Coaching fire watch.

[BTHOtu]

he doesn't recruit well enough for that.

His issues are well known. If his staff doesn't bring in the talent he can't win. His system doesn't work against programs that run traditional smash mouth football.

That's the downfall of spread based teams.......you beat them by destroying them on the LOS. SEC and B1G teams would have a field day against him.

This is also why he wants to coach at the pro level, he doesn't have to recruit. That failed because he relied on his system instead of TALENT which is what wins at that level.

ANY system is only as good as the talent in it.

Chip wouldn't do well outside of Oregon without all that help from Nike

 

[NolePride]

Chip wouldn't do well outside of Oregon without all that help from Nike

I understand the financial support...legal and illegal.

But Nike really has no control over play-calling, conditioning, whatever.

 

[Moab]

Early in the year I thought the 2 Az coaches were toast after this season. It appears now they've both answered the bell...so maybe not

 

[Red_Alert]

Early in the year I thought the 2 Az coaches were toast after this season. It appears now they've both answered the bell...so maybe not

Yeah, they've both pulled out of the nosedive, at least temporarily.

 

[wazzu31]

Chip wouldn't do well outside of Oregon without all that help from Nike

True, but Oregon doesn't produce top talent. Put him at say at LSU or a school who always attracts defensive talent and he'd be fine. He could find any wide receiver down south to come run his offense.

 

[WizardHawk]

First of all, the ducks under Kelly had kids coming in from all over. They used 'recruiting services' (wink wink), but the bottom line is they weren't playing with kids from the NW.

Second, he now has a bigger name than he did back then with the time he spent in the NFL. I mean he spent several years in the NE with the Eagles in a mass media market.

The idea he can't coach outside of the west coast is simply ludicrous. He does need the right school mostly because of his personality (or lack there of). No one knows what he would do coaching in a school that could attract the larger smash mouth kids some believe he can't play against because we haven't seen him have that setup.

His offense isn't new anymore and that was part of their success, however they built that program on the backs of a lot of 3 and 4 star kids. That's coaching.

Do I think Kelly is a top 5 coach? No. But neither is any other coach not in the top 5 right? He's good enough to lead any second tier team in a P5 as long as it's not one where the media would be too much in his face.

 

[WestEndVol]

 

[Eco]

Yeah, they've both pulled out of the nosedive, at least temporarily.

Todd Graham may be able to lose out the rest of the year and keep his job. Dude has beaten Oregon, Utah, and Washington.

I think we have a good chance against USC this weekend in the desert, and we still play Colorado in the desert, then go UCLA, Oregon State and then the pussy cats.

So 2 wins mean we go bowling, and I could see him potentially getting 4.

 

[lilchi721]

I don't know if they're a rich enough school to handle Bielema's absurd buyout. Won't they owe him like $15 mil?

No his buyout is much cheaper than 15 million it's around 5.9 million according to the Arkansas Democrat.

 

[starbigd]

First of all, the ducks under Kelly had kids coming in from all over. They used 'recruiting services' (wink wink), but the bottom line is they weren't playing with kids from the NW.

Second, he now has a bigger name than he did back then with the time he spent in the NFL. I mean he spent several years in the NE with the Eagles in a mass media market.

The idea he can't coach outside of the west coast is simply ludicrous. He does need the right school mostly because of his personality (or lack there of). No one knows what he would do coaching in a school that could attract the larger smash mouth kids some believe he can't play against because we haven't seen him have that setup.

His offense isn't new anymore and that was part of their success, however they built that program on the backs of a lot of 3 and 4 star kids. That's coaching.

Do I think Kelly is a top 5 coach? No. But neither is any other coach not in the top 5 right? He's good enough to lead any second tier team in a P5 as long as it's not one where the media would be too much in his face.

His system is predicated on speed, not size

He made that clear in the NFL when he dumped talented players for his guys, that were small and fast and.......routinely overpowered

Chip believes in his SYSTEM. That will never work at the NFL level. It can work in college but the players he recruits, or rather, his coaches recruit for him won't come from the east coast primarily. This is why he needs to stay on the west coast......unless he makes hay in Florida, Georgia and Texas, which is highly doubtful, he should just stick to what he knows.

