Wiggys Hopes and Dreams

[WiggyRuss]

Except this is total bullshit unless it is old.

Whiteside didn't chase blocks last year, while vastly improving in other parts of his game.
The numbers speak for themself.

old? lol

im pretty sure those rankings came out like last week.

 

[WiggyRuss]

i mean its pretty telling

SI and ESPN definitely make mistakes. But - there rankings are pretty consistent. Thats not by accident. They have Gobert somewhere in the top 20.

They each have Whiteside out of the top 30.

They both seem to agree that Gobert is the pre-eminent big man rim defender in the league

they both seem to agree that Whiteside chases blocks to the detriment of his team.


not much else to be said.

 

[TurnUpTheHeat]

i mean its pretty telling

SI and ESPN definitely make mistakes. But - there rankings are pretty consistent. Thats not by accident. They have Gobert somewhere in the top 20.

They each have Whiteside out of the top 30.

They both seem to agree that Gobert is the pre-eminent big man rim defender in the league

they both seem to agree that Whiteside chases blocks to the detriment of his team.


not much else to be said.

You mean ignored.
Not sure who made your lists, but we all know who the 30 coaches in the NBA are.
Further, those coaches comments were from January when all star voting was being discussed.
Whiteside was better the second half of the season then he was the first.

I'm sure there are other coaches quotes, but those all came up in one simple Google.

Are they lying, wrong, or both?

 

[Shaqdaddy11]

Wiggy is a fucking pussy

 

[TurnUpTheHeat]

@WiggyRuss
So, the list you are using for your standard has Ball higher then Carmelo.
You agreeing with that?

 

[Shaqdaddy11]

I like this thread. From now on I'll only tell wiggy to shut the fuck up in here. That should appease DJ a bit.

 

[HurricaneDij39]

I own this guy so bad mentally.

lol.....it just makes it that much more fun that the Cavs are awesome and the Heat suck.

The funny thing is how it bothers certain posters so much when I make the post "bow down to Wiggy" that they feel an overwhelming need to make up some bogus story about my outside life and my love life. Sometimes it's just too damn easy...

 

[wildturkey]

Here is ESPN- who also just put out there top 100, where they rank, and what they say about each player


14. Rudy Gobert
Stats & Info: Nobody protects the paint quite like Gobert, who contested a league-high 10.2 shots at the rim per game last season. Though Draymond Green won NBA Defensive Player of the Year, it was Gobert who led the league in defensive real plus-minus, finishing with the best mark by any player over the past three seasons.


41. Hassan Whiteside
Stats & Info: Whiteside remains somewhat of an enigma. Though he once again finished in the top five of voting for Defensive Player of the Year, the Heat were still better defensively with him off the floor. On/off court splits can be noisy, but this is now three straight seasons in which Miami's defense has posted a better defensive rating with it's anchor on the bench rather than on the floor.

Once again, this is not true or at the very least, misleading. The defensive rating line up splits are all at team average (5th in the league btw, so damn good) or higher with Whiteside on the floor. His defensive win shares are top 5 in the league as is his personal defensive rating. The one stat that is an outlier is his personal defensive BPM, which is lower than some of his contemporaries. But, as one of your quotes stated, its an on/off measurement and those can be noisy. But that's why smart people don't just rely on one stat when evaluating players. Considering that he has two other stats in his favor and absolutely dominates the 5 man lineups (up to 9 different lineups above team average feature him), it's pretty safe to assume he's a damn good defensive player that makes a huge impact for the Heat. And its further validated when you actually watch the games because the advanced tools match what you see (that is, if you know what to look for, or in your case, even bother to watch a basketball game)

Conversely, the real reason Whiteside should be ranked around where he is, is his offense. All metrics point to him being merely average to subpar...which if you watch the games, also matches. He's dependent on others for the majority of his offense.

