Game Thread: Sept. 25 vs. San Francisco

[cdumler7]

Just a quick question when it comes to the OL? Could it be more of a system malfunction than that of lack of talent? I look at 3 guys the Seahawks have let walk or traded in Okung, Carpenter, and Unger. All 3 are doing really well with their new teams. All have graded well. So could the issue be more system based that it is not a system set up well for success especially in the passing game? Maybe they are drafting talented players but that talent isn't quite being used the right way. That does happen quite often in this league. It is why you can see a player switch teams and either play at a very high level or those who maybe leave a system that fit them well then go and fail with another team.

I would also say that when it comes to drafting there are some teams that positional coaches have a lot of influence on who they draft. Can't speak for other teams but I do know the Broncos tell their scouts they are looking for a certain type of player. They then gather those names from the scouts and at the end of the year have all their position coaches go to the All-Star games and practices. They are all present for the Combine. Then they are also the ones that work out players. Such as Trevor Siemian was worked out by our QB's Coach and then he is the one that came and told the FO people that we should take a much closer look at this kid because he could be something. Then I know after that they begin to shorten the list and have everybody sit in the room and say a few players that they are willing to pound the table for. This past draft there is a story that Kollar our DL coach spent weeks going up and down the hallway of the Broncos facility saying the name Adam Gotsis. He just fell in love with the kid and said that he could coach this kid to be something special. The FO obviously listened and drafted him in the 2nd round.

So I think the draft is a collection of FO, Scouts, and Coaches all getting together and the best teams are the ones that take all that input and work to find the players that fit well with the coaches and what they like to do system wise. Doesn't mean it always works out but I would rather have that than what we saw this year in Cleveland where they fired scouts who liked Wentz or when you hear that Fischer really didn't want to draft Goff but the FO loved him so he was left with no choice but to take him.

 

[Judge Fudge]

This tidbit (from cbs sports mobile) just came across my phone

" Russell Wilson ankle improveing. SEAHAWKS SHOCKED THAT HE PLAYED VS THE RAMS"

 

[blstoker]

Just a quick question when it comes to the OL? Could it be more of a system malfunction than that of lack of talent? I look at 3 guys the Seahawks have let walk or traded in Okung, Carpenter, and Unger. All 3 are doing really well with their new teams. All have graded well. So could the issue be more system based that it is not a system set up well for success especially in the passing game? Maybe they are drafting talented players but that talent isn't quite being used the right way. That does happen quite often in this league. It is why you can see a player switch teams and either play at a very high level or those who maybe leave a system that fit them well then go and fail with another team.

I don't really think so. Okung was always a very good tackle, it was keeping him on the field that was the issue, as well as the fact he cost more than the other 4 starters on the line combined, skill really wasn't the reason they let him walk. The same for Unger - he was traded due to missing 1/2 of the team's games over 2 years, not because he couldn't play. Carpenter was horrid his first few years in Seattle - but he was really good his last one, it really just took him time.

The biggest issue for Seattle has been turnover along the line. They have had very little consistency with who has been fielded along the 5 positions, year in and year out. Since Carroll took over, there hasn't been one season where the 5 stayed the same - the closest was 2012 & 2013 when 3 players started at least 8 games that started at least 8 games in the same position the year before.

2010 - 1 (Chris Spencer)
2011 - 1 (Russell Okung)
2012 - 3 (Okung, Max Unger, Breno Giacomini)
2013 - 3 (Okung, Unger, Giacomini)
2014 - 2 (Okung, J.R. Sweezy)
2015 - 2 (Okung, Sweezy)
2016 - 1 (Gary Gilliam) - so far.

The theme of Seahawks offensive lines is that they start out really slow, but they usually get better the second half of the season. That's one reason why I am not concerned about the line - it's playing as well as they ever have the first couple weeks (in the PC era), so if they continue to improve the rest of the season they'll be a pretty solid unit by playoff time. Also, the young core of the line is under contract for next year (Glowinski, Britt, Ifedi), so to re-sign Gilliam or Sowell would have the highest retention rate of any season since PC (assuming Ifedi's gets healthy and starts at least 8 games).

