What Should the Cleveland Browns Do With the #2 Pick?

[ATL96Steeler]

No problem, happy to help. I've been following Zeke since his recruitment, and he's special no doubt.

You're right about the Browns' position on RG3, and I tend to agree. You can't deny the guy has the talent to play the position. I think Washington was just a mess in terms of how he was coached. Hue Jackson is a guy renowned for his ability to coach up and get the most from his QBs, and given that he's only 26 I'm fine with building around him, at least for this draft.

Regarding building inside out, I see where you're coming from, and it can be a great way to do so. However, this is what Cleveland has been doing. Last year, there was a point when we were starting three 1st rounders and two 2nd rounders on our OL, and it didn't matter because we lacked the skill players to take advantage. I am an adamant supporter of drafting OL in the mid- to late-rounds, especially when there are so many unquestionably more talented players available at other positions of need. Given how strongly Hue Jackson relies on the running game, Zeke makes perfect sense. Not only is he an elite runner, but he can make up for some of the OL losses with his hyper-elite pass-blocking abilities. He is much more of a sure thing than Buckner, IMO.

I think they already came back with Jack's final medicals and it doesn't look good. They did a final recheck in Indy last week, and reports are that the bone and cartilage from his surgically repaired knee are starting to break away. One source described his knee as a "time bomb". With a pick this high in such an important draft, I don't think you can risk that.

The Lynch movement is very interesting. He's not a top 10 pick, but if Cleveland decides ultimately to move back down again to stockpile more picks (which from what I'm hearing is entirely possible), he might make sense in the late teens. It will be interesting to follow in the next week for sure.

Good post.

You're right, the Browns did have something going on in the trenches for a while...even w/o a QB and consistent (because Josh just couldn't stay on the field) edge threats the Browns were a tough out and you knew they would be a tough out...they just couldn't score enough to beat the top tier teams.

I've been in ATL nearly 20 yrs now...they have been a good case study of this outside in building concept....the Falcons were like 14-2 or 13-3 the year they lost to SF in the NFCCG...that team had Turner the Burner at RB, and it was a heavy playaction pass team when Turner wasn't getting the ball...but, they had the nasty boys Clabo, & Dahl on the right side of that OL, McClure @ C, and Blaylock and Whitfield on the left side...it worked, the only thing missing was an edge rusher opposite Abraham and a WR2.

The FO decided that they needed more firepower on OFC after they went 0-2 in the playoffs...they made the deal for Julio...then got Gonzales, but they started going cheap/young on the OL...they let Dahl go via FA, they released Clabo the following year. McClure retired a couple of yrs later...the new Quinn regime eventually released Blaylock. They made bad draft picks on the interior of the DL...instead of adding to Abraham at DE, the replaced him with Osiumenyora.

They ended up with some great skill position players and would win 10+ games, but when they met up with other playoff teams in JAN...they got pushed around up front and just could never get over the hump.

I agree, Elliott will probably have more impact than Buckner...short term. If Josh Gordon were playing to go with Barnidge, get a WR2 from the draft...Elliott would be more attractive to me, but as built now, not as much. Yes, he is better than what they have, but teams will just load the box, and put RG3 in a lot of 3rd and long.

 

[Across The Field]

Good post.

You're right, the Browns did have something going on in the trenches for a while...even w/o a QB and consistent (because Josh just couldn't stay on the field) edge threats the Browns were a tough out and you knew they would be a tough out...they just couldn't score enough to beat the top tier teams.

I've been in ATL nearly 20 yrs now...they have been a good case study of this outside in building concept....the Falcons were like 14-2 or 13-3 the year they lost to SF in the NFCCG...that team had Turner the Burner at RB, and it was a heavy playaction pass team when Turner wasn't getting the ball...but, they had the nasty boys Clabo, & Dahl on the right side of that OL, McClure @ C, and Blaylock and Whitfield on the left side...it worked, the only thing missing was an edge rusher opposite Abraham and a WR2.

The FO decided that they needed more firepower on OFC after they went 0-2 in the playoffs...they made the deal for Julio...then got Gonzales, but they started going cheap/young on the OL...they let Dahl go via FA, they released Clabo the following year. McClure retired a couple of yrs later...the new Quinn regime eventually released Blaylock. They made bad draft picks on the interior of the DL...instead of adding to Abraham at DE, the replaced him with Osiumenyora.

