Wilson has skills

[MrS]

our cap is toast anyways, as is the team in general.
if he wants to be traded he will be, its really that simple. and he wont be losing any money, he will be signing a long term contract for even more money.

 

[returnofjakedog]

our cap is toast anyways, as is the team in general.
if he wants to be traded he will be, its really that simple. and he wont be losing any money, he will be signing a long term contract for even more money.

That makes no sense even if we deregard the not true "our cap is toast" comment since we currently have over $55 million in space. It true that we have slots to fill though.
Tell me how he can force a trade without losing any money? What will he do? Sit out and lose his $19 million base salary and $5 million roster bonus, and possibly even the $22 million + $5 million the next year? Has there ever been any indication at all that Russell would ever do anything along those lines? Anything?
No. Because it is a ridiculous notion. Revisit this next offseason when his cap hit would be down to $13 million. Then there might actually be a chance of something happening.

 

[MrS]

You think the team will play hardball and try to force him to stay, i disagree. If he asks for a trade he is very likely gone, some team will step up and make a big offer. It will more than likely include an extention which will provide some cap relief that you're so worried about

 

[returnofjakedog]

You think the team will play hardball and try to force him to stay, i disagree. If he asks for a trade he is very likely gone, some team will step up and make a big offer. It will more than likely include an extention which will provide some cap relief that you're so worried about

Again, has Russell ever indicated any of this as a possibility? The answer is again a resounding NO.

The rest of your post still doesn't make sense. Even if the Seahawk's did trade him there would be no cap relief via an extension from another team. The Seahawks would be responsible for the remaining bonus money. There is no out to push this onto another team.

The Seahawks have over $55 million in cap space but they also only have 33 under contract so eating Russ' remaining $26 million in bonuses by trading him would hamstring the team, leave them without a QB (and no cap space to get one except through the draft) and force an immediate rebuild. PC will be 71 in Sept and he has exactly zero interest in a rebuild.

All of this has been discussed and understood by the team. If Russ really wanted out and was going to force a trade then it would be a known issue. If that were the case then PC would probably retire immediately.

These rumors are baseless speculation, same as last year. It is possibĺe next offseason but this offseason just doesn't work both financially and personal-wise.

 

[HaroldSeattle]

You think the team will play hardball and try to force him to stay, i disagree. If he asks for a trade he is very likely gone, some team will step up and make a big offer. It will more than likely include an extention which will provide some cap relief that you're so worried about

What usual happens when a player demands a trade is his trade value usual tanks immediately and it makes a trade that much more difficult to do especially if a large sum of dead money is involve. Has Wilson played with the idea of getting trade? Likely yes, but then the reality of which teams are desirable landing spots, in need at QB and can afford a expensive acquisition comes into play and is there even such a team? Have the Seahawks played with the idea of trading him? Likely, but a few inquiries let’s them know that it such a trade would work against them so that’s that. So here we are and whatever changes are coming it will not include Wilson getting traded, or Pete getting fired, or JS getting fired. Not this year, so buckle up and hope the Seahawks can bounce back or just be miserable next season starting now. Your choice.

 

[MrS]

a sign and trade extension to relieve the cap hit would be a requirement

These rumors are baseless speculation, same as last year. It is possibĺe next offseason but this offseason just doesn't work both financially and personal-wise.

this is entirely his fault, he has not denied any of it and has said multiple things publicly that has sown doubt about whether he expects to be here in the near future. his agent putting out a list of teams he would wave his trade clause for really didnt help either.

What usual happens when a player demands a trade is his trade value usual tanks immediately and it makes a trade that much more difficult to do especially if a large sum of dead money is involve.

adams was a problem child for a few years and demanded a trade and look how that worked out for the Jets.

Has Wilson played with the idea of getting trade? Likely yes, but then the reality of which teams are desirable landing spots, in need at QB and can afford a expensive acquisition comes into play and is there even such a team? Have the Seahawks played with the idea of trading him? Likely, but a few inquiries let’s them know that it such a trade would work against them so that’s that. So here we are and whatever changes are coming it will not include Wilson getting traded, or Pete getting fired, or JS getting fired. Not this year, so buckle up and hope the Seahawks can bounce back or just be miserable next season starting now. Your choice.

maybe, we will see. I have very low expectations for next year regardless of what happens.

