AJ McCarron

[GNG]

A bit disingenuous of a statement. The Bengals are heavily committed to Dalton financially and have been since Dalton arrived. There has never been a chance given to McCarron to "beat out" Dalton.

You cannot "win" a job if you were never given a chance to do so.

McCarron played very well during his stint as their starter in 2015, and won a playoff game vs Pittsburgh (something Dalton has never done) before his RB/defense had the worst collection of compounded mistakes I can remember (at least recently) in a post-season game. En route to a total meltdown in the final two minutes. lol

McCarron proved himself to be a very intriguing QB prospect during his stint in 2015 as Cincinnati's starter... that's pretty much the beginning and end of that conversation.

McCarron looks like a career backup QB.

 

[GNG]

Those aren't the 2 options being debated. The trade already happened. It's about what to do next.

That said both signing McCarron and trading for smith are both stupid ideas.

Signing McCarron would be a stupid idea.

 

[Niner Outlaw]

I think the Skins have made their bed at QB. They've chosen Smith, so signing McCarron is likely out of the question. Smith is the safer choice by far and he's got a much better resume than McCarron. BUT, if the team had known for sure that McCarron would be a FA would they have still traded for Smith?


The Browns bungled the trade for McCarron last year, but will they want him now that he's a FA? If they sign him as the starter, would they still use the #1 overall pick for a QB? That seems unlikely, but this is the Browns we're talking about.

 

[Skins2021]

Yeah. Because signing someone (maybe a little bit cheaper) who has done nothing in 5 years vs. a proven starter and stop gap makes sense. Mike Glennon/TJ Yates 2.0.

The way QB contracts are going these days it wouldn’t completely shock me if McCarron got a bigger contract than Smith.

We would be just as well off rolling with AS and developing some Me th chest few years.

but trading a 3rd, Fuller, and signing a proven AVERAGE qb at age 34 makes sense? treading water if not slipping a bit.

guess you are cool with 7-9, 8-8 type records

We know what Smith is. Everyone knows what smith is. Mccarron on the other hand costs less $ and equity and being unproven at least opens a door to him being a franchise QB even if its only 10% likely whereas Smith has proven to be a fringe franchise qb for 10 nfl seasons.

 

[Sportster 72]

but trading a 3rd, Fuller, and signing a proven AVERAGE qb at age 34 makes sense? treading water if not slipping a bit.

guess you are cool with 7-9, 8-8 type records

We know what Smith is. Everyone knows what smith is. Mccarron on the other hand costs less $ and equity and being unproven at least opens a door to him being a franchise QB even if its only 10% likely whereas Smith has proven to be a fringe franchise qb for 10 nfl seasons.

You might want to be careful waving that dumb flag around.

 

[Sleepy T]

but trading a 3rd, Fuller, and signing a proven AVERAGE qb at age 34 makes sense? treading water if not slipping a bit.

guess you are cool with 7-9, 8-8 type records

We know what Smith is. Everyone knows what smith is. Mccarron on the other hand costs less $ and equity and being unproven at least opens a door to him being a franchise QB even if its only 10% likely whereas Smith has proven to be a fringe franchise qb for 10 nfl seasons.

That’s your opinion and your entitled to it. What he may or may not accomplish here is pure conjecture on all of us.

This much I know. Smith’s experience is something to consider. He has averaged about 9 wins a season throughout his career. Cousins wasn’t any better. And enough with the team he had. Some people act like this is done star studded defense and cast he has had for years.

And sure..we know what Smith is. He is solid, yet unspectacular..just like Cousins was. We all know what McCarron has been, at least yup yo this point. A career backup who hasn’t been able to beat out Andy fucking Dalton. Dude has played in 7 games and thrown for less than 1000 yards in 4 years!!!

You keep throwing out the $$$ thing. Be careful and wait until Mccarron signs with someone before you determine who is getting more bang for their buck. I have a feeling that once the FA dust settles, Smith’s contract will look pretty damned good to us.

 

[Skins2021]

You might want to be careful waving that dumb flag around.

hahaha i've seen your posts around here. I dont want to say I'm referring to you and fans like you... but I'm referring to you and fans like you.

I've been following these boards for over 15 years dating back to ESPN with posters like shark, gk, skinsdad, goldenster, arbusman, fletch, reptec, laz, 767, bovey, b-man, skinsfaninatla, socal, the skins fan in arizona, etc.

I was also a poster on espn as well... i forget my handle probably something to do with Cooley or Sean Taylor.

 

[Skins2021]

That’s your opinion and your entitled to it. What he may or may not accomplish here is pure conjecture on all of us.

This much I know. Smith’s experience is something to consider. He has averaged about 9 wins a season throughout his career. Cousins wasn’t any better. And enough with the team he had. Some people act like this is done star studded defense and cast he has had for years.

