2018 Draft...way too early talk

[Yo Tee]

As Face said above, none of the CBs in this draft are game changers.

We don't need a game changer. We need someone that is a sponge and can soak up all the advice and knowledge from our vets. We drafted Artie Burns because he was the next best at that position. Look where that has gotten us with Burns. We need to go up and get someone in the first round. Out of the last 5 drafts, we've selected an LB in the first round 4 of those 5 and 1 of them isn't on the team anymore and Dupree has been hit or miss. Burns was a miss as well. So we've only made a good pick in the first round 2 of the last 5 years. Watt and Shazier. Need to go up and get what and who we want.

 

[FaCe-LeE-uS]

Trading into the top 15 would allow us to get a prime talent in our secondary while giving up what? A 2nd, 3rd and 4th? I'm willing to make that trade. We also have 2 5ths and 2 7ths. Trade away a 2nd, a 4th and a 5th. I don't care. We need young talent in the secondary. There are two or 3 guys that would be worth it. Obviously, Minkah Fitzpatrick is the best available but I don't see us trading into the top 10 to get him. But Joshua Jackson from Iowa, Denzel Ward from Ohio State, Donte Jackson from LSU, Mike Hughes from UCF and Carlton Davis from Auburn are the next best 5 and are all projected as possible 1st round talents. We need one of those guys or else we just muffed this draft when it comes to our secondary.

I'm thinking it would require multiple picks in the 2nd or 3rd combined with our 1st Rd pick. Whether they are this year or next. Doubt anyone would consider a package with a 4th, 5th or 7th to get into the top 15. But if they did, I wouldn't mind giving up those late round picks. Don't see that happening though. If I were going to trade that much ammo I would much rather get a gamechanger like ILB's Roquan Smith or Rashaan Evans.

 

[FaCe-LeE-uS]

I still just don't think the secondary players in the 1st Rd of this year's draft are anything particularly special. I wouldn't give up any draft picks for them. Not even for Minkah Fitzpatrick.

The talent behind the top players is just as good and arguably equal.

 

[Yo Tee]

I'm thinking it would require multiple picks in the 2nd or 3rd combined with our 1st Rd pick. Whether they are this year or next. Doubt anyone would consider a package with a 4th, 5th or 7th to get into the top 15. But if they did, I wouldn't mind giving up those late round picks. Don't see that happening though. If I were going to trade that much ammo I would much rather get a gamechanger like ILB's Roquan Smith or Rashaan Evans.

So you want to address our porous secondary in the 2nd round? Here's a question, why don't the Steelers ever trade up in the draft? Last time we traded up in the first round, we got Santonio Holmes and look how wonderfully that turned out for us. SB hero!

3 players the Steelers should consider trading up for the in the NFL draft

I would be fine with trading up for Derwin James, but we don't need another LB in the first round. Address the need and the need is with our Corners and Safeties.

 

[FaCe-LeE-uS]

So you want to address our porous secondary in the 2nd round? Here's a question, why don't the Steelers ever trade up in the draft? Last time we traded up in the first round, we got Santonio Holmes and look how wonderfully that turned out for us. SB hero!

3 players the Steelers should consider trading up for the in the NFL draft

I would be fine with trading up for Derwin James, but we don't need another LB in the first round. Address the need and the need is with our Corners and Safeties.

We don't need a LB in the 1st Round? You serious? The secondary isn't as porous as our run defense proved to be without Shazier. You don't seem to understand that the secondary is hung out to dry when the LB's aren't doing their job. Defensive philosophies all center around stopping the run 1st, then creating pressure. You can't create pressure when the opposing offense is running the ball consistently. You have to force them to pass. And if they do pass and you don't create pressure, then the secondary has to carry the weight. The defense finished 1st in the NFL in sacks so the pressure was good overall, but not on possession downs. I don't care if your defense is producing 10 sacks a game, if they aren't stopping offenses on 3rd downs then your winning a losing battle.

 

[Yo Tee]

We don't need a LB in the 1st Round? You serious? The secondary isn't as porous as our run defense proved to be without Shazier. You don't seem to understand that the secondary is hung out to dry when the LB's aren't doing their job. Defensive philosophies all center around stopping the run 1st, then creating pressure. You can't create pressure when the opposing offense is running the ball consistently. You have to force them to pass. And if they do pass and you don't create pressure, then the secondary has to carry the weight. The defense finished 1st in the NFL in sacks so the pressure was good overall, but not on possession downs. I don't care if your defense is producing 10 sacks a game, if they aren't stopping offenses on 3rd downs then your winning a losing battle.