They ended up with some great skill position players and would win 10+ games, but when they met up with other playoff teams in JAN...they got pushed around up front and just could never get over the hump.

I agree, Elliott will probably have more impact than Buckner...short term. If Josh Gordon were playing to go with Barnidge, get a WR2 from the draft...Elliott would be more attractive to me, but as built now, not as much. Yes, he is better than what they have, but teams will just load the box, and put RG3 in a lot of 3rd and long.

I see what you're saying about Atlanta. They seem like they've been built to have really solid regular seasons but they don't quite have what it takes to get over the hump in the postseason. You do have to have strong OL and DL play, but especially on the OL side, you just don't need to invest premium picks to get top flight performance. Teams like Seattle, New England, and Denver don't spend 3-4 first round picks just on the OL, because it's just not a good use.

Given that Cleveland is in a full rebuild with so many holes, I think going BPA is the way to go. In this case, I think Zeke is far and away the BPA, and he fills a glaring, important hole. He's a major weapon that can be used in a variety of ways. I don't think Gordon will suit up for Cleveland, or any other team again for that matter. However, as teams like New England and Seattle have shown, you don't have to have elite WRs to win. Barnidge is a fantastic pass-catcher at TE, and getting two more young, talented WRs will help tremendously.

There are a variety of different ways Cleveland can go with #8, and it wouldn't shock me at all if they didn't even draft at the slot anyhow. They want as many picks as possible. It'll be exciting as a Browns fan to see how everything unfolds Thursday night.

 

[Tharvot]

This is the first draft in a while that Cleveland has done something I'm happy about in the early going.

 

[ATL96Steeler]

I see what you're saying about Atlanta. They seem like they've been built to have really solid regular seasons but they don't quite have what it takes to get over the hump in the postseason. You do have to have strong OL and DL play, but especially on the OL side, you just don't need to invest premium picks to get top flight performance. Teams like Seattle, New England, and Denver don't spend 3-4 first round picks just on the OL, because it's just not a good use.

Given that Cleveland is in a full rebuild with so many holes, I think going BPA is the way to go. In this case, I think Zeke is far and away the BPA, and he fills a glaring, important hole. He's a major weapon that can be used in a variety of ways. I don't think Gordon will suit up for Cleveland, or any other team again for that matter. However, as teams like New England and Seattle have shown, you don't have to have elite WRs to win. Barnidge is a fantastic pass-catcher at TE, and getting two more young, talented WRs will help tremendously.

There are a variety of different ways Cleveland can go with #8, and it wouldn't shock me at all if they didn't even draft at the slot anyhow. They want as many picks as possible. It'll be exciting as a Browns fan to see how everything unfolds Thursday night.

I used ATL only because I see them every week along with PIT and just how differently the teams are built...we could basically say the same thing for SD...even in their heyday.

OL...we agree here...I'm not a huge proponent of OT in the top 10 unless they are plug and play and not many are...1 great OL and 4 mediocre ones will probably result in a mediocre OL...clearly you need talent, but every OL needs many reps as a unit to perform well in a game consistently....coaching is also major factor...PIT OL was in shambles...they hire a HOF OL, former HC in Munchak...with a UDFA at LT& LG, 1st rd @ C, RG, and 2nd rd at RT

The big boards I've watch the most still have Buckner ahead of Elliott, but it's close enough for me to buy him as BPA @ 8. I have to admit, I'm more connected with this draft than ever before...I might not see it live, but I will certainly follow it.

Lastly...RG3...I was a big fan of the kid coming in...he has to own a lot of the reasons he is now in CLE instead of his second contract in WAS, but if any coach can get through to him and right the ship...Hue can...now that they have dropped down a few spots, if they can protect him, I expect him to be the starting QB in '17 as well.

ATF...we might not agree on the player to take @ 8, but you made good points...enjoyed the debate.

 

[Across The Field]

I used ATL only because I see them every week along with PIT and just how differently the teams are built...we could basically say the same thing for SD...even in their heyday.