 

[WizardHawk]

His system is predicated on speed, not size

He made that clear in the NFL when he dumped talented players for his guys, that were small and fast and.......routinely overpowered

Chip believes in his SYSTEM. That will never work at the NFL level. It can work in college but the players he recruits, or rather, his coaches recruit for him won't come from the east coast primarily. This is why he needs to stay on the west coast......unless he makes hay in Florida, Georgia and Texas, which is highly doubtful, he should just stick to what he knows.

We have all kinds of new inventions that actually allow people to recruit from the west coast without actually living anywhere near the west coast. You might want to look into some of them.

Seriously, leach runs a narrow system offense and requires a lot of smaller/faster kids and he had success at TT (not on the west coast). I could give you other examples, but that one is easy. What any of those offensive guys need is a top notch solid DC with a scheme that fits their league. Kelly sort of had that with Aliotti and his retirement was really why that defense went to complete shit. Your offensive minded guys need the right guy on the other side of the ball. Spread schemes exist all over the game. Kelly's at least is heavy on running which translates pretty much anywhere.

The B1G isn't on the west coast. They have teams that run spread or otherwise could handle Kelly's schemes. There are also struggling teams in the other P5's that would get an upgrade with him. I mean he took a historically shitty program and put them on the map. That can be done at other historically shitty locations.

 

[starbigd]

We have all kinds of new inventions that actually allow people to recruit from the west coast without actually living anywhere near the west coast. You might want to look into some of them.

Seriously, leach runs a narrow system offense and requires a lot of smaller/faster kids and he had success at TT (not on the west coast). I could give you other examples, but that one is easy. What any of those offensive guys need is a top notch solid DC with a scheme that fits their league. Kelly sort of had that with Aliotti and his retirement was really why that defense went to complete shit. Your offensive minded guys need the right guy on the other side of the ball. Spread schemes exist all over the game. Kelly's at least is heavy on running which translates pretty much anywhere.

The B1G isn't on the west coast. They have teams that run spread or otherwise could handle Kelly's schemes. There are also struggling teams in the other P5's that would get an upgrade with him. I mean he took a historically shitty program and put them on the map. That can be done at other historically shitty locations.

You're missing a lot of this.

Kelly isn't really a recruiter......he relies on his staff to do that. It's a hard sell to get a ton of kids from the west coast to go east when they can run the same system where they are.

Kelly's system ran well UNTIL it ran into a team with huge DLs......which is what he'd see in the B1G and SEC. They destroyed his team upfront......which is primarily my point - spread teams run the spread to ATTEMPT to mitigate the lack of talent in key areas.

That isn't going to really work unless he adapts and gets different players. Traditional smash mouth teams will kill him.

Leach runs the same system because Texas has a TON of the same kinds of athletes you find in California. Most Texas kids run 7v7 teams......most of the high schools run the spread. That isn't the case on the east coast.

Chip could try to run his system elsewhere.......but it would be difficult to say the LEAST to be successful. He'd have to have the PERFECT recruiting staff, as well as SC coach, DC, etc.......and he'd have to adjust his scheme to match the talent he'd find locally because he is NOT getting the majority of his roster from across the country. His team will be 80+% LOCAL kids.

That has FAIL written all over it.

 

[Red_Alert]

2013 Alamo Bowl - Wikipedia

 

[WizardHawk]

2013 Alamo Bowl - Wikipedia

There are a lot of people stuck in their misconceptions on the internet. That's a hell of a comeback to countering it right there. Well played.

BTW, where the fuck is @Olyduck ffs? Why the hell am I stuck pointing out stupid failed logic about a duck former HC?

 

[Red_Alert]

You are best to take comment from tejas fans with a grain of salt.

Their delusion is a product of having loads of money and residing in fertile recruiting grounds, coupled with unfathomable under-achievement.

That under-achivement is consistently rationalized and distracted from by downplaying other's successes.

 

[Olyduck]

You're missing a lot of this.

Kelly isn't really a recruiter......he relies on his staff to do that. It's a hard sell to get a ton of kids from the west coast to go east when they can run the same system where they are.

Kelly's system ran well UNTIL it ran into a team with huge DLs......which is what he'd see in the B1G and SEC. They destroyed his team upfront......which is primarily my point - spread teams run the spread to ATTEMPT to mitigate the lack of talent in key areas.

That isn't going to really work unless he adapts and gets different players. Traditional smash mouth teams will kill him.