And sure..we know what Smith is. He is solid, yet unspectacular..just like Cousins was. We all know what McCarron has been, at least yup yo this point. A career backup who hasn’t been able to beat out Andy fucking Dalton. Dude has played in 7 games and thrown for less than 1000 yards in 4 years!!!

You keep throwing out the $$$ thing. Be careful and wait until Mccarron signs with someone before you determine who is getting more bang for their buck. I have a feeling that once the FA dust settles, Smith’s contract will look pretty damned good to us.

Cousins carried this team on his back. In spite of shitty wr play, average at best defense, the worst starting running back in the NFL, a ridiculous amount of injuries, a coach that sends mixed signals by benching him for not being careful with the ball and then later criticizing him for not taking enough risks despite throwing for 4000 + yards, and the constant DC/media circus.

Its like you havent even watched him play. He is incredibly accurate and drops dimes. He's sneaky athletic and has a very quick release. There is more of an argument to be made that he is UNDERRATED.

He's by far the best skins QB of my life time.

Skins go 4-12 last year with Alex Smith instead of Cousins.

 

[Sleepy T]

Cousins carried this team on his back. In spite of shitty wr play, average at best defense, the worst starting running back in the NFL, a ridiculous amount of injuries, a coach that sends mixed signals by benching him for not being careful with the ball and then later criticizing him for not taking enough risks despite throwing for 4000 + yards, and the constant DC/media circus.

Its like you havent even watched him play. He is incredibly accurate and drops dimes. He's sneaky athletic and has a very quick release. There is more of an argument to be made that he is UNDERRATED.

He's by far the best skins QB of my life time.

Skins go 4-12 last year with Alex Smith instead of Cousins.

Sure. He’s the best QB this franchise has had in a long while, won’t disagree with that. He isn’t exactly going against stellar competition in that regards. And I’ve watched him play plenty, he’s a solid QB won’t deny that. But, prior to this year he had arguably the best receiving corps in the league, so if that argument is good for Smith, then it is good for KC as well. Funny how his production seemed to drop off a bit after Pierre and DJax left huh??

Many other people feel that Smith is as good or better, executives, former players, people that are in the middle of football their whole lives. So don’t act like the select group of “dumb” posters on this the board are the only ones who feel this way. Smith 4-12, laughable.

At the end of the day... he gone. Alex Smith is our QB so get over it and quit crying about the FO. Just settle in and hope for the best, cause Bruce prolly isn’t going anywhere fast and Danny will die owner.

 

[Sharkinva]

Sure. He’s the best QB this franchise has had in a long while, won’t disagree with that. He isn’t exactly going against stellar competition in that regards. And I’ve watched him play plenty, he’s a solid QB won’t deny that. But, prior to this year he had arguably the best receiving corps in the league, so if that argument is good for Smith, then it is good for KC as well. Funny how his production seemed to drop off a bit after Pierre and DJax left huh??

Many other people feel that Smith is as good or better, executives, former players, people that are in the middle of football their whole lives. So don’t act like the select group of “dumb” posters on this the board are the only ones who feel this way. Smith 4-12, laughable.

At the end of the day... he gone. Alex Smith is our QB so get over it and quit crying about the FO. Just settle in and hope for the best, cause Bruce prolly isn’t going anywhere fast and Danny will die owner.

I will simply say this...

They are going to give Smith everything they either didnt give Kirk, or took away from him last year. By that I mean


1. Total support and they wont be betting against him
2. real talent at WR and RB, because I dont think they roll into the season with two projects at WR and hoping a 3rd down back can carry the load.

So in the end its not about what Smith would have done with the injured and talent lacking roster we had last year. Its going to be, does the team IMPROVE since Smith is a better QB and I expect they will give him the talent. They wanted Kirk to prove he could carry the team, I dont think they are going to expect that from Smith.

 

[gkekoa]

Huh?

Smith's 4 playoff appearances in KC...

2017: 28th in total defense
2016: 24th in total defense
2015: 7th in total defense
2013: 24th in total defense


He had a top ten defense once... and a bottom ten defense three times. In 2016, he also had the 15th ranked rushing offense.

2013- #5 scoring defense
2015- #3 scoring defense
2016- #7 scoring defense
2017- #15 scoring defense...so once

Scoring defense is what matters. It is about scoring more points than allowed...not gaining more yards.

And once outside 5he top ten in rushing because they lost Jamal Charles.

 

[Sleepy T]

I will simply say this...

They are going to give Smith everything they either didnt give Kirk, or took away from him last year. By that I mean


1. Total support and they wont be betting against him
2. real talent at WR and RB, because I dont think they roll into the season with two projects at WR and hoping a 3rd down back can carry the load.

