Game Thread: 03-31-15, Warriors @ Clips 7:30 pst

[GregWarriorsfan]

The Dubs visit the Clips tonight to face their most hated rival on their home turf. I believe the Clippers are up to full speed now with Griffin coming back about a week or so ago. Chris Paul won "player of the week" recently and J.J. Reddick is lighting it up from outside, scoring in the 20s for a number of games in a row.

I'm expecting a tough game despite the fact that the Dubs have been on quite a roll. Hopefully I'll be wrong and the Dubs will win it easily.

Green is listed as a starter in tonight's game tonight. I wasn't sure why he didn't play in their last game, but he's slated to start in tonight's game.

I'll go with the Dubs by 6 over the Clips......110-104.

 

[Montalban]

The Dubs visit the Clips tonight to face their most hated rival on their home turf. I believe the Clippers are up to full speed now with Griffin coming back about a week or so ago. Chris Paul won "player of the week" recently and J.J. Reddick is lighting it up from outside, scoring in the 20s for a number of games in a row.

I'm expecting a tough game despite the fact that the Dubs have been on quite a roll. Hopefully I'll be wrong and the Dubs will win it easily.

Green is listed as a starter in tonight's game tonight. I wasn't sure why he didn't play in their last game, but he's slated to start in tonight's game.

I'll go with the Dubs by 6 over the Clips......110-104.

That is what concerns me for the playoffs. Not so much tonight. The one-seed is already locked up. The Clips wil be a dangerous team in the payoffs.

 

[CitySushi]

Draymond might be out for tonight's game. I don't mind resting him if it's even close to an issue.

 

[GregWarriorsfan]

Yes, I guess after losing to them in last year's playoffs that there is some level of respect for the Clips. But, we are a far different team now than we were last year.

About D. Green, I think his presence really means a lot to the team. What is his injury? I'd never heard that he got injured, but did notice that he'd missed the last game.

 

[GregWarriorsfan]

CSushi,

When will you be making the decision on Green for tonight's game?

 

[CitySushi]

I, err the Warriors, have officially deemed Draymond out for tonight's game. Kerr said if the game meant anything he would play, but with the lead in the West pretty much locked up, he'll probably sit for a game, maybe two.

David Lee starting tonight. He has a big opportunity tonight to show that he can be a factor for the Warriors in the playoffs. With the size in the West, him, Speights and Ezeli are going to be the key for the Warriors moving forward.

 

[Montalban]

Yes, I guess after losing to them in last year's playoffs that there is some level of respect for the Clips. But, we are a far different team now than we were last year.

About D. Green, I think his presence really means a lot to the team. What is his injury? I'd never heard that he got injured, but did notice that he'd missed the last game.

Something with his shin is my understanding.

 

[GregWarriorsfan]

I'm really hopeful for Lee to play well down the stretch and to be a vital part of the playoff run. He's a solid rebounder and he's really good offensively around the basket. He also makes good interior passes. And, he's a solid 6'10".

 

[Montalban]

COuple of things were apparent to me from last night's game. First, the Warriors are the better team and the bench makes the difference. It took 40 points from Griffin just to keep the game close. That leads to the third thing and that is that it is evident now why David Lee has been relegated to the bench in favor of Green; Green would have never given up 40 to Griffin. Lee got his 17 and 8 or whatever but his defense is non-existant.

 

[GregWarriorsfan]

I thought I heard a lot of cheering last night for the Warriors while visiting the Clippers in L.A.

LOS ANGELES -- The Clippers currently are seeded fifth in the Western Conference and are fighting for home-court advantage in the first round of the playoffs, but Blake Griffin doesn't believe home court will be much of an advantage if Tuesday night's 110-106 loss to the Golden State Warriors is any indication.

"If that's how it feels in the playoffs, it's not looking good," Blake Griffin said of playing at Staples Center with Warriors fans cheering Stephen Curry and Klay Thompson
"Home-court advantage is just not there for us," Griffin said after the game. "If that's how it feels in the playoffs, it's not looking good."

Warriors fans made Staples Center sound more like Oracle Arena on Tuesday night. They loudly cheered every made basket by Stephen Curry and Klay Thompson, and chanted "M-V-P" when Curry was at the free throw line, causing several Clippers players to look up into the stands and shake their heads.

"I don't know what we could do, but it would be great if it wasn't that way," said Griffin, who had 40 points in the loss. "It's kind of like when we play the Lakers. I don't know, maybe worse. It's one of those things where it would be great if it wasn't like that."

 

[Montalban]

I'm really hopeful for Lee to play well down the stretch and to be a vital part of the playoff run. He's a solid rebounder and he's really good offensively around the basket. He also makes good interior passes. And, he's a solid 6'10".

Problem is Green does all those things you mentioned better than Lee does. Plus he plays solid defense; something Lee either cannot or will not do..

 

[GregWarriorsfan]

If we stay in the playoffs for as long as it takes, who's to say that Green will always be healthy the entire time. After an 82 game season, we could possibly play 25 or so more games, or almost one-third of another season. I think it's better to have Lee healthy and playing well than for him to not even be on the team.