I am serious. We don't need a LB first round. We need another Sean Davis on this squad. We can address the LB need in the 2nd round. Or, crazy thought here...we trade up and address both in the first round! Whoa! Crazy concept!

 

[Yo Tee]

We don't need a LB in the 1st Round? You serious? The secondary isn't as porous as our run defense proved to be without Shazier. You don't seem to understand that the secondary is hung out to dry when the LB's aren't doing their job. Defensive philosophies all center around stopping the run 1st, then creating pressure. You can't create pressure when the opposing offense is running the ball consistently. You have to force them to pass. And if they do pass and you don't create pressure, then the secondary has to carry the weight. The defense finished 1st in the NFL in sacks so the pressure was good overall, but not on possession downs. I don't care if your defense is producing 10 sacks a game, if they aren't stopping offenses on 3rd downs then your winning a losing battle.

Also, we sucked against the run even when Shazier was on the field. 4 games giving up over 130 yards rushing before Shazier got hurt, and that includes over 200 yards rushing against the Bears and Jacksonville. 6 out of the last 7 games, including the playoff game, we gave up over 210 yards passing and throughout the entire season, 10 of the 18 games we played, we gave up over 200 yards passing. So 55% of the time, we are giving up over 200 yards passing.

When it comes to rushing, we only allowed 100 yards rushing in a game 7 times which includes in each of the last 3 games. So 38% of the time, we are giving up 100 yard rushing efforts.

We need defensive help. I think our secondary needs to be addressed first and foremost but any PREMIUM talent on defense is obviously welcome. But I really wish we would try and reach for someone special instead of settling for whoever falls to us.

 

[FaCe-LeE-uS]

Also, we sucked against the run even when Shazier was on the field. 4 games giving up over 130 yards rushing before Shazier got hurt, and that includes over 200 yards rushing against the Bears and Jacksonville. 6 out of the last 7 games, including the playoff game, we gave up over 210 yards passing and throughout the entire season, 10 of the 18 games we played, we gave up over 200 yards passing. So 55% of the time, we are giving up over 200 yards passing.

When it comes to rushing, we only allowed 100 yards rushing in a game 7 times which includes in each of the last 3 games. So 38% of the time, we are giving up 100 yard rushing efforts.

We need defensive help. I think our secondary needs to be addressed first and foremost but any PREMIUM talent on defense is obviously welcome. But I really wish we would try and reach for someone special instead of settling for whoever falls to us.

Fair points. Shazier isn't the only solution. He was more of a jack-of-all-trades type playmaker. He dropped into coverage more than simply defending the run. That's why we say V-Will is upgradable. They need to get better on the front 7 overall. The D-line is good but capable of playing much better. Tuitt sort of disappeared last season. I know he was hurt a lot, but when on the field his impact was debatable. We need better contributions across the board. But remember when the D-line wasn't as good as it was now, yet the run defense was solid? That's because of Lawrence Timmons. That guy was a stalwart in the run game.

 

[FaCe-LeE-uS]

I am serious. We don't need a LB first round. We need another Sean Davis on this squad. We can address the LB need in the 2nd round. Or, crazy thought here...we trade up and address both in the first round! Whoa! Crazy concept!

I would be ok with a FS in the 1st Rd. I'd prefer the LB, but wouldn't be upset with a FS. If they can pull off a couple trade scenarios to get them two 1st Rd picks in this draft then I would be amazed. But I doubt it will happen.

Why they rarely trade in the 1st Rd, you asked... Because, as history has shown, the Rooney's & Colbert value quantity over quality. IMO they basically view the draft as a gambling process. They like to increase their odds of success with greater numbers. It really is exciting when they do trade in the 1st Rd because not only is it rare but they have a good history of acquiring amazing talent when they do. They have only traded UP in the 1st Rd three times in the Colbert era (Holmes, Polamalu & Hampton). And they haven't traded OUT of the 1st Rd since 1968. Their draft trade history is far more lengthy when you look at Rds 2-4. They've been burned numerous times doing that under Colbert. Aside from Kendrell Bell, Mike Wallace & Antonio Brown, trades for Ricardo Colclough, Anthony Smith, Willie Reid, Dan Sepulveda, Tony Hills, Ryan Mundy, Kraig Urbick, Alemeda Ta'Amu, Shamarko Thomas, etc etc have all resulted in failure. That isn't including trades for personnel. Gets even uglier when you look at those transactions.

