This team needs a new coaching staff in the worst way

[CowboyB]

I

This season, the expectations were a lot higher

I don't think those were fair expectations though. Lots of holes coming into the season and the known fact of not having Bell. Big Ben being hurt is what is hurting them the most aside from the defense. I don't think he is 100%.

 

[ATL96Steeler]

That he's a bust? No, that's common knowledge for years. But Tomlin persisted in starting Jones for years, with better options behind him.

Why does someone we had already decided isn't getting a new contract next year starting and getting more playing times than a man behind him twice his competence?

I don't think it really matters who starts, it's who gets the most snaps should have the most impact on the game...LY Harrison got more snaps than Jones. Clearly Harrison wore down as the season went on...I think part of the reason to start Jones this year was to preserve a 38 y/o player...it just made sense.

Now at 4-5 Jones has zero sacks, and Harrison has played well the last two games...with 7 games to go and battling for their playoff lives...Tomlin is putting his best player out there to start the game, Jones will spell him...this makes sense.

This is not a big deal to me, they will still rotate. If Jones were being benched, it would be note worthy.

 

[ATL96Steeler]

I don't think those were fair expectations though. Lots of holes coming into the season and the known fact of not having Bell. Big Ben being hurt is what is hurting them the most aside from the defense. I don't think he is 100%.

I'll address the holes or question marks first, coming into the season.

Edge rusher...Butler got 48 sacks LY and that followed a terrible yr by LeBeau's DEF...clearly it was pressure by committee...no player in dbl digits...replicating that was always a question.

CB...the projected starters were two 2nd yr guys and the vet Gay

S...Golden was a 1st yr starter, but he's been in the system for a several yrs and had plenty of snaps LY...he earned the job.

TE...Heath Miller was a stud for a nearly a decade...FA pickup and 2nd yr player projected to be the main players

RB...Bell out 3 games to start, Williams proved to be a very capable back up. That was never a concern.

Expectations.

I thought this was a 11-5 type roster and no worse than a 3 seed but really thought a 2.

Of the 5 losses, PIT was the favorite in 3 of them...@ PHI, @ MIA, DAL....I projected them to be 6-3 thru 9

Of the 7 remaining games...@CLE, @IND, NYG, @BUF, @CIN, BAL, CLE...none of those teams are clearly better than the Steelers...@ BUF and @ CIN I projected them to lose.

Now I know fans of teams often have blinders on but I've tried to be reasonable with expectations.

Even at 4-5 now, 9-7 is acceptable, but if they don't finish at least 10-6...they have underachieved imo.

 

[Ojb81]

How much would a coaching change hinder Ben's prime years? Does that set him back 1-2 years? I think I'd rather Tomlin change some philosophy, tighten his hold on the team, and demand more of everyone. See where that takes you. I don't want to start over. Yet.

Just imagine what the team will be like if Tomlin and cadre are still around after Ben retires/goes to another team

 

[Ojb81]

Do the Rooneys fire people??

Trust me, Mike Tomlin is not the problem. Yes the two point conversion is a microcosm but definitely not the reason.

Stop listening to the media. Didn't the election teach y'all something

Tomlin has been here for 10 freaking years now. This team is not trending towards being known as one of the "elite's" again; this roster has shown that they CAN get after it when they play well in spurts, we need a new voice commanding that locker room to push them over the top.

 

[Ojb81]

IMO '16 was one of his best coaching jobs since he's been in PIT...5 games w/o Ben starting...3-2 I think...they were 4-4 at one point, won 6 of 8 to close...made the playoffs, won a game on the road, and had a chance to beat DEN on the road.

This season, the expectations were a lot higher...and 4-5 right now is not sitting well.

On the draft...Kevin Colbert is the GM and effectively the main man. He has always worked very closely with the HC and even the position coaches carry a fair amount of input...they have several good picks in Tomlin's tenure, but the big sticking point has been pass rusher and many (including me) think Tomlin hand picked Jarvis Jones who dropped considerably...didn't do much at the combine, his pro day was not great, but his tape was and that sold Tomlin...he's been a bust as the 17th overall. CB has been a problem as well.

They were never going to rebuild the DEF in one or two drafts, but time is ticking on Ben's career and that obviously creates pressure to speed it up. They are better, but clearly not a SB caliber DEF yet. Not all his fault, but Tomlin has to own that....any HC has to.

Even if they don't make the playoffs, Tomlin probably won't be the guy to go. I could see some position coaches changing, maybe a coordinator.

lets be honest, we didn't "win one on the road" in the playoffs; the bengals imploded, we have them to thank for being able to move onto Denver like we did. had a 15 point lead and it was pretty much blown until the bengals decided to hand it right back

 

[ATL96Steeler]

lets be honest, we didn't "win one on the road" in the playoffs; the bengals imploded, we have them to thank for being able to move onto Denver like we did. had a 15 point lead and it was pretty much blown until the bengals decided to hand it right back

True...gift, but shit happens...lol

 

[CowboyB]

Tomlin has been here for 10 freaking years now. This team is not trending towards being known as one of the "elite's" again; this roster has shown that they CAN get after it when they play well in spurts, we need a new voice commanding that locker room to push them over the top.

I remember hearing that about Tom Coughlin. The Rooneys are a class and have one of the most historically successful franchises because of their commitment to their people. He'll get that team turned around. You just need to level your expectations and have some patience.