 

[Uhsplit]

Just a quick question when it comes to the OL? Could it be more of a system malfunction than that of lack of talent? I look at 3 guys the Seahawks have let walk or traded in Okung, Carpenter, and Unger. All 3 are doing really well with their new teams. All have graded well. So could the issue be more system based that it is not a system set up well for success especially in the passing game? Maybe they are drafting talented players but that talent isn't quite being used the right way. That does happen quite often in this league. It is why you can see a player switch teams and either play at a very high level or those who maybe leave a system that fit them well then go and fail with another team.

I would also say that when it comes to drafting there are some teams that positional coaches have a lot of influence on who they draft. Can't speak for other teams but I do know the Broncos tell their scouts they are looking for a certain type of player. They then gather those names from the scouts and at the end of the year have all their position coaches go to the All-Star games and practices. They are all present for the Combine. Then they are also the ones that work out players. Such as Trevor Siemian was worked out by our QB's Coach and then he is the one that came and told the FO people that we should take a much closer look at this kid because he could be something. Then I know after that they begin to shorten the list and have everybody sit in the room and say a few players that they are willing to pound the table for. This past draft there is a story that Kollar our DL coach spent weeks going up and down the hallway of the Broncos facility saying the name Adam Gotsis. He just fell in love with the kid and said that he could coach this kid to be something special. The FO obviously listened and drafted him in the 2nd round.

So I think the draft is a collection of FO, Scouts, and Coaches all getting together and the best teams are the ones that take all that input and work to find the players that fit well with the coaches and what they like to do system wise. Doesn't mean it always works out but I would rather have that than what we saw this year in Cleveland where they fired scouts who liked Wentz or when you hear that Fischer really didn't want to draft Goff but the FO loved him so he was left with no choice but to take him.

Okung, an average NFL Tackle who was oft injured and never played to his draft status. Jury is out until January to see if Denver got great value in RO. Yet, compared to Sowell, he is worldly.
Unger, above average C who was expensive and becoming injury prone.
Carp, was oft injured, and never played to his draft status. Did not earn a 2nd contract with us. Probably grading out as average at LG.
You didn't mention Sweezy. He is the unique one. The only one of these not a high draft pick and would not have made the final 53 on most clubs. He has not lived up to his contract due to injury.
At the mid point of last year, the OL was playing as good as the Okung, Carp, Unger, Britt was.
I expect similar results later this season.
With that in mind, money and the cap come into play. Okung, Carp, Unger, and Sweezy cost about $19M this year. As a unit those guys were not a top 10 OL. We shell out $5 million of the 5 projected starters this year. If they can grow to play at a similar level as the prior line, I see it as a good way to go to fight this cap driven era.

 

[WizardHawk]

That was fast

 

[Itsmytime]

That was incredibly fast.

 

[WizardHawk]

Less than a minute in to get that monkey off their back with the offensive TD.

 

[HaroldSeattle]

Damn I was watching red zone and missed this awesome start.

 

[Itsmytime]

2nd TD all season! WOOO. Awesome to see Michaels get his first TD ever.

 

[WizardHawk]

Better positioning on that defensive set. Earl needs to have a bounce back game today for sure.

 

[Banned 10x]

When will Fix show the guys at pike place throwing fish? I'll go 2nd quarter

 

[HaroldSeattle]

Flag

 

[SonnyCID]

Michaels first step quickness is insane.

 

[WizardHawk]

Nice to see them get Graham involved early too. So far it's all positive.

 

[HaroldSeattle]

CM running well!

 

[WizardHawk]

Is the line that much improved this week, or is the 9'ers D line just playing that horribly, because something is quite different today.

 

[Itsmytime]

I picked up Michaels in one of my FFB leagues and got laughed at... I'm okay with it

 

[WizardHawk]

Another to Graham over the middle.

Been waiting for this for a long damned time.

 

[WizardHawk]

It's the Michael and Graham show

 

[HaroldSeattle]

Dang Seahawks looking good!