So in the end its not about what Smith would have done with the injured and talent lacking roster we had last year. Its going to be, does the team IMPROVE since Smith is a better QB and I expect they will give him the talent. They wanted Kirk to prove he could carry the team, I dont think they are going to expect that from Smith.

Wow... as I believe Stymie put it a few days ago. A lot of hedging going on here lately wrt CBC.

Cmon Shark. Enough with the conspiracy theory stuff. This KC thing has been spiraling out of control for a couple years now. While I don’t doubt the FO was never sold on KC as our LT QB, I don’t think they necessarily sabotaged him either. The defense was priority and we swung and missed badly on Pryor. That is kinda what it sounds like you are saying??

 

[Sleepy T]

2013- #5 scoring defense
2015- #3 scoring defense
2016- #7 scoring defense
2017- #15 scoring defense...so once

Scoring defense is what matters. It is about scoring more points than allowed...not gaining more yards.

And once outside 5he top ten in rushing because they lost Jamal Charles.

And if KC had a RB or Defense (hell, even a mediocre one), he might not have had to throw it 600 times a season and his stats wouldn’t be quite as good, but his record may have been better?? This can be spun so many different ways. Quit looking at the stat sheet and watch the games gk. KC and AS are equals....

 

[Sharkinva]

Wow... as I believe Stymie put it a few days ago. A lot of hedging going on here lately wrt CBC.

Cmon Shark. Enough with the conspiracy theory stuff. This KC thing has been spiraling out of control for a couple years now. While I don’t doubt the FO was never sold on KC as our LT QB, I don’t think they necessarily sabotaged him either. The defense was priority and we swung and missed badly on Pryor. That is kinda what it sounds like you are saying??

I will simply ask, do you think the front office supported the last QB??

I think just as Cousins bet on himself the past three seasons, Bruce was trying to hedge his bet.

If Kirk fails, he can walk away clean and say see I was right.
If Kirk carried he team to the playoffs, he could try to tag and trade him.
The real issue is, Kirk did well enough to get paid well, but not well enough to risk going into this season with no backup plan should he try to tag and trade him.

I dont think Bruce wanted him to succeed. thats not conspiracy, its my opinion based on how Bruce has dealt with him the past three years.

 

[Sportster 72]

hahaha i've seen your posts around here. I dont want to say I'm referring to you and fans like you... but I'm referring to you and fans like you.

I've been following these boards for over 15 years dating back to ESPN with posters like shark, gk, skinsdad, goldenster, arbusman, fletch, reptec, laz, 767, bovey, b-man, skinsfaninatla, socal, the skins fan in arizona, etc.

I was also a poster on espn as well... i forget my handle probably something to do with Cooley or Sean Taylor.

Slim you have been running around here telling everyone you are going to be an Eagle fan because you live near Philly. You have a Jets and Redskins logo under your name and you haven't been saying many things that make good football sense. So I say again, I would be careful waving that dumb flag around .... and I get it, most here are fans. That does not mean you understand the game and how it is played.

 

[Skins2021]

Slim you have been running around here telling everyone you are going to be an Eagle fan because you live near Philly. You have a Jets and Redskins logo under your name and you haven't been saying many things that make good football sense. So I say again, I would be careful waving that dumb flag around .... and I get it, most here are fans. That does not mean you understand the game and how it is played.

pretty inexcusable that there were fans out there the last season or 2 that werent 100% behind Cousins, especially given the QB play the last 25+ years.

K.C. being the long term franchise qb getting what he deserves should have been backed 100%. Not supporting cousins pretty much makes those fans complicit with the incompetence in the Skins FO and almost justifies the decisions made by those morons.

 

[skinsdad62]

i do love how the SDFC has for 3 years dissected every play KC has gone through from OTA 's to mini camps , to TC , to preseason games to the regular season and playoffs and then want to talk about "this KC stuff has been spiraling out of control for years " that BS has contributed to it ?

all the people proclaiming we should "move on " didnt move on for 3 damn years so maybe a damn look in the mirror is in order

so for as long as i want to dish it out you are stuck with it and maybe next time when you constantly want to fall on your sword about a topic you can reflect on these days and think better of it but dont play some BS " i am above the fray crap " and expect i will just let it go .

as long as i have my blood pressure pills , and a shot of viagra i am in it for as long as i feel its needed

some real honesty about the true motives would certainly aid the healing process and then maybe i will ease up on steve deberg light

 

[Fountain City Blues]

Huh?

Smith's 4 playoff appearances in KC...

2017: 28th in total defense
2016: 24th in total defense
2015: 7th in total defense
2013: 24th in total defense


He had a top ten defense once... and a bottom ten defense three times. In 2016, he also had the 15th ranked rushing offense.