 

[Ojb81]

I remember hearing that about Tom Coughlin. The Rooneys are a class and have one of the most historically successful franchises because of their commitment to their people. He'll get that team turned around. You just need to level your expectations and have some patience.

Yeah and eventually Coughlin got what was coming to him, a pink slip. I seriously doubt Tomlin turns things around, this team hasn't been good for a long time now. Again, he's been here 10 years already, the Rooneys have given him more than enough time to get this team's course set for great things. The Steelers now have Tomlin's stamp on everything; there are none of the "old guard" players remaining on this roster, save for Ben. This team doesn't have the toughness to take wins away from other teams, their offense is way too soft to go the distance in the playoffs, and I don't even have to bring up the disappointments of this defense the last couple seasons. Hell, they're now Baltimore's little brother, they consistently push around the Steelers when the two teams play each other, which is absolutely unacceptable. Just because the Rooney's are a "class act", doesn't mean that they can't properly review the performances of their key employees, i.e. the front office and coaching staff. Tomli's message/presence has grown stale, he has little/no impact on the players' growth and team development. Heck, he might even go to another team and have some initial success, wouldn't shock me. But his time here seems to be done to me.

 

[CowboyB]

Yeah and eventually Coughlin got what was coming to him

Before that he won 2 Super Bowls is the point and many argue it was a dumb decision for the Giants to let him go.

this team hasn't been good for a long time now.

Again, I think you need to curve your expectations. They were 10-6 last year following an 11-5 year. They have had some setbacks this year which have derailed them no doubt but to say the team hasn't been good for a long time is entirely inaccurate.

their offense is way too soft to go the distance in the playoffs, and I don't even have to bring up the disappointments of this defense the last couple seasons.

This is an entirely different tune we heard from around the league before their offensive line took hit after hit. Again, you just need to curve your expectations and understand the Steelers have had to deal with countless injuries to their offense so their should be expected decline in results.

front office and coaching staff.

As a fan you have to be able to separate the two. Tomlin has been doing a very good job with the cards he has been dealt.

Tomli's message/presence has grown stale, he has little/no impact on the players' growth and team development.

When you're in the locker room you will have the credibility to say something like that.

 

[Ojb81]

Before that he won 2 Super Bowls is the point and many argue it was a dumb decision for the Giants to let him go.


Again, I think you need to curve your expectations. They were 10-6 last year following an 11-5 year. They have had some setbacks this year which have derailed them no doubt but to say the team hasn't been good for a long time is entirely inaccurate.



This is an entirely different tune we heard from around the league before their offensive line took hit after hit. Again, you just need to curve your expectations and understand the Steelers have had to deal with countless injuries to their offense so their should be expected decline in results.


As a fan you have to be able to separate the two. Tomlin has been doing a very good job with the cards he has been dealt.


When you're in the locker room you will have the credibility to say something like that.

everything you just typed is ridiculous fanboy nonsense; what, are you tomlin's kid brother or something? how often do you watch the steelers? I'm guessing maybe you've not watched them since the superbowl vs Arizona in '09?? better coaches have been fired for less in this league, tomlin's "standard" simply isn't good enough. the more time passes, the more it becomes clear to me that our prior defenses' rosters were influenced largely by our previous coach, as the defensive drafts/free agents under tomlin's stewardship have been pretty much crap. what, did gm colbert all of a sudden forget how to scout/select defensive players? lol, yeah, right. cut back expectations?? ha! i EXPECT my team's leadership to be able to put together seasons where we can compete to be among the best in the league, if not THEE best, especially given that they currently have players that have shown that when they are focus/disciplined/motivated, they can be VERY good.

coughlin's last 5-6 years were largely terrible, save for the superbowl the giants pulled out of their ass during the 2011 season, the giants were well within reason to cut his ass.

 

[Bridgeburner]

@Ojb81 ... how does your opinion change "if" the Steelers win the Super Bowl this year?

With Ben and that offense, if they get into the post season (deservedly or not) they stand a chance. Would you still opine that they are still pointed in the wrong direction long term? Just caught lightning in a bottle? Or would you revise your opinion?

Not a trick question. Like I said, I'm on the fence.

 

[ATL96Steeler]

@Ojb81 ... how does your opinion change "if" the Steelers win the Super Bowl this year?

With Ben and that offense, if they get into the post season (deservedly or not) they stand a chance. Would you still opine that they are still pointed in the wrong direction long term? Just caught lightning in a bottle? Or would you revise your opinion?

Not a trick question. Like I said, I'm on the fence.

PIT needs to fix some things very quickly to get into the dance, but I agree they can be a dangerous team if they do. Imo aside from Heyward, these are fixable things...we'll see what Dupree can bring down the stretch in terms of pass rush, but Butler needs to stay the course and keep bringing the heat, force the QB to make quicker decisions...let these CBs play man when they bring heat, and Mitchell can play better than he has...just prevent 6.

The final 7 games are winnable.

 

[thedddd]

Unfortunately I don't see Tomlin or Haley leaving anytime soon. As long as Ben is playing and healthy I don't see the Rooney's upsetting the applecart.
As for the Defense I can see them making wholesale changes as the scapegoat (ehh..actually not scapegoat but most of the actual blame) outside the horrible defensive drafts.