The Cavs without Lebron

[Shaqdaddy11]

A direct quote from ESPN:

"Coming into Monday night, the 76ers and Brooklyn Nets were tied for the worst record in the league at 7-22, a paltry .241 winning percentage. Meanwhile, the Cleveland Cavaliers rested LeBron James for the second night of a back-to-back after he had played 40 minutes on Christmas Day. The Cavs were summarily waxed 106-90 by the Detroit Pistons.

What’s the correlation between the cellar-dwelling Sixers and Nets and the defending champs? The loss dropped Cleveland’s record to just 4-18 in games in which James didn’t play since the start of the 2014-15 season, when he returned for a second stint with the franchise. That’s a winning percentage of just .182.

That’s right. Without James, the Cavs play worse than the worst teams in the league."

So can we please put this "Cavs are a super team" to rest?

 

[Black Adam]

I see where you're coming from, but as i said yesterday you've technically got a 3 superstar combo. the record isn't taken into consideration imo...

not trying to argue, just putting it out there...

 

[Shaqdaddy11]

I see where you're coming from, but as i said yesterday you've technically got a 3 superstar combo. the record isn't taken into consideration imo...

not trying to argue, just putting it out there...

Just saying. How can a team be considered a 'super team' when it heavily relies on one single player?

 

[Black Adam]

Just saying. How can a team be considered a 'super team' when it heavily relies on one single player?

WILL give it to you that they seem to be a tad above microwaved horse manure without LeClown in the line-up...

 

[gordontrue]

Many of those games, the Cavs also rested other players. Most of those games were on the road at the end of a b2b.

I'm not saying the record isn't bad and shouldn't be better. But comparing it to a teams overall record is silly, imo. Do you expect other teams would have a great record in games played on the road in a back to back without their best player?

 

[broncosmitty]

Many of those games, the Cavs also rested other players. Most of those games were on the road at the end of a b2b.

I'm not saying the record isn't bad and shouldn't be better. But comparing it to a teams overall record is silly, imo. Do you expect other teams would have a great record in games played on the road in a back to back without their best player?

Super teams?

Yeah.

 

[gordontrue]

Super teams?

Yeah.

The Warriors are the only team I could imagine having a winning record on the road in b2b's without their best player. Even for them I think it would be tough.

Which further supports my assertion that the Warriors are the only super team.

 

[Shaqdaddy11]

Many of those games, the Cavs also rested other players. Most of those games were on the road at the end of a b2b.

I'm not saying the record isn't bad and shouldn't be better. But comparing it to a teams overall record is silly, imo. Do you expect other teams would have a great record in games played on the road in a back to back without their best player?

Possibly not a great record. But not a terribly abysmal 4-18 record like the cavs have since lebron came back.

 

[Shaqdaddy11]

The Warriors are the only team I could imagine having a winning record on the road in b2b's without their best player. Even for them I think it would be tough.

Which further supports my assertion that the Warriors are the only super team.

IF they win the title. No team is a super team without at least 3 championships.

But then again that's my opinion.

 

[gordontrue]

Possibly not a great record. But not a terribly abysmal 4-18 record like the cavs have since lebron came back.

Yeah, that's fair.

 

[Shaqdaddy11]

Yeah, that's fair.

Look for once i'm not completely ripping the cavs and lebron. My point of this whole post is that the cavs need to sort out some serious shit looking at those stats. It's clear that the team is one lebron-injury away from not making the playoffs.

IMO a team is in serious trouble if they rely that heavily on one player.

 

[gordontrue]

Look for once i'm not completely ripping the cavs and lebron. My point of this whole post is that the cavs need to sort out some serious shit looking at those stats. It's clear that the team is one lebron-injury away from not making the playoffs.

IMO a team is in serious trouble if they rely that heavily on one player.

The Warriors have their firepower spread out between 4 superstar players. The Cavs have their firepower largely directed into 1 individual, with a couple additional dashes of firepower in 2 other guys.

The 2 teams are fundamentally different in that way. I don't think there's anything the Cavs could - or even should - do to try to change that. They have what they have.

It comes with disadvantages, aka they pretty much forfeit games when LeBron rests and they are definitely 1 LeBron injury away from dropping out of contention. It also places a huge burden on LeBron. He can't have an off game. But it also comes with advantages. When the Cavs and Warriors face each other, the Cavs are the team with the best player on the court. When it comes down to 1 moment - on either end of the court - the Cavs have the guy most likely to make the biggest impact.

