Ongoing NHL Thread Part IV - A New Hope

[forty_three]

yah Im for compensatory picks but I also feel its the the players right to wait it out and sign with a team other than the team that drafted him. Sucks for that teams fans but its in the cba so ...

My feeling is if the person doesn't want to play for my team, fuck 'em.


That feeling changes *after* they have signed a contract.

 

[Duke of Douchington]

Drafts in general are rather inhumane - "Oh, hey, you're talented. We're going to let you play for us but you're going to move where we tell you to move and our lawyers have negotiated it so that you're stuck there for at least 6 years unless your employers decide they don't want you anymore and trade you elsewhere at their discretion".

Name one other industry on earth that functions like this.

I guess if you look at it that way.

Or you could look at it like, any employer makes the rules as they see fit. If you apply for a job, you understand you will work during business hours, under business rules, at a business location. NHL draftees are employees looking for a job at a business. You don't have the ability to tell the people signing your checks that you will play by your own rules.

 

[Bloody Brian Burke]

I guess if you look at it that way.

Or you could look at it like, any employer makes the rules as they see fit. If you apply for a job, you understand you will work during business hours, under business rules, at a business location. NHL draftees are employees looking for a job at a business. You don't have the ability to tell the people signing your checks that you will play by your own rules.

They could if the PA grew a spine.

 

[forty_three]

I guess if you look at it that way.

Or you could look at it like, any employer makes the rules as they see fit. If you apply for a job, you understand you will work during business hours, under business rules, at a business location. NHL draftees are employees looking for a job at a business. You don't have the ability to tell the people signing your checks that you will play by your own rules.

You kind of do, by not agreeing to go play for them. I've turned down jobs because I didn't like certain policies, as is my choice. It would be different if I accepted the job and then said "WAAAH! This isn't fair!" At that point, you only have yourself to blame.

Being drafted by a team basically just means they got the first shot at hiring you (in the employment analogy). I think players should be able to choose not to accept. After they do accept, then they need to shut up and deal.

And they should understand that choosing not to accept is often pretty stupid as all teams pretty much have the same rules. But they should still get that choice.

 

[BGDave]

However, a player who does not like the team's rules is prevented from applying for a job somewhere else. The restraint of trade argument blah, blah, blah.

 

[KennyBanyeah]

However, a player who does not like the team's rules is prevented from applying for a job somewhere else. The restraint of trade argument blah, blah, blah.

He's free to try the SHL, KHL, Finnish League, Deutche League, Switzerland and Italy. Perhaps the player will prefer the "rules" over there.

 

[Nasty_Magician]

Sorry if posted.

 

[Duke of Douchington]

You kind of do, by not agreeing to go play for them. I've turned down jobs because I didn't like certain policies, as is my choice. It would be different if I accepted the job and then said "WAAAH! This isn't fair!" At that point, you only have yourself to blame.

Being drafted by a team basically just means they got the first shot at hiring you (in the employment analogy). I think players should be able to choose not to accept. After they do accept, then they need to shut up and deal.

And they should understand that choosing not to accept is often pretty stupid as all teams pretty much have the same rules. But they should still get that choice.

The NHL isn't the only hockey business to make a career as a hockey player.

If you don't like the NHL's rules, you can hop on one of them Russian cargo jets or be a walking billboard on the ice in Vienna.


^^ wizard

 

[jstewismybastardson]

 

[BGDave]

He's free to try the SHL, KHL, Finnish League, Deutche League, Switzerland and Italy. Perhaps the player will prefer the "rules" over there.

Fair comment.

 

[dash]

Sorry if posted.

In other words, no NHL GM was dumb enough to agree to my outrageous salary demands, so I'm going back to mother Russia.

 

[mattola]

Drafts in general are rather inhumane - "Oh, hey, you're talented. We're going to let you play for us but you're going to move where we tell you to move and our lawyers have negotiated it so that you're stuck there for at least 6 years unless your employers decide they don't want you anymore and trade you elsewhere at their discretion".

Name one other industry on earth that functions like this.

Then go work the factory or another industry in which city you want to

 

[puckhead]

Matty will be able to put his Garth Butcher jersey out of the closet if this comes to pass

Garth Butcher played street hockey with some of us neighbourhood kids back in the day, and it was the coolest thing ever.


/cool story bro

 

[Bloody Brian Burke]

Then go work the factory or another industry in which city you want to

Right, I forgot our democracies don't allow free movement of labour.

 

[KennyBanyeah]

Then go work the factory or another industry in which city you want to

Or as I said, the KHL is always looking for people. The NHL is a corporation. You don't like their conditions of employment? Move on to the next corporation.

 

[forty_three]

Or as I said, the KHL is always looking for people. The NHL is a corporation. You don't like their conditions of employment? Move on to the next corporation.

In this analogy, wouldn't each team be it's own corporation? The NHL is the industry.

You're not signing a contract with the NHL, you sign with the team. The union supports the workers industry wide.

 

[KennyBanyeah]

In this analogy, wouldn't each team be it's own corporation? The NHL is the industry.

You're not signing a contract with the NHL, you sign with the team. The union supports the workers industry wide.

Nope. The industry is pro hockey. SHL, KHL, Finish league, Swiss league and the NHL are corporations that are a part of that industry.

Each team is a franchise of one corporation (the NHL). Franchised corporations have broad conditions of employment that apply to all franchises. Just like the NHL.

 

[Bloody Brian Burke]

Nope. The industry is pro hockey. SHL, KHL, Finish league, Swiss league and the NHL are corporations that are a part of that industry.

Each team is a franchise of one corporation (the NHL). Franchised corporations have broad conditions of employment that apply to all franchises. Just like the NHL.

Just one little problem - the NHL is a corporation whose product is its employees. If its employees suddenly decided to collectively bargain for freedom of movement from day 1 of their employment the only thing the NHL could do is lock them out indefinitely and hope waiting them out brings them around.

I don’t think that’ll ever happen (I’m guessing the players will be going all out to eliminate the cap and replace it with a luxury tax next CBA) but it could if they really were against it.

 

[KennyBanyeah]

Just one little problem - the NHL is a corporation whose product is its employees. If its employees suddenly decided to collectively bargain for freedom of movement from day 1 of their employment the only thing the NHL could do is lock them out indefinitely and hope waiting them out brings them around.

I don’t think that’ll ever happen (I’m guessing the players will be going all out to eliminate the cap and replace it with a luxury tax next CBA) but it could if they really were against it.

This is all true. However plenty of corporations collapse without their employees. In most (not all) cases 90% of those employess are replaceable given enough time. The NHL is slightly different in that regard. But they can strike all they want of course. Lots of guys aren't going to like going from $5M to 0-$250,000 per year though.

Financially speaking the owners are pretty much immune to work stoppages, given that the NHL is not exactly a huge money maker for billionaires.

 

[Bloody Brian Burke]

Lots of guys aren't going to like going from $5M to 0-$250,000 per year though.

Financially speaking the owners are pretty much immune to work stoppages, given that the NHL is not exactly a huge money maker for billionaires.

Indeed, this is why especially the lockout of 04-05 ended. Especially in a field where most guys have a 5-10 year period where they make most of their money, giving up a year of that time is kinda bonkers.