 

[bksballer89]

Once again, this is not true or at the very least, misleading. The defensive rating line up splits are all at team average (5th in the league btw, so damn good) or higher with Whiteside on the floor. His defensive win shares are top 5 in the league as is his personal defensive rating. The one stat that is an outlier is his personal defensive BPM, which is lower than some of his contemporaries. But, as one of your quotes stated, its an on/off measurement and those can be noisy. But that's why smart people don't just rely on one stat when evaluating players. Considering that he has two other stats in his favor and absolutely dominates the 5 man lineups (up to 9 different lineups above team average feature him), it's pretty safe to assume he's a damn good defensive player that makes a huge impact for the Heat. And its further validated when you actually watch the games because the advanced tools match what you see (that is, if you know what to look for, or in your case, even bother to watch a basketball game)

Conversely, the real reason Whiteside should be ranked around where he is, is his offense. All metrics point to him being merely average to subpar...which if you watch the games, also matches. He's dependent on others for the majority of his offense.

Don't waste your time. He isn't too smart. I'm almost certain he didn't watch any heat games last year. It is why I don't bother talking to him about the Heat or any other team not named Cleveland. He doesn't watch games from other teams but yet he think he know it all. Can't make it up

 

[wildturkey]

Don't waste your time. He isn't too smart. I'm almost certain he didn't watch any heat games last year. It is why I don't bother talking to him about the Heat or any other team not named Cleveland. He doesn't watch games from other teams but yet he think he know it all. Can't make it up

True. But I'm bored right now and the season is still a month away. If I can't watch lay ups on my TV, I'll just get them debating Wiggy

 

[Shaqdaddy11]

The funny thing is how it bothers certain posters so much when I make the post "bow down to Wiggy" that they feel an overwhelming need to make up some bogus story about my outside life and my love life. Sometimes it's just too damn easy...

You don't have either, todd, so don't flatter yourself.

 

[HurricaneDij39]

Wiggy sure does spend a lot of time analyzing Whiteside...While I give Whiteside more credit than he does (I had him ranked #35), his hatred for Whiteside is starting to rub off on me a little bit...

(Of course I've always hated the Heat anyway)

 

[TurnUpTheHeat]

Once again, this is not true or at the very least, misleading. The defensive rating line up splits are all at team average (5th in the league btw, so damn good) or higher with Whiteside on the floor. His defensive win shares are top 5 in the league as is his personal defensive rating. The one stat that is an outlier is his personal defensive BPM, which is lower than some of his contemporaries. But, as one of your quotes stated, its an on/off measurement and those can be noisy. But that's why smart people don't just rely on one stat when evaluating players. Considering that he has two other stats in his favor and absolutely dominates the 5 man lineups (up to 9 different lineups above team average feature him), it's pretty safe to assume he's a damn good defensive player that makes a huge impact for the Heat. And its further validated when you actually watch the games because the advanced tools match what you see (that is, if you know what to look for, or in your case, even bother to watch a basketball game)

Conversely, the real reason Whiteside should be ranked around where he is, is his offense. All metrics point to him being merely average to subpar...which if you watch the games, also matches. He's dependent on others for the majority of his offense.

Talk about taking @WiggyRuss to the woodshed!
Excellent use of the thread, and chances are he will ignore your post totally, or go back into hiding for awhile.

 

[TurnUpTheHeat]

Wiggy sure does spend a lot of time analyzing Whiteside...While I give Whiteside more credit than he does (I had him ranked #35), his hatred for Whiteside is starting to rub off on me a little bit...

(Of course I've always hated the Heat anyway)

You should hate the Heat.
They ended your season how many years in a row?

 

[DJ]

 

[DJ]

What'd I miss yesterday?

Visiting my dad.

 

[DJ]

You need to get laid, tons-o-fun!

The same could be said for you with your weird obsession with Wiggy and Hurricane.

 

[DJ]

Where SI ranked, what they said, about both players.