 

[Shanemansj13]

Super teams can win without their best player or without one of their all-star caliber players. I understand Lebron is the most important player by far but this is not super team bc they rely heavily on one player

 

[trojanfan12]

Just saying. How can a team be considered a 'super team' when it heavily relies on one single player?

How did the Showtime Lakers do when Magic didn't play?

In basketball, one player can make all the difference, even when there are other all-star caliber players on the team.

A teams record without it's best player doesn't matter when that player is only missing a game or 2 here and there.

I'd expect that if the Cavs were faced with losing Lebron for a significant period of time, they would adjust how they played, make some tweaks to their system, etc. and they would still make the playoffs if they were to lose him for the rest of the season.

I'd also bet that, in that type of situation, Lue wouldn't experiment with lineups as much as he does when Lebron only sits for a game. He'd pick a rotation and stick to it for consistencies sake.

 

[Shanemansj13]

Look for once i'm not completely ripping the cavs and lebron. My point of this whole post is that the cavs need to sort out some serious shit looking at those stats. It's clear that the team is one lebron-injury away from not making the playoffs.

IMO a team is in serious trouble if they rely that heavily on one player.

Usually that is the case, but Lebron has been blessed of never having a serious injury and them resting him is actually a great gameplan. While they won't get the best record for home-court advantage it keeps him sharp and well-rested which is a huge key since they rely on him so heavily.

 

[Shaqdaddy11]

How did the Showtime Lakers do when Magic didn't play?

In basketball, one player can make all the difference, even when there are other all-star caliber players on the team.

A teams record without it's best player doesn't matter when that player is only missing a game or 2 here and there.

I'd expect that if the Cavs were faced with losing Lebron for a significant period of time, they would adjust how they played, make some tweaks to their system, etc. and they would still make the playoffs if they were to lose him for the rest of the season.

I'd also bet that, in that type of situation, Lue wouldn't experiment with lineups as much as he does when Lebron only sits for a game. He'd pick a rotation and stick to it for consistencies sake.

Yes, but at the end of the day we're talking about ONE player turning the team from the best in the Conference to the worst. I highly doubt losing Magic would do the same to the Showtime Lakers.

 

[Shaqdaddy11]

Usually that is the case, but Lebron has been blessed of never having a serious injury and them resting him is actually a great gameplan. While they won't get the best record for home-court advantage it keeps him sharp and well-rested which is a huge key since they rely on him so heavily.

Which is exactly what the team should be doing.

 

[broncosmitty]

The Warriors are the only team I could imagine having a winning record on the road in b2b's without their best player. Even for them I think it would be tough.

Which further supports my assertion that the Warriors are the only super team.

I agree.

If we label the current Champs as a SuperTeam, we'd have to go back and do that for a majority of Championship Teams historicly. Obviously LBJ is better than most every champs best player, but most had several high quality second and third options to the level of Kyrie and Love, or better.

 

[trojanfan12]

Yes, but at the end of the day we're talking about ONE player turning the team from the best in the Conference to the worst. I highly doubt losing Magic would do the same to the Showtime Lakers.

It did though. Magic was out for a significant period of time in 1980-81. They ended up a 3rd seed and lost in the 1st round of the playoffs. Magic was back by then, but very, very rusty.

They also got swept by the Pistons after they lost him in the finals looking to 3-peat.

Point is, even on a super team, if they lose their best player, it is going to severely hinder their chances at success.

 

[fishinabarrel]

How did the Showtime Lakers do when Magic didn't play?

In basketball, one player can make all the difference, even when there are other all-star caliber players on the team.

A teams record without it's best player doesn't matter when that player is only missing a game or 2 here and there.

I'd expect that if the Cavs were faced with losing Lebron for a significant period of time, they would adjust how they played, make some tweaks to their system, etc. and they would still make the playoffs if they were to lose him for the rest of the season.

I'd also bet that, in that type of situation, Lue wouldn't experiment with lineups as much as he does when Lebron only sits for a game. He'd pick a rotation and stick to it for consistencies sake.

Did players sit out for rest back in the day? I was a kid but I never remember Jordan, Bird, or Magic sitting out for anything other than injuries. Could be me just remembering the good ole days a little more fondly bc they are the good ole days tho