I am going to politely point in the direction of DVOA here:

Unweighted DVOA by year in KC just for fun; bolded being playoff years

2013: 9th
2014: 19th
2015: 6th
2016: 14th
2017: 30th

Weighted

2013: 14th
2014: 20th
2015: 2nd
2016: 14th
2017: 32nd

Only once did he have a bottom ten D- this past year; which was without Ford, Berry, while Johnson and Parker had fallen off a cliff; then overextending role players such as Daniel Sorenson.

Other footnotes:

2013 had both primary edge rushers in Hali and Houston get hurt in the later part of the year, and Houston again in the playoff game; fueling a... undesirable set of circumstances that led to critical failure against the Colts.

2014: bad run D, lacked CB's; Sean Smith was a 1 man crew there. PPG was mostly deceiving though the passrush may have masked issues. This was Houston's 20+ sack season. Derrick Johnson tore his achilles the first time this year. Their primary ILB was an entity called Josh Mauga after week 1. Ron Parker emerged, but at CB he was overmatched at times.

2015: Jaye Howard (this was pre-hip injury) broke out while several players broke out and mostly stayed healthy. Houston unfortunately had Ron Parker leg whip him and compromised his ACL. Hali begins to show additional age as Dee Ford flounders. Marcus Peters and Sean Smith played their only year together. Curiously, Houston plays a playoff game with a compromised (see stretched) ACL and is... a non factor against the Texans and Patriots predictably.

2016: Justin Houston misses most of the season and isn't quite the same but still pretty good when he returned. Hali looks done, but fortunately Ford emerges to cover slack. Derrick Johnson tears his achilles again late in the season leaving Ramik Wilson and special teamer DJ Alexander (Probowler!) at ILB; the latter was so bad in an upset loss to the Titans at home the Chiefs benched him for a creature called Terrance Smith. Steven Nelson quietly has a decent year in the slot, but is up and down. Sean Smith leaves for Oakland. Jaye Howard also has a hip injury. Allen Bailey also accumulates injuries. Terrance Mitchell weirdly looks dominant the past month of the season to hide issues at CB. Jaye Howard is later cut. Chris Jones looks like a stud however.

2017: Houston is back to elite form, but Ford and Berry are hurt immediately; with Ford not being effective when on the field, injury or not. Steven Nelson has a core muscle surgery and misses about half the season, does not look nearly as good as in 2016. Derrick Johnson fails to recover from a 2nd achilles tear, and looks very JAGish. Ragland emerges as a two down thumper, but plugs in a dam. Ron Parker has his most ineffective year as a Chief. At this point, there Chris Jones, Houston, and Peters along with a couple JAGS are not a defense make. Ragland is useful, however.

2013-2016 you can reasonable argue were good defenses independent of their PPG and yardage even if circumstance keeps them out of the top 10. 2017 and 2015 are completely indisputable in their terribleness and excellence (sans the playoffs where their megastar Edge was compromised) respectively.

The 15th ranked offense in 2016 had Spencer Ware. Ware was 10th in scrimmage yards despite missing 2 games with a concussion at 1,368 yards. In scrimmage yards per game, Ware was 8th. In YPC, Ware had a 4.30 YPC and a 4.62 career mark. The Chiefs were also... 21st in rushing attempts in 2016.

 

[Sportster 72]

pretty inexcusable that there were fans out there the last season or 2 that werent 100% behind Cousins, especially given the QB play the last 25+ years.

K.C. being the long term franchise qb getting what he deserves should have been backed 100%. Not supporting cousins pretty much makes those fans complicit with the incompetence in the Skins FO and almost justifies the decisions made by those morons.

I can't speak for other cities but there has always been the next best QB on the roster. Way back probably before you time when the Sonny vs. Billy debate went on. I don't disagree about Cousin's he should have been signed long term but everyone is entitled to be wrong. I think in two years most will feel differently but until that happens it is what it is.

There were folks here that said he hit his peak and couldn't get better. WRONG!! There were folks here that said he couldn't extend a play or run with the ball. WRONG!! This city has never watched a QB get paid a shit ton of money and some are balking at it.

Now they are paying one turd less than a shit ton of money to the guy who I think was the best NFL choice if they let Cousin's walk We'll see what happens. With what they saved they can sign one Terrell McClain type player.

 

[richig07]

He’s given the chance everyday. The best player plays. See the Seahawks with wilson

Lol... Okay. Nevermind.

I had no idea you were so naive.

There's no such thing as 100 million dollar financial commitments being valued... there's no such thing as coaching staff's sticking with "franchise QB's" who they were previously committed to.

See the Seahawks with wilson

I don't get it... Is this where I am supposed to point out the numerous examples in my favor?

Also, Flynn's deal was a fraction of what Dalton's was.

To suggest McCarron did not play well enough to garner a lot of interest, is absurd.

2-1 Record
66.7 CMP%
854 Yards
6 TD's
2 INT's
97.1 QB Rating