 

[returnofjakedog]

a sign and trade extension to relieve the cap hit would be a requirement

What are you talking about?? If they are trading Wilson then THE NEW TEAM would be the one doing the extension, not the Seahawks. It would do absolutely nothing to relieve the dead money cap hit.

this is entirely his fault, he has not denied any of it and has said multiple things publicly that has sown doubt about whether he expects to be here in the near future. his agent putting out a list of teams he would wave his trade clause for really didnt help either.

Wilson has stated nothing of the sort this season or offseason. You are referring to last year's offseason, which I don't see has any bearing now.

adams was a problem child for a few years and demanded a trade and look how that worked out for the Jets.

Regardless of that situation it has nothing to do with Wilson's situation. I have no idea why you are bringing it up as it is completely irrelevant to the current subject.

maybe, we will see. I have very low expectations for next year regardless of what happens.

We will have by far the easiest schedule we have had in over a decade, even with the NFCW games. Pencil in 10 wins as a low, and go up from there (unless Wilson gets injured again).

 

[blstoker]

No, man, I’m focused on where I’m at right now. Just to be in Seattle, it’s been a blessing to play 10 years there, so hopefully we get to win more Super Bowls there. That’s my focus, that’s my plan and that’s where my head’s at.

I think that part of it is the media likes to expand some things as part of the game, part of entertainment, part of sports. You know, for me, the reality about sports is things always change, they're always evolving, always changing. So for me, I'm just staying focused on the moment, staying focused on where I am right now.

It’s part of stuff that happens . . . It is what it is. It’s what makes the game fun . . . I’m focused on Seattle right now, though. I’m focused on where I’m at. But yeah, you see that in any sport, I think a lot of players move and change, but for me, I’m focused on Seattle and where I’m at right now.

I've been fortunate to be able to play 10 amazing years in Seattle, my hope and goal is to be back there and keep winning there. That's the vision, that's the goal. That's always been it, never been anything different. I want to win three more Super Bowls. That’s my focus, is to get back and win it again and for us to overcome all the obstacles. There’s nothing more fun than that.

Yeah, that’s my hope. My hope’s not just to fulfill it. Hopefully, I get to play here for 20 years in my career. Will that happen? I don’t know, but that’s my prayer, that’s my hope.

Obviously, I love Seattle. This is a place that I’ve loved every day, every moment… I love this place, I love the space, I love where my mind’s at, I love where our team’s at.

These are all quotes by Russell Wilson about playing in Seattle. These have ranged from Dec. 11 til yesterday. That's two months of him saying he wants to be in Seattle and expects to be in Seattle, and is focused on being in Seattle and still people claiming that he isn't saying anything to dispell the rumors that he wants to be traded.

 

[MrS]

What are you talking about?? If they are trading Wilson then THE NEW TEAM would be the one doing the extension, not the Seahawks. It would do absolutely nothing to relieve the dead money cap hit.

we actually save $11m if we trade him pre june 1st, $24m if we trade him after june 1st.

Wilson has stated nothing of the sort this season or offseason. You are referring to last year's offseason, which I don't see has any bearing now.

of course it does, after having a losing season I can imagine he would want out even more than he ever has. he didnt sound very certain on this clip:

Regardless of that situation it has nothing to do with Wilson's situation. I have no idea why you are bringing it up as it is completely irrelevant to the current subject.

I was refuting his point that players who make a fuss reduce their trade value. adams is solid evidence that it, in fact, does not.

We will have by far the easiest schedule we have had in over a decade, even with the NFCW games. Pencil in 10 wins as a low, and go up from there (unless Wilson gets injured again).

this team wont be contending for anything, its going to be a shit show. its likely going to be the last gasp before its blown up.

 

[returnofjakedog]

we actually save $11m if we trade him pre june 1st, $24m if we trade him after june 1st.

