top 5 recruiting classes immediately -- you are out of your mind.

You sure spend a lot of time obsessing over what Saban has done. Not your typical man-crush.

 

[Bamabino]

 

[Bandwagonbo2]

Newsflash. When Saban came to Alabama as national title winning CFB coach and former NFL coach -- you want to know how many guys in the first two years he signed JUST from the state of Alabama. 33!!!!

The top player they signed out of the conference footprint was a guy ranked 313th overall in 2007. His next season (2008) they signed exactly two guys out of 31 from outside the conference footprint (the top was ranked 220th overall)

What that 2008 class did for Bama was load up on in state talent -- the top 6 recruits Bama signed were from the state and all ranked in the top 100.

2009 -- much of the same. All from the conference footprint with the majority coming from Bama (10 in this class). Best player from out of the conference footprint -- they only had 2 in the whole class -- they were ranked 440th and 689th.

So thru his 1st 3 years at Bama here are the recruiting numbers:

He had one class #3 overall, another class #2 overall.

Out of the 3 classes -- 43 players were signed from Alabama, 6 of those were 5 star recruits and 12 of them were top 100 recruits.

In those 3 classes -- Bama signed 91 recruits. 7 were from out of the conference footprint and the highest ranked was 220th overall. They did have a few JUCO transfers, but I'm not looking up where they grew up, it only lists the community college or prep school.

The top recruits nationally didn't start coming to Bama until the program was already built. Saban didn't step on campus and start recruiting nationally. Almost 90% of his recruits his first 3 years were from the SEC footprint and almost 50% of those players were from Alabama.

So those who think Saban could go to any school and pull in top 5 recruiting classes immediately -- you are out of your mind.

Wow, in all of that slurping and whining did you once stop to think its been said it takes time to build a program? Newsflash skippy, he took that time and look what he did with just in footprint talent. He built his staff to a more national recruiting staff, getting coaches from all over the country to work for him, guys that have contacts at high schools all over the country. Do you not think he could persuade them to go with him to another University, or build a similar staff somewhere else.Its funny how that thought process doesnt enter your feeble little mind. He didnt just happen on these coaches, they were carefully selected due to their availability and what they bring to the table talent wise and recruiting wise.

08, 09 he had plenty of Scholarships to give because the program was depleted due to sanctions and he cleared more space due to behavioral issues he inherited from the previous coach, who was happy to get warm bodies while under sanctions.the first three classes were a thing of beauty, brought in talent and by year three, depth. The rest is a history Jimbob will never match, you can bank on that.

 

[Bamabino]

We have to simplify it for ThrustMe.

 

[TrustMeIamRight]

Wow, in all of that slurping and whining did you once stop to think its been said it takes time to build a program? Newsflash skippy, he took that time and look what he did with just in footprint talent. He built his staff to a more national recruiting staff, getting coaches from all over the country to work for him, guys that have contacts at high schools all over the country. Do you not think he could persuade them to go with him to another University, or build a similar staff somewhere else.Its funny how that thought process doesnt enter your feeble little mind. He didnt just happen on these coaches, they were carefully selected due to their availability and what they bring to the table talent wise and recruiting wise.

08, 09 he had plenty of Scholarships to give because the program was depleted due to sanctions and he cleared more space due to behavioral issues he inherited from the previous coach, who was happy to get warm bodies while under sanctions.the first three classes were a thing of beauty, brought in talent and by year three, depth. The rest is a history Jimbob will never match, you can bank on that.

Stop with the talk of sanctions and behavioral issues. The reason he signed 91 guys his 1st 3 classes is because the SEC allowed oversigning. And on top of the 'behavioral issues', Bama also suffered more career ending 'injuries' during this time that magically opened up scholarships.

And Bama built the best program doing exactly what I said -- recruiting the SEC footprint. Once they had that base of elite talent, THAT is when the national recruits started to consider Bama. National elite talent aren't traveling across country to play for a rebuild. They want to play with the best. That is why Bama continues to get richer each year.

It is why I said -- if Saban went to a school like MSU now, he'd never get classes like he has had at Bama. Not because he isn't a great recruiter, he is. Because the state of Michigan has never had a year with multiple 5 star recruits in state and has had only 3 since the turn of the century. The conference footprint doesn't have a quarter of the talent the SEC footprint has and the one spot that does (Ohio) has one major university and it is a blue blood -- so you aren't pulling recruits from there unless they don't want them.


If Saban went to Georgia -- I agree he'd be dominate
If Saban went to Texas -- he'd be unreal with the classes he'd bring in
If Saban went to USC or Florida or Florida State -- he'd be just as dominate.


It is the home state/conference base where you get the majority of your team. Think about what you were just bragging about in this past class. Only SEVENTY FIVE percent of your recruits were from the SEC footprint. Think how silly you sound saying that. 'Only 3/4 of your class'. You are proving my point for me.

 

[4down20]

I'm totally clueless as to why Scott Cochran makes more money than some FBS head coaches.

 

[TrustMeIamRight]

You can try and spin however you'd like.

He came into Bama as an established CFB coach. He had NFL experience. The comments here was that Bama recruits nationally. I pointed out how it was the complete opposite of recruiting nationally -- 90% of his 1st 3 classes were from SEC country, 50% were from Alabama ( I didn't look past the 3rd class, so the 4th could be much of the same)

The national recruits started to come when the success came and Bama was loading up with 5 star recruits from their own backyard and the conference footprint -- then it made bringing in the top recruits across the entire country much easier.

It isn't some big secret -- it is human nature. The best players want to play with the best players. The best players want to play with the best teams. It is no different in high school when you see the best of the best going to IMG and Bishop Gorman, etc. It is no different in college with schools like Bama and OSU, etc. It is no different in the pro's in the one league they allow it to happen -- the NBA -- Kevin Durant could have signed anywhere. He signed with Golden State to play with the best. Kevin Love could have blocked any trade, but he accepted going to Cleveland to play with Lebron and Kyrie.