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HOF Ballot Released

Discussion in 'MLB Baseball Forum' started by soxfan1468927, Nov 20, 2017.

  1. MilkSpiller22

    MilkSpiller22 Gorilla

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    true, they wouldn't want a HOF playing again... But if that DID happen, would it really matter?? is it possible to lose your HOF status??

    As to what statistics would be used, i am sure they can figure out a good formula... and before eye test people come in and say egg head numbers blah blah... clear HOFers who pass the eye test will also pass the stats test... that is just what happens...

    But i would put players in groups...

    Group 1. The longevity players.

    Group 2. The Dominant primes

    Group 3. The defensive studs


    and have different measurements for each group... if a player is in multiple groups they get some sort of bonus...
     



  2. soxfan1468927

    soxfan1468927 Well-Known Member

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    I don't know if that would really be a problem. I just don't think the HOF would want that and I think that is why they wait 5 years.

    I guess you could do that, but coming up with a formula that would be agreed upon and the public would accept wouldn't be easy. The HOF is a museum that wants to look good in the public eye so they can make money. So they have to take that into account.

    And thinking about it, if you did have a formula, I guess it wouldn't matter when a player was eligible. They could be playing, already reached one of the requirements, and be considered a HOFer. Maybe just have to wait a year to have their "induction" day.
     
  3. calsnowskier

    calsnowskier Sarcastic F-wad

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    IMHO, there are 6 no-doubters there...

    Bonds
    Clemens
    Maddux
    Thomas
    Biggio
    Piazza

    With 4 that are on-the-fence, but would likely get my vote (and did, IIRC)...

    Glavine
    Bagwell
    Raines
    Trammell

    I am very anti-Morris and Martinez, and luke-warm on Schilling and Mussina at best.

    I glanced at some ballots from the 90s, and there were about 8 future HOFers on each of those ballots as well.
     
  4. soxfan1468927

    soxfan1468927 Well-Known Member

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    Okay so your ballot is full with 2 more guys who you are "luke-warm" on.

    I still don't see the problem as the hall being too inclusive.
     
  5. calsnowskier

    calsnowskier Sarcastic F-wad

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    This years ballot, for example, is not THAT stacked, and IMHO, is only about 8 deep. But just about out every published ballot has 10 names on it.

    There are many voters who I think would vote for as many players as they possibly could. If they were allowed to vote for 15, they would. The 10-Player limit adds structure and HELPS to keep the integrity of the honor. If you not one of the 10 best players of your era, do you really deserve to be in the Hall anyway?
     
  6. soxfan1468927

    soxfan1468927 Well-Known Member

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    I have said I think the problem is going to work itself out. Personally I think there are 11 or 12 players on the ballot worthy of induction. We wouldn't be having this discussion if the voters had already voted in the players I think they should have. I'm currently working on something, going throughout history (starting in 1967) to see how many players I would have voted for each year. I doubt it became a problem until the voters made it a problem.

    But, I still don't find it necessary to upholding the integrity of the honor. We've had the limit for a while, and those players often get in anyway. There were 18 players in 1967 who were eventually inducted even with the 10 player limit. So all I think it does is cause guys to drop off the ballot who should have gotten more consideration. Or it causes voters to vote without integrity (like for someone they may not really think is worthy) just to try to keep someone on the ballot
     
  7. tducey

    tducey Sports discussion

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  8. soxfan1468927

    soxfan1468927 Well-Known Member

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    Only 10 ballots added the last week. 185 in the tracker. 8 days away from the announcement.

    Chipper: 98.4%
    Guerrero: 94.6%
    Thome: 93.5%
    Edgar: 81.1%
    Hoffman: 78.4%


    Mussina: 73.5%
    Schilling: 66.5%
    Bonds: 65.4%
    Clemens: 65.4%
    Walker: 39.5%
    Vizquel: 30.3%
    Manny: 24.3%
    McGriff: 17.3%
    Sosa: 12.4%
    Rolen: 11.9%
    Kent: 11.4%
    Sheffield: 9.7%
    Wagner: 9.7%
    A. Jones: 5.4%


    Damon: 1.6%
    Santana: 1.6%
    Moyer: 0.5%

    Last year, a player needed 23 votes to stay on the ballot. This year it's likely they'll need 22 as there are slightly fewer voters this year. That would mean Rolen looks like he is safe and Kent needs 1 more vote.

    It's not unheard of for a player to get little support early and then eventually get in via the BBWAA. Blyleven is a good example. He didn't crack 20% until his 4th year, and I think Rolen is a victim of the crowded ballot.
     
  9. tducey

    tducey Sports discussion

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    I think Vlad, Thome and Chipper are locks right now. Edgar and Hoffman have the #'s to make it right now but do they keep that up? Will be interesting. I'd like to see Mussina get in but that looks doubtful right now. We find out who makes it on Jan.24, next Wednesday.
     
  10. soxfan1468927

    soxfan1468927 Well-Known Member

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    I think Hoffman is a lock now. Edgar I still say is doubtful. Just based on past voting and how much Hoffman has gained voters compared to Edgar.
     
  11. soxfan1468927

    soxfan1468927 Well-Known Member

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    Announcement tomorrow. 208 ballots in the tracker:

    Chipper: 98.6%
    Guerrero: 94.7%
    Thome: 93.3%
    Edgar: 78.8%
    Hoffman: 76.9%


    Mussina: 70.2%
    Bonds: 64.4%
    Clemens: 64.4%
    Schilling: 63.5%
    Walker: 40.4%
    Vizquel: 30.8%
    Manny: 24.0%
    McGriff: 17.3%
    Kent: 12.5%
    Rolen: 12.0%
    Sosa: 11.1%
    Wagner: 10.6%
    Sheffield: 9.6%
    A. Jones: 6.3%


    Damon: 1.4%
    Santana: 1.4%
    Moyer: 0.5%

    I still believe that Chipper, Vlad, Thome, and Hoffman get in. Edgar just misses out but gets in next year.
     
  12. navamind

    navamind Well-Known Member

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    yeah it's not looking too great for Edgar right now. Hopefully we're wrong.
     
  13. soxfan1468927

    soxfan1468927 Well-Known Member

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    Next year he'll get in. I'm pretty confident in that now. And I don't think any Veteran's Committee players get in next year.
     
  14. calsnowskier

    calsnowskier Sarcastic F-wad

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    Do they even have the vets committee next year?

    After letting Morris in, though, I wonder if those guys are all senile anyway...
     
  15. soxfan1468927

    soxfan1468927 Well-Known Member

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    Yeah "Today's Game Era" meets again just like 2017. Steinbrenner might get in but I don't think anyone else. I'll be interested to see if McGwire is on the ballot again. Seems odd to just throw his name back out there when they just voted on him 2 years ago. Maybe the switch it up and have David Cone, who I was surprised wasn't on the ballot in 2017.
     
  16. tducey

    tducey Sports discussion

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  17. soxfan1468927

    soxfan1468927 Well-Known Member

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    I think Hoffman is a lock and Edgar has barely a chance.
     
  18. StanMarsh51

    StanMarsh51 Well-Known Member

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    In a league where there's something like 1,500 unique players in a given year? Yes
     
  19. calsnowskier

    calsnowskier Sarcastic F-wad

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    [​IMG]
     
  20. StanMarsh51

    StanMarsh51 Well-Known Member

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    So if there are 3,000 unique players in a decade, you think being 11th best isn't HOF worthy because you chose an arbitrary number that they have to be top 10?