That is not correct.
The $11 million in "savings" would be a post June 1st trade (not before June 1st), and all that would mean is that the $19 million base salary + the $5 million roster bonus - the $13 million pro-rated signing bonus = $11 million. But it would still be a dead money cap hit of $13 million over 2 years for a total of $26 million.

of course it does, after having a losing season I can imagine he would want out even more than he ever has. he didnt sound very certain on this clip:

........as opposed to the article from this morning in SI?

Russell Wilson Wants to Stay in Seattle and Win ‘Three More Super Bowls’

The quarterback said he wants to stay with the Seahawks and bring more championships to Seattle.

www.si.com

"I’ve been fortunate to be able to play 10 amazing years in Seattle,” Wilson said “My hope and goal is to be back there and keep winning there. That’s the vision, that’s the goal. That’s always been it, never been anything different.”

I was refuting his point that players who make a fuss reduce their trade value. adams is solid evidence that it, in fact, does not.

Ok. I still don't see the specific relevance to the Wilson situation, particularly since he doesn't want to be traded.

this team wont be contending for anything, its going to be a shit show. its likely going to be the last gasp before its blown up.

You've been predicting this same thing for many years now. Eventually you will be correct (broken clock and all that) but considering the schedule it will not be 2022-23 barring catastrophic injury issues.

 

[MrS]

That is not correct.
The $11 million in "savings" would be a post June 1st trade (not before June 1st), and all that would mean is that the $19 million base salary + the $5 million roster bonus - the $13 million pro-rated signing bonus = $11 million. But it would still be a dead money cap hit of $13 million over 2 years for a total of $26 million.

PRE-6/1 TRADE 2022 Dead Cap: $26,000,000 2022 Cap Savings: $11,000,000
POST-6/1 TRADE 2022 Dead Cap: $13,000,000 2023 Dead Cap: $13,000,000 2022 Cap Savings: $24,000,000

its absolutely true, there will be dead money but we will save significantly against the cap if he is traded. its not going to wreck our cap like you said.

........as opposed to the article from this morning in SI?

Russell Wilson Wants to Stay in Seattle and Win ‘Three More Super Bowls’

The quarterback said he wants to stay with the Seahawks and bring more championships to Seattle.

www.si.com

looks like the same rehashed stuff

Ok. I still don't see the specific relevance to the Wilson situation, particularly since he doesn't want to be traded.

thats on you

You've been predicting this same thing for many years now. Eventually you will be correct (broken clock and all that) but considering the schedule it will not be 2022-23 barring catastrophic injury issues.

they havent contended in years, sure they won games but they never had a chance in the playoffs. next year will be the same even if we eek out 10 wins which I just dont see happening, not with all the holes and lack of cap space and no first round pick.

 

[returnofjakedog]

PRE-6/1 TRADE 2022 Dead Cap: $26,000,000 2022 Cap Savings: $11,000,000
POST-6/1 TRADE 2022 Dead Cap: $13,000,000 2023 Dead Cap: $13,000,000 2022 Cap Savings: $24,000,000

Again, I never denied the numbers. What I said was there will still be $26 million in dead money. I already did the numbers several times.

Pushing it past June 1st would be very stupid because then the entire $26 million would be due in '23-24 instead of 2 years at $13 million.

Either way, your proposal leaves the Seahawks with dead money, a squeezed cap, and, more importantly, NO QB!

Do you have ANY plan at all where PC, who is NOT going into rebuild mode will get a QB to replace Wilson?? Anything?
I'd be interested to know what that plan would be.

its absolutely true, there will be dead money but we will save significantly against the cap if he is traded. its not going to wreck our cap like you said.

looks like the same rehashed stuff

thats on you

"On me"?? Wtf are you talking about? Am I the team's new GM or something?

First YOU said that our cap was already ruined, then I point out that we currently have $55 million in cap space but also note we only have 33 players under contract.

Realistically we should have about $20-25 million to fill holes after all (resignings, draft, etc.). You want to cut that to $7 to 12 million by eating $13 million in dead money and you apparently have no plan to fill the QB position. Maybe you think PC is going to trot Geno Smith out there??

they havent contended in years, sure they won games but they never had a chance in the playoffs. next year will be the same even if we eek out 10 wins which I just dont see happening, not with all the holes and lack of cap space and no first round pick.