 

[Ewa PGH Fan]

Trading into the top 15 would allow us to get a prime talent in our secondary while giving up what? A 2nd, 3rd and 4th? I'm willing to make that trade. We also have 2 5ths and 2 7ths. Trade away a 2nd, a 4th and a 5th. I don't care. We need young talent in the secondary. There are two or 3 guys that would be worth it. Obviously, Minkah Fitzpatrick is the best available but I don't see us trading into the top 10 to get him. But Joshua Jackson from Iowa, Denzel Ward from Ohio State, Donte Jackson from LSU, Mike Hughes from UCF and Carlton Davis from Auburn are the next best 5 and are all projected as possible 1st round talents. We need one of those guys or else we just muffed this draft when it comes to our secondary.

They don't have a 4th round pick or is it a 3rd. It was traded away for McDonald I believe. They also don't have a 6th round pick either. That's why trading up for them really isn't an option, they only have a total of 7 picks and 2 of them are 7th rounder's. While it would be great, the price for them to trade up into the top 15 is just too steep this year. It would be great if they had the extra picks to move up but they can't. I'm also not a fan of moving out of the 1st round for extra picks either. They need a Day 1 game changing starter at ILB, not sure that will be available in round 2.

Plus whether you like the talent or not Burns, Hilton and Sutton are all young guys. What do they have left at ILB, Dirty Red who had off season shoulder surgery and may or may not be good to go by the start of the season and V. Williams who is a liability against the pass. Also Chikallo and Moats are both UFA. They are dangerously thin at LB right now.

 

[Ewa PGH Fan]

I would be ok with a FS in the 1st Rd. I'd prefer the LB, but wouldn't be upset with a FS. If they can pull off a couple trade scenarios to get them two 1st Rd picks in this draft then I would be amazed. But I doubt it will happen.

Why they rarely trade in the 1st Rd, you asked... Because, as history has shown, the Rooney's & Colbert value quantity over quality. IMO they basically view the draft as a gambling process. They like to increase their odds of success with greater numbers. It really is exciting when they do trade in the 1st Rd because not only is it rare but they have a good history of acquiring amazing talent when they do. They have only traded UP in the 1st Rd three times in the Colbert era (Holmes, Polamalu & Hampton). And they haven't traded OUT of the 1st Rd since 1968. Their draft trade history is far more lengthy when you look at Rds 2-4. They've been burned numerous times doing that under Colbert. Aside from Kendrell Bell, Mike Wallace & Antonio Brown, trades for Ricardo Colclough, Anthony Smith, Willie Reid, Dan Sepulveda, Tony Hills, Ryan Mundy, Kraig Urbick, Alemeda Ta'Amu, Shamarko Thomas, etc etc have all resulted in failure. That isn't including trades for personnel. Gets even uglier when you look at those transactions.

Their draft and trade history before '69 is abysmal. They would routinely trade away 1st round picks for aging vets. They pretty much ignored the draft. We all know the stories of HOF players the Steelers drafted and either cut or never played pre '69. There is a very good reason why they do it this way now!!!

 

[Yo Tee]

There is a very good reason why they do it this way now!!!

And there is a reason why we haven't done shit in the last 7 years. We haven't drafted very well at all. In order to change up our success, we need to change up how we do things.

 

[Ewa PGH Fan]

I don't see how in the world the Steelers could trade ip in the 1st round and get 2 1st round picks?????????

 

[Yo Tee]

I don't see how in the world the Steelers could trade ip in the 1st round and get 2 1st round picks?????????

Future picks. A future first round pick, 2nd and 3rd or a mixture or something. Its possible. But unlikely with this front office. We gotta change up the way we are doing things if we wanna win #7 because what we're doing now isn't working, obviously.

 

[Ewa PGH Fan]

Future picks. A future first round pick, 2nd and 3rd or a mixture or something. Its possible. But unlikely with this front office. We gotta change up the way we are doing things if we wanna win #7 because what we're doing now isn't working, obviously.

No, it's not possible. No one is trading us a future 1st round pick for our 1st round pick and a 2nd and 3rd. We would probably have to give up a future 1st round pick to move into the top 15. And even if someone would crazy enough to do that, 1 pick in the 1st 4 rounds is no way to build a team.

No it's not obvious. Sorry but I'll go with the MO of a FO that has been to 8 SBs winning 6 and not had a losing season since 2003 over your MO. There is a Steeler way of doing things, has been since '69. They aren't changing that anytime soon, no matter what you or any other fan thinks.