Leach runs the same system because Texas has a TON of the same kinds of athletes you find in California. Most Texas kids run 7v7 teams......most of the high schools run the spread. That isn't the case on the east coast.

Chip could try to run his system elsewhere.......but it would be difficult to say the LEAST to be successful. He'd have to have the PERFECT recruiting staff, as well as SC coach, DC, etc.......and he'd have to adjust his scheme to match the talent he'd find locally because he is NOT getting the majority of his roster from across the country. His team will be 80+% LOCAL kids.

That has FAIL written all over it.

Kelly lost 7 games as head coach
in 2009 losses to Boise State, Stanford and Ohio State are what started the cant beat bigger teams rumors. it ignores the facts where Oregon also beat teams that did in fact have bigger lines like UW, USC Utah and Oregon State. for the record USC Utah and Oregon State were all top 20 when they played Oregon.
2010 1 loss was Auburn. by 3. Oregon's "offense" minded team held Auburn to their second lowest points all season where they played in the SEC. Oregon's offense did stuggled some but not entirely. as for the rest of the season Oregon beat Tenn, UW, Stanford, Arizona and USC which all had bigger lines. (off the top of my head as I remember it)
2011 2 losses to USC and LSU but again beat UW, Stanford Arizona State and Wisconsin.
2012 only 1 loss to Stanford but beat ranked Arizona, Washington, USC Oregon State and Kansas State

losing 2 or 3 to teams that fit that description is what got Oregon the rep for it but they beat more teams that had bigger/ stronger D lines than they lost to in the Kelly years.

 

[Olyduck]

You're missing a lot of this.

Kelly isn't really a recruiter......he relies on his staff to do that. It's a hard sell to get a ton of kids from the west coast to go east when they can run the same system where they are.

Kelly's system ran well UNTIL it ran into a team with huge DLs......which is what he'd see in the B1G and SEC. They destroyed his team upfront......which is primarily my point - spread teams run the spread to ATTEMPT to mitigate the lack of talent in key areas.

That isn't going to really work unless he adapts and gets different players. Traditional smash mouth teams will kill him.

Leach runs the same system because Texas has a TON of the same kinds of athletes you find in California. Most Texas kids run 7v7 teams......most of the high schools run the spread. That isn't the case on the east coast.

Chip could try to run his system elsewhere.......but it would be difficult to say the LEAST to be successful. He'd have to have the PERFECT recruiting staff, as well as SC coach, DC, etc.......and he'd have to adjust his scheme to match the talent he'd find locally because he is NOT getting the majority of his roster from across the country. His team will be 80+% LOCAL kids.

That has FAIL written all over it.

as for the whole SEC and BIG thing Kelly was as OC and HC was 4-1 against BIG and 1-2 against the SEC. and being destroyed his losses to those team were by 9, 3, and 13.

 

[NolePride]

True, but Oregon doesn't produce top talent. Put him at say at LSU or a school who always attracts defensive talent and he'd be fine. He could find any wide receiver down south to come run his offense.

I believe that.

There is no rule that says you can't play smash mouth defense and run a spread offense
predicated on speed.

In 1993, we used the "Fast Break Offense." No huddle...basically running our 2-minute
offense for the entire game. At the same time we had one of the best DC in the game
in Mickey Andrews and plenty of speed there also.

We averaged 41 ppg...We gave up 9 ppg.

In those days we always had at least 1 scat back and 1 big back. The big guy would wear
on you and when the DL tired in would come the scat back to take advantage of those
tired legs.

Granted we had the perfect QB to operate that system, Charlie Ward, but even after he left
we still prospered. Danny Kannell did a good job in the fast break, which was probably
as close to the modern day spread as you can get. Just didn't have the large line splits.

 

[Deep Creek]

There is no rule that says you can't play smash mouth defense and run a spread offense
predicated on speed.

It can be done but the HC has to be willing to put the defense on the field a lot more. That's why a lot of coaches don't want to use it. They actually play defense with their offense. Wait until the play clock is below 5 to snap it. Avoid incomplete passes or runs out of bounds that stop the clock, etc. In fact, some of them would prefer NOT to break a run for a TD on the first play because the defense has to go back out on the field too son! Playing that way can makes for some real good looking overall defensive stats.

 

[WizardHawk]

See, now that's what I was talking about. No one does chip kelly legacy defense quite like @Olyduck


Now I can go wash the funk off from even trying to myself.