Chipper Jones, Jim Thome, Vlad Guerrero and Trevor Hoffman inducted into the HOF

[SlinkyRedfoot]

So next year we get a reliever and a DH, the greatest to play each position.

Oh, @Rock Strongo!

soxfan says the greatest DH ever isn't getting into the HOF until his last year of eligibility! What does that say about that juiced up, bedazzled freak's chances of being a first ballot HOFer?

 

[DirtDirtDirt]

Trevor Hoffman has a good looking family, really hot wife

Dont think he's a HOF'er tho

 

[DirtDirtDirt]

Oh, @Rock Strongo!

soxfan says the greatest DH ever isn't getting into the HOF until his last year of eligibility! What does that say about that juiced up, bedazzled freak's chances of being a first ballot HOFer?

If Ortiz gets in, a new system needs to be put in place.....Enough of these writers picking and choosing which juicers get it........Sorry, I dont believe Bagwell, Biggio and Vlad were "clean" players

 

[DirtDirtDirt]

Final Tally:

Chipper Jones: 97.2% (11th highest all time)
Vladimir Guerrero: 92.9% (+21.2% over 2017)
Jim Thome: 89.8%
Trevor Hoffman: 79.9% (+5.9%)


Edgar Martinez: 70.4% (+11.8) 1 year left of eligibility
Mike Mussina: 63.5% (+11.7) 5 years left
Roger Clemens: 57.3% (+3.2) 4 years left
Barry Bonds: 56.4% (+2.6) 4 years left
Curt Schilling: 51.2% (+6.2) 4 years left
Omar Vizquel: 37.0%
Larry Walker: 34.1% (+12.2) 2 years left
Fred McGriff: 23.2% (+1.5) 1 year left
Manny Ramirez: 22.0% (-1.8) 8 years left
Jeff Kent: 14.5% (-2.2) 5 years left
Gary Sheffield: 11.1% (-2.2) 6 years left
Billy Wagner: 11.1% (+0.9) 7 years left
Scott Rolen: 10.2%
Sammy Sosa: 7.8% (-0.8) 4 years left
Andruw Jones: 7.3%


Jamie Moyer: 2.4%
Johan Santana: 2.4%
Johnny Damon: 1.9%
Hideki Matsui: 0.9%
Chris Carpenter: 0.5%
Kerry Wood: 0.5%
Livan Hernandez: 0.2%
Carlos Lee: 0.2%

Good point this morning on Edgar

hypothetically, if the AL didnt have the DH, Edgar would have been an average first basemen his entire career, maybe even below average, and would have been a first ballot lock to get in the HOF

Makes ya wonder if the DH thing is a bit overblown

 

[SlinkyRedfoot]

If Ortiz gets in, a new system needs to be put in place.....Enough of these writers picking and choosing which juicers get it........Sorry, I dont believe Bagwell, Biggio and Vlad were "clean" players

I tend to think that Ortiz will get in. I just have a hard time believing that he'll be a first ballot as someone that was a DH and a PED user.

 

[soxfan1468927]

Oh, @Rock Strongo!

soxfan says the greatest DH ever isn't getting into the HOF until his last year of eligibility! What does that say about that juiced up, bedazzled freak's chances of being a first ballot HOFer?

Perception. I think Ortiz gets in first ballot because I think Clemens and Bonds get in the year before his 1st year.

 

[soxfan1468927]

Good point this morning on Edgar

hypothetically, if the AL didnt have the DH, Edgar would have been an average first basemen his entire career, maybe even below average, and would have been a first ballot lock to get in the HOF

Makes ya wonder if the DH thing is a bit overblown

I just think Edgar, even being a DH, was valuable enough as a hitter to get in. And I take DH into account. Fact is, he didn't play 1st base.

 

[SlinkyRedfoot]

Perception. I think Ortiz gets in first ballot because I think Clemens and Bonds get in the year before his 1st year.

That would certainly go a long way overcome Ortiz's PED usage as it relates to his inclusion in the HOF. When we started this "debate," Ortiz would have been the first DH and the first suspected PED user to make the hall. Obviously, as those barriers come down, it looks better and better for Big Papi.