That is a pretty myopic view.

PC has always said that the seasonal goal is to first get to the playoffs, then it is a "new season". They have accomplished that goal nearly every year except last year. If that isn't good enough for you impeccable standards maybe you should go root for Alabama instead of the NFL where sustained success at the level the Seahawks have done in the last decade.

As far as wins go, the schedule outside of the division is warm butter soft. 10 wins is a low starting point, and 12 is achievable. On the road you have Tampa who are currently without a QB, New Orleans whose HoF coach left and has human turn over machine Winston at QB. Detroit? Lol! At home you get the NY Jets, NY Giants, Denver, and Carolina, none of which has a good QB on their rosters.

Whatever. I'm sure you feel that the Seahawks are far worse than all of those teams, and will lose ALL of their division games? Maybe 0-16?? Lol!

 

[returnofjakedog]

Note: I did misspeak on the dates:
A pre-June 1st trade would leave $26 million in dead money this season, which would bring our effective cap space (after resignings, draft, etc) to essentially zero, while a post June 1st would divide it over 2 years and make it about $12 million remaining and no QB.

So it changes nothing, and if pre-June 1st would actually be worse.

I'd still love to hear your plan. You preach doom and gloom constantly but you have no viable plan other than "blow everything up" and that includes no PC in your book, which isn't even based in reality.

 

[blstoker]

Seattle may want to wait til after June first to spend a lot of their money. There's a good chance that guys like Cameron Jordan will hit the market post June 1, with New Orleans needing to desperately cut their cap. There's a chance that the Saints will need to part ways, or restructure, any combination of these players just to squeak under the cap:

Michael Thomas	$15,350,000	$8,900,000	$250,000	$0	$200,000	$0		$0		$24,700,000		$8,900,000	$15,800,000
Cameron Jordan	$13,600,000	$8,181,250	$300,000	$500,000	$100,000	$500,000		$0		$23,181,250		$8,181,250	$15,000,000
Demario Davis	$7,500,000	$3,500,000	$0	$0	$0	$0		$0		$11,000,000		$3,500,000	$7,500,000
David Onyemata	$7,500,000	$4,670,000	$1,000,000	$0	$0	$0		$0		$13,170,000		$4,670,000	$8,500,000
Malcolm Jenkins	$6,750,000	$3,950,000	$500,000	$500,000	$0	$0		$0		$11,700,000		$3,950,000	$7,750,000
Wil Lutz	$3,400,000	$1,920,000	$200,000	$0	$50,000	$0		$0		$5,570,000		$1,920,000	$3,650,000
James Hurst	$1,825,000	$1,000,000	$500,000	$0	$100,000	$1,000,000		$500,000		$4,425,000		$1,500,000	$2,925,000
Erik McCoy	$2,790,000	$612,378	$0	$0	$0	$0		$0		$3,402,378		$612,378	$2,790,000
J.T. Gray	$1,600,000	$500,000	$400,000	$0	$0	$100,000		$0		$2,600,000		$500,000	$2,100,000
Nick Vannett	$2,600,000	$300,000	$400,000	$0	$0	$0		$1,900,000		$3,300,000		$2,200,000	$1,100,000
Bradley Roby	$9,500,000	$169,475	$500,000	$0	$0	$0		$0		$10,169,475		$169,475	$10,000,000

 

[returnofjakedog]

Seattle may want to wait til after June first to spend a lot of their money. There's a good chance that guys like Cameron Jordan will hit the market post June 1, with New Orleans needing to desperately cut their cap. There's a chance that the Saints will need to part ways, or restructure, any combination of these players just to squeak under the cap:

Michael Thomas	$15,350,000	$8,900,000	$250,000	$0	$200,000	$0		$0		$24,700,000		$8,900,000	$15,800,000
Cameron Jordan	$13,600,000	$8,181,250	$300,000	$500,000	$100,000	$500,000		$0		$23,181,250		$8,181,250	$15,000,000
Demario Davis	$7,500,000	$3,500,000	$0	$0	$0	$0		$0		$11,000,000		$3,500,000	$7,500,000
David Onyemata	$7,500,000	$4,670,000	$1,000,000	$0	$0	$0		$0		$13,170,000		$4,670,000	$8,500,000
Malcolm Jenkins	$6,750,000	$3,950,000	$500,000	$500,000	$0	$0		$0		$11,700,000		$3,950,000	$7,750,000
Wil Lutz	$3,400,000	$1,920,000	$200,000	$0	$50,000	$0		$0		$5,570,000		$1,920,000	$3,650,000
James Hurst	$1,825,000	$1,000,000	$500,000	$0	$100,000	$1,000,000		$500,000		$4,425,000		$1,500,000	$2,925,000
Erik McCoy	$2,790,000	$612,378	$0	$0	$0	$0		$0		$3,402,378		$612,378	$2,790,000
J.T. Gray	$1,600,000	$500,000	$400,000	$0	$0	$100,000		$0		$2,600,000		$500,000	$2,100,000
Nick Vannett	$2,600,000	$300,000	$400,000	$0	$0	$0		$1,900,000		$3,300,000		$2,200,000	$1,100,000
Bradley Roby	$9,500,000	$169,475	$500,000	$0	$0	$0		$0		$10,169,475		$169,475	$10,000,000

Add to the list other teams that are up against the cap and might have to make some cuts: Packers, Rams, Cowboys, Vikings, Giants, Falcons, Titans, Bills, 49ers, Cards.
I'm not saying these teams are unable to keep their players, sign FAs, or fill out their rosters but they (and many other teams) have less effective cap room to work with than Seattle.

 

[MrS]

Note: I did misspeak on the dates:
A pre-June 1st trade would leave $26 million in dead money this season, which would bring our effective cap space (after resignings, draft, etc) to essentially zero, while a post June 1st would divide it over 2 years and make it about $12 million remaining and no QB.

So it changes nothing, and if pre-June 1st would actually be worse.

I'd still love to hear your plan. You preach doom and gloom constantly but you have no viable plan other than "blow everything up" and that includes no PC in your book, which isn't even based in reality.

I am speculating that IF wilson demands a trade he will get it, that is all I am saying here, and that the implications of that on our cap are not as dire as you made it out to be. if we trade him we will be clearing cap space, possibly a lot of cap space. you are too focused on the dead money.

 

[returnofjakedog]

I am speculating that IF wilson demands a trade he will get it, that is all I am saying here, and that the implications of that on our cap are not as dire as you made it out to be. if we trade him we will be clearing cap space, possibly a lot of cap space. you are too focused on the dead money.

.......so answer my question then.

The Seahawks trade Wilson. Depending on date of trade you now have between 0 and $12 million left in cap space after your resigns and draft (but any outside FAs signed would have to be subtracted from the remaining total). You have no starting QB on the roster but are not in rebuild mode and 71 year old PC is trying to make a playoff run.

What is your plan? You have no QB and not a lot of cap space. Signing a decent QB (even if they were available in that price range) would leave you unable to address other areas of need. How are you salvaging the season in accordance with the current plans?

Besides, you were the one that said our cap situation is already trash, and I pointed out that isn't true, but now you've reversed and claimed I am the one who said it is "dire".

We are not tight against the cap. We have a bunch of cap space. But we also have a lot of roster spots to fill, and our cap space does become dire if we traded RW regardless of the date. It would hamstring the team from filling out a competitive roster. That is what my point is.

.....so who is the QB next year if we trade Wilson and how do we sign them?

 

[blstoker]

.....so who is the QB next year if we trade Wilson and how do we sign them?

I was the quarterback for my 6th grade flag football team......

 

[returnofjakedog]

I was the quarterback for my 6th grade flag football team......

Yes! ........but can you hit an out route, and will you work for $12 million or less?

If so, then problem solved!

 

[blstoker]

Yes! ........but can you hit an out route, and will you work for $12 million or less?

If so, then problem solved!

I'll Tom Brady out of that shit and take just $6 million and guarantee the first pick of the draft every year they need me to!!!!