Also, Lee is a much better scorer than Green on the interior. Green can primarily shoot open threes and make layups.

 

[Montalban]

If we stay in the playoffs for as long as it takes, who's to say that Green will always be healthy the entire time. After an 82 game season, we could possibly play 25 or so more games, or almost one-third of another season. I think it's better to have Lee healthy and playing well than for him to not even be on the team.

Also, Lee is a much better scorer than Green on the interior. Green can primarily shoot open threes and make layups.

I'm not sure I agree with that but I do agree that Lee provides valuable backup for Green. But don't forget about Speights. he has value at that spot as well.

 

[CitySushi]

If we stay in the playoffs for as long as it takes, who's to say that Green will always be healthy the entire time. After an 82 game season, we could possibly play 25 or so more games, or almost one-third of another season. I think it's better to have Lee healthy and playing well than for him to not even be on the team.

Also, Lee is a much better scorer than Green on the interior. Green can primarily shoot open threes and make layups.

The Warriors system makes it so that Lee's iso's or ability to score in the paint are not nearly as valuable as in previous seasons. The Warriors run a motion offense, predicated on passing and floor spacing. This is why Mo Speights has been involved in the rotation, while Lee has ridden the bench.

In addition, Ezeli will be much more valuable against larger teams. The Warriors won't have a problem scoring. It's their defense and limiting second chance points that will be the key for playoff success.

Draymond is superior to everything David can contribute to this team. There's simply no denying that. At this point, Mo is even a better option than David, because Mo can space the floor shooting with the second unit. And Mo's not a defender by any stretch, but he's simply much better than David.

My feeling that unless Draymond or Bogut gets into heavy foul trouble early, Lee will likely be out of the initial rotation in the Playoffs.

 

[GregWarriorsfan]

"Draymond is superior to everything David can contribute to this team. There's simply no denying that. At this point, Mo is even a better option than David, because Mo can space the floor shooting with the second unit. And Mo's not a defender by any stretch, but he's simply much better than David."

This is, of course, wrong. Lee is as good or better at rebounding and his ability to score on the inside is easily better than Green. What would Green do if he got the ball with his back to the goal from 10 feet away? He simply does not have that aspect in his game.

I'm not making any overall judgement that Lee is better than Green. I understand what Green does on defense and that this is the biggest difference between the two. But, to say that Green is superior to Lee in "everything" is simply not correct. I listed above the rebounding as being either equal or in favor of Lee plus Lee's ability to score on the inside. This is a facet that the Warriors do use with Sean Livingston, posting up, so why is it now unimportant if Lee is in the game?

 

[Montalban]

"Draymond is superior to everything David can contribute to this team. There's simply no denying that. At this point, Mo is even a better option than David, because Mo can space the floor shooting with the second unit. And Mo's not a defender by any stretch, but he's simply much better than David."

This is, of course, wrong. Lee is as good or better at rebounding and his ability to score on the inside is easily better than Green. What would Green do if he got the ball with his back to the goal from 10 feet away? He simply does not have that aspect in his game.

I'm not making any overall judgement that Lee is better than Green. I understand what Green does on defense and that this is the biggest difference between the two. But, to say that Green is superior to Lee in "everything" is simply not correct. I listed above the rebounding as being either equal or in favor of Lee plus Lee's ability to score on the inside. This is a facet that the Warriors do use with Sean Livingston, posting up, so why is it now unimportant if Lee is in the game?

But he pointed out that that skill is not very valuable in the style of offense the Dubs now play. Clealry that is true since Green and Speights get the minutes Lee used to get.

 

[GregWarriorsfan]

"But he pointed out that that skill is not very valuable in the style of offense the Dubs now play. Clealry that is true since Green and Speights get the minutes Lee used to get."

Again, then why do the Warriors post up Shaun Livingston a lot during the games? If Lee played, he'd score around the basket all the time. His ability to use either hand around the basket now seems to be taken for granted. If Green gets hurt or if they choose to play Lee more, they'll use the abilities he has to enhance the Warriors chances of winning. He's not going to start jacking up 3-pointers just because that's a big part of the Warriors game. He'll do "David Lee", which is not too shabby other than his defense. Lee's lack of defense does not negate the offensive and rebounding attributes that he has.

Speights also gets more minutes because of his ability to shoot the ball from 15-20 feet. I was hoping that Lee would work on his outside shot this year, and he actually has. But, his huge drop in playing time hasn't allowed anyone to see if he's progressed much. I suppose in practice he's not been too impressive with his outside shot.

The real reason why the Warriors aren't playing him much is more so related to his age and his big contract. They've decided that he's not going to be in their future plans.

 

[CitySushi]

But he pointed out that that skill is not very valuable in the style of offense the Dubs now play. Clealry that is true since Green and Speights get the minutes Lee used to get.

This is what I was exactly saying. See Below.