OL...we agree here...I'm not a huge proponent of OT in the top 10 unless they are plug and play and not many are...1 great OL and 4 mediocre ones will probably result in a mediocre OL...clearly you need talent, but every OL needs many reps as a unit to perform well in a game consistently....coaching is also major factor...PIT OL was in shambles...they hire a HOF OL, former HC in Munchak...with a UDFA at LT& LG, 1st rd @ C, RG, and 2nd rd at RT

The big boards I've watch the most still have Buckner ahead of Elliott, but it's close enough for me to buy him as BPA @ 8. I have to admit, I'm more connected with this draft than ever before...I might not see it live, but I will certainly follow it.

Lastly...RG3...I was a big fan of the kid coming in...he has to own a lot of the reasons he is now in CLE instead of his second contract in WAS, but if any coach can get through to him and right the ship...Hue can...now that they have dropped down a few spots, if they can protect him, I expect him to be the starting QB in '17 as well.

ATF...we might not agree on the player to take @ 8, but you made good points...enjoyed the debate.

Pittsburgh is in a great spot though at every other skill position out there, so they don't even need elite OL play in order to succeed, just need Ben under center and you guys are golden.

The big boards do have Buckner ahead of Zeke right now, but a lot of that is position. The reviews of Elliott have been nothing but sparkling, to the point that many of them I see come with the disclaimer that they have to find something to be critical of, regardless of if it's nit-picking, just to give a complete scouting report. Buckner has solid grades, but I haven't heard anything about his abilities as a DE that compare to Zeke's as a RB.

I'm high on RG3. I think it's a case of a guy just needing a change of scenery. Once things started going downhill in Washington they went down fast. Hue Jackson is the kind of coach you want for a QB like RG3, so I'm excited to see what he can do. They do, however, absolutely have to get him weapons at RB or WR or it will be ugly no matter what.

Even though you're a Steelers fan, you're alright in my books. Good chatting, buddy

 

[Across The Field]

This is the first draft in a while that Cleveland has done something I'm happy about in the early going.

I was really happy with what they did with Buffalo a couple of years ago, until they announced what they were doing with the damn picks

 

[HammerDown]

 

[DaBoltsNIsles]

LOL!! Does it really matter what the Browns QB rankings are? They seem to think they have their QB in RGIII. That worked out quite well for Washington.

 

[Across The Field]

LOL!! Does it really matter what the Browns QB rankings are? They seem to think they have their QB in RGIII. That worked out quite well for Washington.

I know, there's never really been an example of a QB playing poorly and then going to another team and playing well, has there?

 

[DaBoltsNIsles]

I know, there's never really been an example of a QB playing poorly and then going to another team and playing well, has there?

We're talking about Cleveland. Good Luck. The Browns are going to need it.

 

[Across The Field]

We're talking about Cleveland. Good Luck. The Browns are going to need it.

We're also talking about Hue Jackson, a guy that turned Andy Dalton into an MVP candidate last year. Not saying RG3 is going to be an MVP, but if anyone can get the most from him, it's Hue.

 

[ATL96Steeler]

Pittsburgh is in a great spot though at every other skill position out there, so they don't even need elite OL play in order to succeed, just need Ben under center and you guys are golden.

The big boards do have Buckner ahead of Zeke right now, but a lot of that is position. The reviews of Elliott have been nothing but sparkling, to the point that many of them I see come with the disclaimer that they have to find something to be critical of, regardless of if it's nit-picking, just to give a complete scouting report. Buckner has solid grades, but I haven't heard anything about his abilities as a DE that compare to Zeke's as a RB.

I'm high on RG3. I think it's a case of a guy just needing a change of scenery. Once things started going downhill in Washington they went down fast. Hue Jackson is the kind of coach you want for a QB like RG3, so I'm excited to see what he can do. They do, however, absolutely have to get him weapons at RB or WR or it will be ugly no matter what.

Even though you're a Steelers fan, you're alright in my books. Good chatting, buddy

Thanks ATF...I'm not all bad....lol

RG3...imo it really depends on how much he's willing to buy in and trust the process. I think he knows Hue believes in him, whereas I never felt Gruden did and the Shanny's were in a tough spot trying to transition him to a pro style OFC under pressure to win.