Still, if -- by your measure -- the greatest DH (without PED suspicion) doesn't get in until his last year of eligibility, why are you confident that Ortiz would be first ballot?

There's no doubt in my mind that Ortiz's personality and postseason heroics put him markedly above Martinez, I'm just not ready to definitively say that he'll be a 1st ballot guy. He might; we'll see.

 

[Rex Racer]

Is Rice gonna put the strap-on and go to work on you if you admit he didn't hit well on the road?

I get it - you don't wanna make him mad..

You're an idiot and you're embarrassing yourself.

 

[soxfan1468927]

That would certainly go a long way overcome Ortiz's PED usage as it relates to his inclusion in the HOF. When we started this "debate," Ortiz would have been the first DH and the first suspected PED user to make the hall. Obviously, as those barriers come down, it looks better and better for Big Papi.

Still, if -- by your measure -- the greatest DH (without PED suspicion) doesn't get in until his last year of eligibility, why are you confident that Ortiz would be first ballot?

There's no doubt in my mind that Ortiz's personality and postseason heroics put him markedly above Martinez, I'm just not ready to definitively say that he'll be a 1st ballot guy. He might; we'll see.

Well I said I think, which doesn't mean I'm calling him a definite 1st ballot guy.

And the reason being that it might take longer to pop that DH cherry, but once it's popped it's a lot less painful to let him in. Okay I got weird there.

 

[msgkings322]

Yup but there is just so much value in defense no matter where it is. Considering the offensive era in which Vizquel played, and his competition at shortstop throughout his career, his offensive numbers aren't good enough and his defensive value doesn't make up the gap.

Eye test though. Omar was a HOFer to me.

 

[soxfan1468927]

Eye test though. Omar was a HOFer to me.

That's fine. He wasn't for me.

 

[DirtDirtDirt]

That's fine. He wasn't for me.

Me either

"oh no, bases juiced with Vizquel coming up"


No, dont remember ever having that feeling, quite the opposite probably

 

[StanMarsh51]

You're an idiot and you're embarrassing yourself.

Using the 'I watch the games, therefore I can evaluate his entire career objectively' is the real embarrassing thing here...

Dumbest shit one could say when it comes to a HOF argument, and you said it....

 

[SlinkyRedfoot]

Eye test though. Omar was a HOFer to me.

That's fine. He wasn't for me.

Me either

"oh no, bases juiced with Vizquel coming up"


No, dont remember ever having that feeling, quite the opposite probably

I'd have taken this a lot more seriously, and petitioned for Vizquel's inclusion had this discussion taken place before he showed up to his Indians HOF induction ceremony at The Jake wearing a fucking blouse.

 

[DirtDirtDirt]

I'd have taken this a lot more seriously, and petitioned for Vizquel's inclusion had this discussion taken place before he showed up to his Indians HOF induction ceremony at The Jake wearing a fucking blouse.

LMFAO

 

[navamind]

Rice was feared more by the worms in the dirt than pitchers.

Johan Santana got as many votes as Jamie Moyer.

I wouldn't have voted for Santana, but that's insane.

Agreed. Santana at least pitched like a HOFer for a while even if his career is too short.

 

[navamind]

I'd have taken this a lot more seriously, and petitioned for Vizquel's inclusion had this discussion taken place before he showed up to his Indians HOF induction ceremony at The Jake wearing a fucking blouse.

LMAO

 

[soxfan1468927]

I'd have taken this a lot more seriously, and petitioned for Vizquel's inclusion had this discussion taken place before he showed up to his Indians HOF induction ceremony at The Jake wearing a fucking blouse.

Holy shit usually I don't ACTUALLY bust out laughing. Unless Dirt claims he's getting it regular from his wife.

That's golden

 

[SlinkyRedfoot]

Holy shit usually I don't ACTUALLY bust out laughing. Unless Dirt claims he's getting it regular from his wife.

That's golden

Funniest bit about this to me is that I'm not a homophobe. If Omar was gay, I'd be happy for him and say, "my, look at that beautiful blouse he's wearing." But he's not. He's married, and I just can't abide a straight dude dressing like that.