15. RUDY GOBERT, JAZZ
While the basketball intelligentsia now unanimously views Gobert (14 PPG, 12.8 RPG, 2.6 BPG) as one of the league’s elite defensive players, numerous statistical measures consider him one of the league’s elite players, period. The NBA’s leading shot-blocker and Defensive Player of the Year runner-up rebounded from a knee injury that marred his 2015-16 season to deliver a career year across the board in 2016-17. The 25-year-old center helped lead the Jazz to their first playoff series win since 2010 and set new career-highs in scoring, rebounds, blocks, and FG% while ranking second league-wide in Win Shares and eighth in both Real Plus-Minus and WARP. All things considered, Gobert was 2017’s biggest All-Star snub.

Gobert’s development as an ultra-efficient pick-and-roll target aided his ascension. Not only did the Stifle Tower improve Utah’s No. 3 ranked defensive efficiency by 6.9 points when he took the court, he upped the Jazz’s improved offense by 4.1 points too. Although his range is strictly tied to the paint and his ball skills are limited, Gobert’s finishing ability and commitment to pursuing second-chance points will make him a key prong in Utah’s team-based approach to replacing Gordon Hayward’s offense. More importantly, Gobert’s proven ability to lead an elite defense, regardless of how many of his teammates might be injured at any given moment, makes him the best reason to believe in Utah’s post-Hayward chances. The Jazz might have lost their top scorer this summer, but they retained their most indispensable all-around player. — BG

34. HASSAN WHITESIDE, HEAT
What makes Whiteside so much of a problem now is the very thing that kept him hovering around the NBA in spite of all his blunders: He’s just an enormous human being. It’s not until you see Whiteside fighting for a rebound against some other, appropriately sized center that his advantage is thrown into stark relief. There are seven-footers, and then there are bouncy seven-footers with a 7’7’’ wingspan. Bigs who otherwise have the size to dominate games in their own right can be seen draped over Whiteside as he goes to his hook shot, hopeless to reach it.

This remains the primary mechanism for Whiteside’s success—and it is considerable. His post moves aren’t especially varied or creative, but they work to a point. His dominance of the defensive glass comes through committed work, though it’s anchored by the fact that Whiteside will always be able to pull in misses that no one else can. Even his defense hinges on his reach. There is both something special about Whiteside’s capacity to alter shots and something limiting in the way he completely relies on it. Something will always be lost when a player like Whiteside turns the ball over as often as he does or hamstrings his team by only wanting to defend in his block-happy way. It’s a testament to his standing, however, that those qualities have become mere caveats. — RM

Gobert isn't a top 15 player. If you believe that, you're crazier than I thought you were.

Back to defending the ratings when they suit your point, but in general bashing them?

 

[DJ]

@WiggyRuss
So, the list you are using for your standard has Ball higher then Carmelo.
You agreeing with that?

I laughed my ass off when I saw that and I love Ball and the Lakers.

Kid hasn't played a regular season game yet.

 

[DJ]

Once again, this is not true or at the very least, misleading. The defensive rating line up splits are all at team average (5th in the league btw, so damn good) or higher with Whiteside on the floor. His defensive win shares are top 5 in the league as is his personal defensive rating. The one stat that is an outlier is his personal defensive BPM, which is lower than some of his contemporaries. But, as one of your quotes stated, its an on/off measurement and those can be noisy. But that's why smart people don't just rely on one stat when evaluating players. Considering that he has two other stats in his favor and absolutely dominates the 5 man lineups (up to 9 different lineups above team average feature him), it's pretty safe to assume he's a damn good defensive player that makes a huge impact for the Heat. And its further validated when you actually watch the games because the advanced tools match what you see (that is, if you know what to look for, or in your case, even bother to watch a basketball game)

Conversely, the real reason Whiteside should be ranked around where he is, is his offense. All metrics point to him being merely average to subpar...which if you watch the games, also matches. He's dependent on others for the majority of his offense.

Wow.