"But he pointed out that that skill is not very valuable in the style of offense the Dubs now play. Clealry that is true since Green and Speights get the minutes Lee used to get."

Again, then why do the Warriors post up Shaun Livingston a lot during the games? If Lee played, he'd score around the basket all the time. His ability to use either hand around the basket now seems to be taken for granted. If Green gets hurt or if they choose to play Lee more, they'll use the abilities he has to enhance the Warriors chances of winning. He's not going to start jacking up 3-pointers just because that's a big part of the Warriors game. He'll do "David Lee", which is not too shabby other than his defense. Lee's lack of defense does not negate the offensive and rebounding attributes that he has.

Speights also gets more minutes because of his ability to shoot the ball from 15-20 feet. I was hoping that Lee would work on his outside shot this year, and he actually has. But, his huge drop in playing time hasn't allowed anyone to see if he's progressed much. I suppose in practice he's not been too impressive with his outside shot.

The real reason why the Warriors aren't playing him much is more so related to his age and his big contract. They've decided that he's not going to be in their future plans.

I appreciate everything David has done for us in the past, but he's simply not playing because he's not effective in the Warriors style of play, both offensively and defensively. Saying that he's not getting any run because of his age and contract is simply not true. If anything, the Warriors would want to showcase David Lee in order to move him in the off season. Not playing him reduces his value and diminishes the return the Warriors can get for him.

I was pointing out that David's interior scoring is not a plus for him when it comes to trying to get minutes in our offense. In addition Lee's defensive rebounding is not a plus either for him in getting minutes. Green is no slouch either with 8 rebounds a game.

What I'm saying is that according to the principles, both offensively and defensively, there's no point in playing David. Offensively, the Warriors don't utilize any iso-posts, with the rare exception of Shaun Livingston. Lee does not offer what the Warriors need. The Warriors use a motion based offensive system. This is exactly why the Warriors are one of the top teams in the league in points in the paint, because they don't need an isolation post player to command a double team. Lee is a good passer, but Draymond is better. Lee is better in the post, but it doesn't compare to Draymond's ability to stretch the floor. Draymond can push the ball in transition. Defensively, it's not even close. Draymond's job on defense is do everything from guard centers to point guards. David Lee has trouble guarding anyone.

I don't want to make this about Dray vs. Lee, because realistically, it's not even close.

Let's compare Lee vs. Speights. Lee doesn't get minutes over Speights because again, what Speights does for this team, there's nothing that Lee does that is superior to what is needed from Speights. He plays over Lee because of his ability to space the floor with the second unit. When Livingston heads in the post, you need another big to be able to stretch out the defense, otherwise the posting of Livingston would be redundant.

The Warriors post Shaun Livingston because he's a 6'7" point guard, guarded by the other teams PG's who are usually at least a good 4 inches shorter than him, if not more. They post Shaun because he's got tremendous vision and his ability to pass is excellent. If the opposition doubles, Shaun easily can kick the pass out and hit the open man. If they don't, Shaun is simply big enough to just turn around and shoot over the shorter guards. This is worlds different than a 6'9" David Lee trying to post up other like-sized power forwards.

 

[Tai Chi≈Surfing]

That crossover Steph threw down on CP3 was a thing of beauty.... people are still talking about it...and will be for some time.

Yes, DLee will be a vital cog in the Dubs wheel for the post season.

 

[GregWarriorsfan]

"I was pointing out that David's interior scoring is not a plus for him when it comes to trying to get minutes in our offense. In addition Lee's defensive rebounding is not a plus either for him in getting minutes. Green is no slouch either with 8 rebounds a game."

So, are you backtracking on your comment which read ""Draymond is superior to everything David can contribute to this team. There's simply no denying that"?

You didn't sound all that confident about that rebounding stat. Also, whatever PER is, Lee's is higher. he's 5th best, Green is 6th best. They are even in FT shooting, but Lee's would likely be higher with more playing time.

Listen, I love Draymond Green. He's probably my second favorite Warrior to Curry. I could go on and on about things he contributes to the team. I just think your comment was a bit strong in comparing the two players. I don't know of any other Warrior who is "superior to everything" as compared to another Warrior player. As good as Curry and Thompson are, neither is better "at everything" then any of the other Warrior players. I understand that the "can contribute to this team" concept changes the argument up a bit because of the Dubs' style of play, but I also believe in allowing a player to use his strengths when he's in the game....just as the Warriors change their style of game for Livingston so that he can post up.

"This is worlds different than a 6'9" David Lee trying to post up other like-sized power forwards."

Except that Lee is a better post-up player than Livingston. The stats throughout the years bear this out. Most players do not have the array of moves that Lee has, nor the ambidextrous skills of Lee. That makes the match-ups favor Lee more so. He also draws more fouls on his post-up moves because the defense doesn't know which way he's going to go. Lee also leads Livingston in FG%, .519 to .500, and he's not shooting outside shots to get that .519 either.

I'm ready to drop it if you are. I'm hungry.