Even with Elliott, I think the OFC is going to struggle with the playmakers they have outside.

 

[DaBoltsNIsles]

We're also talking about Hue Jackson, a guy that turned Andy Dalton into an MVP candidate last year. Not saying RG3 is going to be an MVP, but if anyone can get the most from him, it's Hue.

Dalton has a lot of talent around him. The Browns need help at so many positions it's scary. Heck one of the Browns starting OL opted out of his contract to get out of Cleveland. The overhaul is underway. Whether they draft the right players remains to be seen.

 

[Across The Field]

Dalton has a lot of talent around him. The Browns need help at so many positions it's scary. Heck one of the Browns starting OL opted out of his contract to get out of Cleveland. The overhaul is underway. Whether they draft the right players remains to be seen.

I don't disagree with you at all. The good thing is, RG3 is still only 26, and Hue Jackson obviously sees the value in surrounding his QB with talent. This draft is integral, but given how the Bengals have been drafting lately, it would seem like Jackson has at least seen the smart way to do it.

 

[Across The Field]

Thanks ATF...I'm not all bad....lol

RG3...imo it really depends on how much he's willing to buy in and trust the process. I think he knows Hue believes in him, whereas I never felt Gruden did and the Shanny's were in a tough spot trying to transition him to a pro style OFC under pressure to win.

Even with Elliott, I think the OFC is going to struggle with the playmakers they have outside.

This right here is possibly the biggest factor. Having coach that clearly supports you can make all the difference. If he earns the starting spot, Hue will do everything he can to ensure he's as successful as possible.

With Elliott, I'm looking at the present and the future. He is going to be an elite back, and could very well be the best back in the NFL by 2018. He's also a high character guy who is a fierce competitor, something we need on Cleveland. If we end up with Buckner, I won't be upset. He would fill a big need on the roster, no doubt. But if you get Zeke and at least 1-2 WRs this year, and use the picks acquired well between now and 2018, this could be a special roster in less time than people think.

 

[jarntt]

Just saw the trade. Eagles gave up alot. Good news for my 49ers. We will not be taking a QB in the 1st rd now. One of the top prospects will fall to us.

Kaep...Is that you???

 

[jarntt]

All the analysts are in agreement that this is one of the deepest drafts in years. Titans and Browns could get multiple longterm starters out of these trade deals if they choose wisely and develop them right.

They are?

 

[ATL96Steeler]

This right here is possibly the biggest factor. Having coach that clearly supports you can make all the difference. If he earns the starting spot, Hue will do everything he can to ensure he's as successful as possible.

With Elliott, I'm looking at the present and the future. He is going to be an elite back, and could very well be the best back in the NFL by 2018. He's also a high character guy who is a fierce competitor, something we need on Cleveland. If we end up with Buckner, I won't be upset. He would fill a big need on the roster, no doubt. But if you get Zeke and at least 1-2 WRs this year, and use the picks acquired well between now and 2018, this could be a special roster in less time than people think.

That's kinda my fear...after a two decades of change, change, change, maybe CLE is getting it right finally. Just about the time Ben will be winding down...but I've seen the Steelers suck too during that gap between Bradshaw and Ben so it won't be the end of the world...just not looking forward to it, another ring on the way out will help smooth over the down time...lol.

Whatever does happen in CLE in the next 2-3 yrs...imo it started with RG3 and this draft...they've got to hit on these picks this yr and the extra ones they have from this trade in '17 & 18.

 

[jarntt]

I don't think either is very special and if the bet was those two versus the field, I think I'd take the field. But, I'm not going to venture a guess on which other QB will be the best when all is said and done.

 

[Across The Field]

That's kinda my fear...after a two decades of change, change, change, maybe CLE is getting it right finally. Just about the time Ben will be winding down...but I've seen the Steelers suck too during that gap between Bradshaw and Ben so it won't be the end of the world...just not looking forward to it, another ring on the way out will help smooth over the down time...lol.

Whatever does happen in CLE in the next 2-3 yrs...imo it started with RG3 and this draft...they've got to hit on these picks this yr and the extra ones they have from this trade in '17 & 18.

Couldn't agree more, except for that "another ring" nonsense. You guys have enough already.