 

[Yo Tee]

No, it's not possible. No one is trading us a future 1st round pick for our 1st round pick and a 2nd and 3rd. We would probably have to give up a future 1st round pick to move into the top 15. And even if someone would crazy enough to do that, 1 pick in the 1st 4 rounds is no way to build a team.

No it's not obvious. Sorry but I'll go with the MO of a FO that has been to 8 SBs winning 6 and not had a losing season since 2003 over your MO. There is a Steeler way of doing things, has been since '69. They aren't changing that anytime soon, no matter what you or any other fan thinks.

Who said someone was giving US a future first? We would have to trade future picks away to get in the top 15. Also, I said a mixture of picks to get us 2 first round picks.

Good, no losing seasons since 2003. 3 SB appearances and 2 SB wins. That's fantastic. But we haven't won a SB now in 10 years. We had the most wins in a season since 2004 this year, what did we do? We lost in the first round because we were too cocky to think, "well, if the Jags beat us once, they could do it again."

What is being done now in the organization isn't working. You can win 13 games every season but if you don't at least win a fucking playoff game, it was all for nothing. So, sorry but I'm not with the way things are being done right now. While teams around us are elevating their play and going places and winning championships, we are stuck in our ways while everyone else is passing us by and winning titles and we have older generation fans that are just okay with that and that's just bullshit. It's a settlers mentality that I don't have and never will. Are we Browns fans now?! Do we just settle for a 13-3 season and an early playoff exit because we've won 6 Super Bowls?? Come on now! Are we just gonna do what's "worked since '69" even though there was a period called the 1980's where we were 2-4 in the playoffs and no Super Bowl appearances. There was also a period between 98 and 03 where we had 2 playoff appearances in 6 years and 3 losing records in those 6 years. So no, I'm not buying that this "Steeler way" has worked since '69 because it hasn't "worked since '69" and it isn't now. It worked in the 70's and 90's and this isn't the fucking 70's or 90's. You need to be proactive, not reactive. Pittsburgh has been reactive for far too long. It's time to have the league REACT to us, and not the other way around.

 

[Yo Tee]

The Houston Texans traded from 25th to 12th last year for DeShaun Watson. What did it cost them? Their first round pick and their 2018 first round pick.
The Kansas City Chiefs traded from 27th to 10th last year for Patrick Mahomes III. What did it cost them? Their first and third round pick and their 2018 first round pick.

Projected trades based on looking at recent mock drafts:

The Pittsburgh Steelers trade from 28th to 14th (Packers) for Derwin James (Florida State) or Tremaine Edmunds from Virginia Tech. Give Packers the 28th and our 2nd round pick or our first in 2019.
The Pittsburgh Steelers trade from 28th to 10th (49ers or Raiders) for Roquan Smith from Georgia or Joshua Jackson from Iowa. Give 49ers or Raiders the 28th, a 3rd and our first in 2019.

 

[Yo Tee]

Okay, so since the majority of you wanna stay at 28 and are not willing to think outside the box, who is our pick at 28?

Also, instead of "bullshit" and "facepalm" ratings, talk it out. What's wrong with what I said and how was what I said inaccurate?

 

[SteelersPride]

Okay, so since the majority of you wanna stay at 28 and are not willing to think outside the box, who is our pick at 28?

Also, instead of "bullshit" and "facepalm" ratings, talk it out. What's wrong with what I said and how was what I said inaccurate?

Yeah I don’t get the ratings. Or outside thinking.

 

[Yo Tee]

Yeah I don’t get the ratings. Or outside thinking.

Its because they don't agree and they think my way of thinking is crazy. My way of thinking isn't crazy, it's outside the norm of what the Steelers have done and it's uncomfortable for them to think about doing it. I get it, but like I said, something has to change in how we are doing things.

This is the kind of things that teams do to win and win now. Sign decent free agents, trade up and go get someone in the draft instead of settling for whoever falls to us. Make the moves necessary to win fucking championships. We haven't done that recently.

And instead of talking it out like men, they do the stupid fucking ratings to try and show how stupid I am. Sorry, not stupid, just a different way of thinking. You can disagree and that's fine but don't talk to me like I'm stupid. I'd expect that from other teams' fans, not this one though. Especially not to one of your own.

So, needless to say I'll be a less frequent visitor of the board. This board is stuck in the "Steeler way" of the 70s and 90s. Well, it's 2018, act accordingly.